<!--quoteo(post=1698574:date=Jan 26 2009, 08:03 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Jan 26 2009, 08:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698574"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I can't really speak about the gameplay aspects of the skulk mini games that apparently were so popular in the original NS, and how the new resource tower is better or worse, since that's not my area of expertise. However I would warn against bemoaning the potential change or loss of one small gameplay aspect when NS2 might add many more that wouldn't have been possible in the original.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I hope this isn't referring to ambushing, aiming, and the first-person skirmish experience that has been the lifeblood of NS for over five years.
locallyunsceneFeeder of TrollsJoin Date: 2002-12-25Member: 11528Members, Constellation
<!--quoteo(post=1698574:date=Jan 26 2009, 08:03 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Jan 26 2009, 08:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698574"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->In the design phase of the Resource Tower, there are a lot of considerations to make. How to tie it in aesthetically to the other marine structures and general look that has been developed for NS2. What kinds of interesting deploy animations and active animations can it have? What does it look like from top down Commander Mode view? Does it visually convey the information of what it does, even to people not familiar with the original NS? Part of the design aesthetic of NS2 is also a sort of blending of looks between the aliens and marines. Most of the marine structures are designed to have a distinctly animal feel to the way they look, and I think this gives them much more personality then most of the original NS 1 designs. ... As far as the new resource tower looking too low tech and not futuristic enough in comparison to the old, I can understand where you are coming from. However, the marine machinery was always meant to have a low tech industrial look. To a large extent the lack of detail we could fit into a model for the halflife engine meant that the models lacked a lot of the mechanical details that I would have liked to show. Exposed hydraulics, cables, etc. Therefore, because the technology behind how the machines actually worked is missing from the NS models, they appear in many ways to be more futuristic. I also wanted to make sure that the NS2 machines all felt plausible in their mechanical working, and not just have parts appear out of nowhere as it plays it's animation (an example is comparing the old transformers to the new ones in the movie, where parts just appear, grow, bend and do whatever just so it can transform and look cool).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Thanks for your response(to the post that no longer exists). I liked the more alien and futuristic appearance of the old RT, but I understand why you are trying to move away from the direction toward more towards plausible and less towards insect looking while retaining as much of the insect look as possible. I'll still prefer the old RT, but I think the new one will fit in fine with your overall concept "theme".
schkorpioI can mspaintJoin Date: 2003-05-23Member: 16635Members
edited January 2009
<!--quoteo(post=1698574:date=Jan 27 2009, 11:03 AM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Jan 27 2009, 11:03 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698574"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->There are going to be designs that almost everyone loves, and ones that almost every one hate, but if, at the end, we have a fun game, that looks good, and has some really cool stuff in it, then we've done our job.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
to be honest, if ns2 shipped with all of the ns1 art assets but new gameplay, i'd still pay full price
i dunno why people are so picky, its not like there are many good games out there right now
also how would this crane stand up to an onos charge? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> <!--quoteo(post=1698574:date=Jan 27 2009, 11:03 AM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Jan 27 2009, 11:03 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698574"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->[attachment=35874:crane.jpg]<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Coming back two days later I have to say I like it even more then the siege now. Comparing it to the original RT it looks much more like military equipment. The original looked to much like it were part of it's surroundings. There is much more a unit feel to it now. I get strong images of a drop ship, a bit more trucky then the one in Aliens, with these all piled up next to the rest of the equipment in it's cargo haul. And I like that the colors stand out from the surroundings as the they change but the RT doesn't.
The deploy animation is going to be killer. Cory talked about the boxes on the side expanding. Makes me wonder if they expand over time as it fills up or if they pump in and out. I can't really see the whole machine pump up and down so I guess if they don't pump in and out there won't be much more then the tube moving and some screen animation. I don't really want to know now though. Might be another gameplay element if they indicate how full it is.
I have to say the speed you guys move forward on this game is really fast and we know you will gameplay test the game to bits before you decide to release. I for one welcome that.
the design just doesnt look like its been built in a space-age, where human beeings fly around in battleship and created big spacestations (but i have to say the concept RT looks besser than the 3d one)
another thing i dont understand or would like to say is, marines built the metal-circle on the floors where the resources are beeing "digged" from, right? so why does the RT not dock onto this -platform-? wouldnt that be smarter than just standing over it like a table?
I worked in a nuclear power plant on an aircraft carrier. The technology that the military uses, I mean the technology for the machinery, is so outdated it is ridiculous. Because the military uses a contract system, things like aircraft carriers, which were contracted for in the 50's and 60's, have to use the parts specified in the contracts. Or else they're not following the contract, at which point they have to renegotiate [read: pay more]. So the military uses equipment designed in the 40's and 50's and tested in the 50's and 60's on it's "state of the art" aircraft carriers.
What I'm saying is, unless the game is set thousands of years in the future, the military machinery <b>should</b> have a very generic, utilitarian look to it. And, another thing I would like to point out to the art director, is to look at a picture of the interior of an aircraft carrier. Or any Navy ship. All of the electrical wiring, all of the steam piping, all of the fire suppression systems is exposed. It looks like it makes it more vulnerable at first, but it is like that for damage control purposes.
If a skulk bites through a metal plate and punctures a hose, to repair it you would have to remove the metal plate, replace the hose, then fabricate a new plate and replace that as well. By routing cabling and hoses on the outside of the structure, yes it makes it more vulnerable, but it also makes it easier to repair.
Understandably we've all grown very fond of this game, and it's universe, and may feel that we have somewhat of a stake in it's evolution. We all want to see it's successor grow up and be just as (if not more) immersive, engaging and successful as the original. So, understandably, we're all very passionate in our replies when we believe something is being done "wrong"; we all want to see this done right. We criticize because we love. Not only that, NS1's reign has all but ended, and I imagine with all of this teasing of images and videos, we're all so eager to jump back into the unique experience that was NS, we'll take what we can get, and we'll take as much as we can out of it. If a rendered image is what we're given, we're going to drain it dry, one way or another!
But I don't recall anyone giving this much criticism to the original design of NS1. No one complained that the original turrets looked like they wouldn't be able to withstand a marine walking past it really fast, much less a skulk rush. No one demanded a bigger mouth on the Onos that impossibly devours heavy marines whole. No one asked for a minibar to be installed in the Command Console because it seemed implausible that a soldier condemning people to death on a daily basis wouldn't develop a drinking habit. We were presented with a game, and we played it because it was immersive and engaging, and beat the hell out of Counter-Strike! I'm not telling anyone not to criticize; I'm just saying maybe things aren't being looked at in perspective.
Personally, I'm just grateful that you guys (The Dev Team) are sharing the experience/process with the public every step of the way. As an aspiring game designer in Central Florida, where there isn't ###### in regards to game design (don't say EA), I appreciate and look forward to the inside look at the development process that you take the time out of your schedule to present to us. Every bit of information is priceless to me. Hell, you could have made the resource node look like a scorpion that hovars without flapping, and I'd still build it, guard it with my life, and then eat it when the teams changed.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->....compact for transporting....<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
PrefixÉirinn go BráchJoin Date: 2006-12-31Member: 59353Members, Constellation
I honestly think the resource tower looks good. The scale of it is fine, it isn't out of proportion at all, like some people seem to say - it is just bigger than the NS1 rt.
The only thing that concerns me in terms of game play is if a skulk can hide their body entirely behind the rt.
In NS1, when a skulk bites an rt it has two choices, to jump on the body and chew or to sit on the ground and chew. The reason a skulk will pick one of the two is because it is inevitable that a marine will come to save that rt. The advantage of the former is that you tend to have more cover, depending on the position of the enemy marine, you can also see through the rt <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />. The advantage of the latter is you can strafe and zwndr while chewing, it also gives you the option for a fast retreat. A marine can shoot a skulk who is using the body for cover because its feet or legs stick out above or to the side of the model, and the marine can just pistol it, a marine can also see a skulk fairly easily when it is chewing it from the ground - in NS1 this has been balanced well, largely down to the maps and positioning of vent/rts/doors etc.
From the limited amount we can see of the resource tower for NS2, it appears that a skulk, that is to say if the skulk is the same size as the one in NS1, would be able to hide its entire body behind the rt while chewing - this would present a serious problem for the NS1 marine, because that would mean he would have to get close to the skulk to kill it, and that is almost certain to kill him, and it seems likely that the ranged vs close combat thing is the same.
I like the new RT, abit clunky and skinny but it has an overall good look. Maybe if it was wider and looked heavier it'd be better looking. Anyways it beats the old RT by miles. Always thought the old RT looked like a crabshaped robotic-kharaa hybrid of some sorts.
I like the new design. The only suggestion I would make for those complaining about the top heaviness, is to maybe just move the legs. Instead of having them connect at the base, move the joint to connect at the top or head of the resource tower. Almost like the large alien sac creature at the end of Half Life 1. The legs at top support the weight of the device below it. It might make it look a little more stable, although I really like the design just the way it is.
Corey definitely has an eye for those little details that make all of us Sci Fi movie nerds gush over.
I just wanted to clarify, I was NOT intending to seem like I was talking down to anybody for having a different opinion. I was however <i>frustrated</i> to keep hearing the same short comments over and over. It reminded vividly of supervisor meetings at Best Buy, where nobody would dare say no to the GM of the store if they wanted to keep their job. I realize that there are differences between both scenerios, and in this case it seems clear that some people genuinely love the design. I don't understand, but I do accept your opinion as every bit as valid as anybody else's. And yes, I realize that I'm rather isolated and a minority (at least on this thread) compared to the majority of the people who responded in complete favor of the resource tower. <i>Of course</i>, everybody is entitled to their own opinion! FFS, I never said they weren't, <i>never</i>! Please show me where I said that ever on this board and I'll apologize for my mistake immediately.
It's not arrogance, it's frustration.
Worse, it seems that more than a few people, <i>including moderators</i>, decided it would appropriate to flame me and call me arrogant without try to understand the motivation behind my word choice or listen to the point I was trying to make. And this is at that same time that you all are practically calling me out at arrogant for expressing a frustrated opinion?! Is that not unfair? I will try to be more aware if my comments could be taken as arrogance in the future, but poor conduct and two threatening e-mails is more than inappropriate as a response.
<!--quoteo(post=1698618:date=Jan 27 2009, 06:42 AM:name=KuBaN)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(KuBaN @ Jan 27 2009, 06:42 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698618"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->We all want to see it's successor grow up and be just as (if not more) immersive, engaging and successful as the original. So, understandably, we're all very passionate in our replies when we believe something is being done "wrong"; we all want to see this done right. We criticize because we love. Not only that, NS1's reign has all but ended, and I imagine with all of this teasing of images and videos, we're all so eager to jump back into the unique experience that was NS, we'll take what we can get, and we'll take as much as we can out of it. If a rendered image is what we're given, we're going to drain it dry, one way or another!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactly! I too realized that all of the negative commentary (mine included) stems from our love for NS. The only reason I give a damn about an exposed hose is because I don't want a single person to doubt how great NS2 is going to be. Personally, I just want to feel like I played some tiny part in the development of NS2, and if I have to point out that the leg of an RT is 2 millimeters too thin, I'll take that opportunity. The developer's attention to the community is excellent and the pace of development is proving the naysayers wrong.
<!--quoteo(post=1698607:date=Jan 27 2009, 07:36 AM:name=c0ke)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(c0ke @ Jan 27 2009, 07:36 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698607"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->another thing i dont understand or would like to say is, marines built the metal-circle on the floors where the resources are beeing "digged" from, right? so why does the RT not dock onto this -platform-? wouldnt that be smarter than just standing over it like a table?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually, the resource nozzle itself (the metal-circle thing on the floor) is part of the environments, and is there already before the marines get there. Which is why it doesn't have any of the marine green, and why the resource tower doesn't have an elaborate means of docking with it. Presumably the resource gathering machines that the workers would use on the Refinery map, for example, would be constructed differently then the marine's own version, or the workers would just connect long hoses directly to the nozzle and plug the other end into a machine, or nearby wall "outlet" to access the nanite energy.
Well, after four or five <u><b>years</b></u> since my last post (the one that wasn't eaten by the forum, anyway) the blog update brought me back.
I agree that it doesn't quite feel right. The legs seem a bit too fragile for the overall appearance... but I have a solution! (Picture attached)
People have critiqued that the legs feel flimsy. So here's my suggestion:
The legs lock into features in the floor. They are not "legs" as much as "fenceposts". Their main job is to protect the tower's center, and their secondary job is to hold the delicate center up off the floor and to act as shock-absorbers.
By adding some small "armor plating" decoration on the legs, the tower takes on a much more gritty military appearance, and it highlights the fact that the legs are acting as barriers/roadblock-pylons. There also remains plenty of room to allow skulks to run around.
<!--quoteo(post=1698663:date=Jan 27 2009, 04:37 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Jan 27 2009, 04:37 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698663"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Actually, the resource nozzle itself (the metal-circle thing on the floor) is part of the environments, and is there already before the marines get there. Which is why it doesn't have any of the marine green, and why the resource tower doesn't have an elaborate means of docking with it. Presumably the resource gathering machines that the workers would use on the Refinery map, for example, would be constructed differently then the marine's own version, or the workers would just connect long hoses directly to the nozzle and plug the other end into a machine, or nearby wall "outlet" to access the nanite energy.
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I like this explanation. It makes sense. As I have familiarity with fire hydrant threads being different in different locations and the problems that causes in needing to have adapters in order to attach the connection with pressure, it makes sense that the marine would have a non-specific, universal adapter unit like this resource tower. Presumably the specific units that would have been used at the facility are non-standardized and thus the RT is needed to make that connection.
Very good. I just hope that backstory-like technical information is included in the game somehow, it would add some cool depth to the NS world and help explain the art you're seeing.
Perhaps this new resource tower design is a next-generation model which is improved in someway? Maybe more efficient in harvesting resources somehow? I don't know what will work within the balance you have for the game so I have no idea where to even begin a suggestion for that...
slayer20Killed a man once.Join Date: 2007-12-13Member: 63157Members, Reinforced - Shadow
Can we get something like a height comparison with the Marine and new RT? Everytime I picture the new RT in my mind, I see it as being big and bulky, but when I actually look at the picture it looks not so big but kind of bulky, and at the same time it does look big. It's really weird...
I seem to have a love/hate relationship with it right now...
slayer20Killed a man once.Join Date: 2007-12-13Member: 63157Members, Reinforced - Shadow
<!--quoteo(post=1698681:date=Jan 27 2009, 11:25 PM:name=Align)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Align @ Jan 27 2009, 11:25 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698681"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I get it to around nipple-height.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If it's that high, then I will be completely fine with it.
<!--quoteo(post=1698681:date=Jan 27 2009, 11:25 PM:name=Align)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Align @ Jan 27 2009, 11:25 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698681"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I get it to around nipple-height.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Interesting choice of words XD. Long time no see Drake, if I remember correctly you made some custom weapon models for NS1? I would be interested, if there will be phases of the res tower showing damage taken (Like if its around yellow hp, there will be some deep scratches and so on).
<!--quoteo(post=1698677:date=Jan 27 2009, 02:50 PM:name=slayer20)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(slayer20 @ Jan 27 2009, 02:50 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698677"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Can we get something like a height comparison with the Marine and new RT? Everytime I picture the new RT in my mind, I see it as being big and bulky, but when I actually look at the picture it looks not so big but kind of bulky, and at the same time it does look big. It's really weird...
I seem to have a love/hate relationship with it right now...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The resource tower is 87 inches tall, which is taller than a marine. The screen is about eye level.
<!--quoteo(post=1698689:date=Jan 27 2009, 08:26 PM:name=Max)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Max @ Jan 27 2009, 08:26 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698689"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The resource tower is 87 inches tall, which is taller than a marine. The screen is about eye level.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> So it's actually a "tower" now? Hmm... well I guess that makes more sense.
I must say that I love all the * snip *'s that KFDM has been working on, seems he's been busy <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
As to the RT, I do like the overall look and functionality...for the most part.
I also agree with the others that the legs on the RT do not look adequate enough given the concept of the game taking place <i>after</i> NS1. Given the time lapse between NS1 and NS2, I would have figured that there would be some developments on the machinery used. Such as higher durability to withstand attack, etc... (note the movable siege cannon)
Though, I'd give a better judgment of the RT once it is placed in its environment.
Of course, one could also go with that being under a "wartime" state for so long, funds for developing new equipment and machines would be limited...
PrefixÉirinn go BráchJoin Date: 2006-12-31Member: 59353Members, Constellation
<!--quoteo(post=1698689:date=Jan 28 2009, 01:26 AM:name=Max)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Max @ Jan 28 2009, 01:26 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698689"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The resource tower is 87 inches tall, which is taller than a marine. The screen is about eye level.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That. Is. Massive.
It will be interesting to see how you guys balance it if it is that big.
Comments
Well said.
<!--quoteo(post=1698574:date=Jan 26 2009, 08:03 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Jan 26 2009, 08:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698574"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I can't really speak about the gameplay aspects of the skulk mini games that apparently were so popular in the original NS, and how the new resource tower is better or worse, since that's not my area of expertise. However I would warn against bemoaning the potential change or loss of one small gameplay aspect when NS2 might add many more that wouldn't have been possible in the original.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I hope this isn't referring to ambushing, aiming, and the first-person skirmish experience that has been the lifeblood of NS for over five years.
Great post though.
...
As far as the new resource tower looking too low tech and not futuristic enough in comparison to the old, I can understand where you are coming from. However, the marine machinery was always meant to have a low tech industrial look. To a large extent the lack of detail we could fit into a model for the halflife engine meant that the models lacked a lot of the mechanical details that I would have liked to show. Exposed hydraulics, cables, etc. Therefore, because the technology behind how the machines actually worked is missing from the NS models, they appear in many ways to be more futuristic. I also wanted to make sure that the NS2 machines all felt plausible in their mechanical working, and not just have parts appear out of nowhere as it plays it's animation (an example is comparing the old transformers to the new ones in the movie, where parts just appear, grow, bend and do whatever just so it can transform and look cool).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Thanks for your response(to the post that no longer exists). I liked the more alien and futuristic appearance of the old RT, but I understand why you are trying to move away from the direction toward more towards plausible and less towards insect looking while retaining as much of the insect look as possible. I'll still prefer the old RT, but I think the new one will fit in fine with your overall concept "theme".
to be honest, if ns2 shipped with all of the ns1 art assets but new gameplay, i'd still pay full price
i dunno why people are so picky, its not like there are many good games out there right now
also
how would this crane stand up to an onos charge? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
<!--quoteo(post=1698574:date=Jan 27 2009, 11:03 AM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Jan 27 2009, 11:03 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698574"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->[attachment=35874:crane.jpg]<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The deploy animation is going to be killer. Cory talked about the boxes on the side expanding. Makes me wonder if they expand over time as it fills up or if they pump in and out. I can't really see the whole machine pump up and down so I guess if they don't pump in and out there won't be much more then the tube moving and some screen animation. I don't really want to know now though. Might be another gameplay element if they indicate how full it is.
I have to say the speed you guys move forward on this game is really fast and we know you will gameplay test the game to bits before you decide to release. I for one welcome that.
(but i have to say the concept RT looks besser than the 3d one)
another thing i dont understand or would like to say is, marines built the metal-circle on the floors where the resources are beeing "digged" from, right?
so why does the RT not dock onto this -platform-? wouldnt that be smarter than just standing over it like a table?
What I'm saying is, unless the game is set thousands of years in the future, the military machinery <b>should</b> have a very generic, utilitarian look to it. And, another thing I would like to point out to the art director, is to look at a picture of the interior of an aircraft carrier. Or any Navy ship. All of the electrical wiring, all of the steam piping, all of the fire suppression systems is exposed. It looks like it makes it more vulnerable at first, but it is like that for damage control purposes.
If a skulk bites through a metal plate and punctures a hose, to repair it you would have to remove the metal plate, replace the hose, then fabricate a new plate and replace that as well. By routing cabling and hoses on the outside of the structure, yes it makes it more vulnerable, but it also makes it easier to repair.
But I don't recall anyone giving this much criticism to the original design of NS1. No one complained that the original turrets looked like they wouldn't be able to withstand a marine walking past it really fast, much less a skulk rush. No one demanded a bigger mouth on the Onos that impossibly devours heavy marines whole. No one asked for a minibar to be installed in the Command Console because it seemed implausible that a soldier condemning people to death on a daily basis wouldn't develop a drinking habit. We were presented with a game, and we played it because it was immersive and engaging, and beat the hell out of Counter-Strike! I'm not telling anyone not to criticize; I'm just saying maybe things aren't being looked at in perspective.
Personally, I'm just grateful that you guys (The Dev Team) are sharing the experience/process with the public every step of the way. As an aspiring game designer in Central Florida, where there isn't ###### in regards to game design (don't say EA), I appreciate and look forward to the inside look at the development process that you take the time out of your schedule to present to us. Every bit of information is priceless to me. Hell, you could have made the resource node look like a scorpion that hovars without flapping, and I'd still build it, guard it with my life, and then eat it when the teams changed.
Keep up the awesome work!
Wait so we can pick up and move rts now???
<img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
EDIT:
and x5 you knob, I do actually like it.
The only thing that concerns me in terms of game play is if a skulk can hide their body entirely behind the rt.
In NS1, when a skulk bites an rt it has two choices, to jump on the body and chew or to sit on the ground and chew. The reason a skulk will pick one of the two is because it is inevitable that a marine will come to save that rt. The advantage of the former is that you tend to have more cover, depending on the position of the enemy marine, you can also see through the rt <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />. The advantage of the latter is you can strafe and zwndr while chewing, it also gives you the option for a fast retreat. A marine can shoot a skulk who is using the body for cover because its feet or legs stick out above or to the side of the model, and the marine can just pistol it, a marine can also see a skulk fairly easily when it is chewing it from the ground - in NS1 this has been balanced well, largely down to the maps and positioning of vent/rts/doors etc.
From the limited amount we can see of the resource tower for NS2, it appears that a skulk, that is to say if the skulk is the same size as the one in NS1, would be able to hide its entire body behind the rt while chewing - this would present a serious problem for the NS1 marine, because that would mean he would have to get close to the skulk to kill it, and that is almost certain to kill him, and it seems likely that the ranged vs close combat thing is the same.
Anyways it beats the old RT by miles. Always thought the old RT looked like a crabshaped robotic-kharaa hybrid of some sorts.
Corey definitely has an eye for those little details that make all of us Sci Fi movie nerds gush over.
It's not arrogance, it's frustration.
Worse, it seems that more than a few people, <i>including moderators</i>, decided it would appropriate to flame me and call me arrogant without try to understand the motivation behind my word choice or listen to the point I was trying to make. And this is at that same time that you all are practically calling me out at arrogant for expressing a frustrated opinion?! Is that not unfair? I will try to be more aware if my comments could be taken as arrogance in the future, but poor conduct and two threatening e-mails is more than inappropriate as a response.
:-(
Exactly! I too realized that all of the negative commentary (mine included) stems from our love for NS. The only reason I give a damn about an exposed hose is because I don't want a single person to doubt how great NS2 is going to be. Personally, I just want to feel like I played some tiny part in the development of NS2, and if I have to point out that the leg of an RT is 2 millimeters too thin, I'll take that opportunity. The developer's attention to the community is excellent and the pace of development is proving the naysayers wrong.
so why does the RT not dock onto this -platform-? wouldnt that be smarter than just standing over it like a table?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually, the resource nozzle itself (the metal-circle thing on the floor) is part of the environments, and is there already before the marines get there. Which is why it doesn't have any of the marine green, and why the resource tower doesn't have an elaborate means of docking with it. Presumably the resource gathering machines that the workers would use on the Refinery map, for example, would be constructed differently then the marine's own version, or the workers would just connect long hoses directly to the nozzle and plug the other end into a machine, or nearby wall "outlet" to access the nanite energy.
--Cory
Well, after four or five <u><b>years</b></u> since my last post (the one that wasn't eaten by the forum, anyway) the blog update brought me back.
I agree that it doesn't quite feel right. The legs seem a bit too fragile for the overall appearance... but I have a solution! (Picture attached)
People have critiqued that the legs feel flimsy. So here's my suggestion:
The legs lock into features in the floor. They are not "legs" as much as "fenceposts". Their main job is to protect the tower's center, and their secondary job is to hold the delicate center up off the floor and to act as shock-absorbers.
By adding some small "armor plating" decoration on the legs, the tower takes on a much more gritty military appearance, and it highlights the fact that the legs are acting as barriers/roadblock-pylons. There also remains plenty of room to allow skulks to run around.
<!--quoteo(post=1698663:date=Jan 27 2009, 04:37 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Jan 27 2009, 04:37 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1698663"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Actually, the resource nozzle itself (the metal-circle thing on the floor) is part of the environments, and is there already before the marines get there. Which is why it doesn't have any of the marine green, and why the resource tower doesn't have an elaborate means of docking with it. Presumably the resource gathering machines that the workers would use on the Refinery map, for example, would be constructed differently then the marine's own version, or the workers would just connect long hoses directly to the nozzle and plug the other end into a machine, or nearby wall "outlet" to access the nanite energy.
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I like this explanation. It makes sense. As I have familiarity with fire hydrant threads being different in different locations and the problems that causes in needing to have adapters in order to attach the connection with pressure, it makes sense that the marine would have a non-specific, universal adapter unit like this resource tower. Presumably the specific units that would have been used at the facility are non-standardized and thus the RT is needed to make that connection.
Very good. I just hope that backstory-like technical information is included in the game somehow, it would add some cool depth to the NS world and help explain the art you're seeing.
Perhaps this new resource tower design is a next-generation model which is improved in someway? Maybe more efficient in harvesting resources somehow? I don't know what will work within the balance you have for the game so I have no idea where to even begin a suggestion for that...
:-)
I seem to have a love/hate relationship with it right now...
Still good job.
If it's that high, then I will be completely fine with it.
Interesting choice of words XD. Long time no see Drake, if I remember correctly you made some custom weapon models for NS1? I would be interested, if there will be phases of the res tower showing damage taken (Like if its around yellow hp, there will be some deep scratches and so on).
I seem to have a love/hate relationship with it right now...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The resource tower is 87 inches tall, which is taller than a marine. The screen is about eye level.
So it's actually a "tower" now? Hmm... well I guess that makes more sense.
As to the RT, I do like the overall look and functionality...for the most part.
I also agree with the others that the legs on the RT do not look adequate enough given the concept of the game taking place <i>after</i> NS1. Given the time lapse between NS1 and NS2, I would have figured that there would be some developments on the machinery used. Such as higher durability to withstand attack, etc... (note the movable siege cannon)
Though, I'd give a better judgment of the RT once it is placed in its environment.
Of course, one could also go with that being under a "wartime" state for so long, funds for developing new equipment and machines would be limited...
But.. why?
That. Is. Massive.
It will be interesting to see how you guys balance it if it is that big.