Anyone here NOT excited for the tools?

BigText

<div class="IPBDescription">Seems like everyone is talking about them.</div>I feel at times as though I'm the only person who preordered just to PLAY the alpha/beta, instead of messing with the mapping tools. Is there anyone else here NOT looking forward to the tools? I mean, I'm glad they're being released, but levels of excitement are more for the tools instead of the alpha or beta, it seems.

Apollonius999

I'm looking forward to game play, but another side of me says some of these new changes will cause new issues. Besides the fact of the learning curve that even now a LOT of people don't understand from NS1. But as they say, let's add more depth and weaponry. Also let's laugh and be happy as we shoot away at our opponents.

As for the tools, you should be excited. If you weren't excited for the tools then you would not get the game fixed/mod 10x faster and cool new stuff to play with.

This has been discussed in a previous thread though. They call it trolling when people ask questions or try to discuss something :(

NS2 is a NEW game, completely different from NS1.

kingmob

I have some interest in the ALPHA
just to see how it is coming together.

But since it will be in FLUX I won't show it to my friends.
I might show it to them in a me driving type demo.

But I would probably wait until they declared it beta before
a) Playing it more often.
b) Convincing my friends that it would be fun if they picked it up.

The reason the tools are so interesting to people
is because from the vids they have shown they are taking
a fresh take on certain aspects. This is an indicator that
they will put together a very nice game.

If you use software tools (MS Word is a tool) in any way in your job
you know how much time is spent fighting a bad tool.
and how much time is spent in joy over a good tool.

so in summation I am
40% excited to see the alpha.
60% excited to see the tools.

steppin'razor

<!--quoteo(post=1738368:date=Nov 20 2009, 11:42 PM:name=BigText)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BigText @ Nov 20 2009, 11:42 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1738368"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I feel at times as though I'm the only person who preordered just to PLAY the alpha/beta, instead of messing with the mapping tools. Is there anyone else here NOT looking forward to the tools? I mean, I'm glad they're being released, but levels of excitement are more for the tools instead of the alpha or beta, it seems.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is probably because the devs have stated the tools are very close to being released, whereas the game isn't

Rehnquist

So do we get in-engine previews or walk/fly-throughs of what the maps look like or just the renders of the mapping tools?

Mendasp

<!--quoteo(post=1738380:date=Nov 20 2009, 05:41 PM:name=Rehnquist)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Rehnquist @ Nov 20 2009, 05:41 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1738380"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So do we get in-engine previews or walk/fly-throughs of what the maps look like or just the renders of the mapping tools?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm not sure if I understand your question.

We get the mapping tools. People will make levels, and if people make levels, that means... you get screenshots (not from UWE, from the community). Pretty much like with the first NSTR before NS was released...

Rehnquist

<!--quoteo(post=1738381:date=Nov 20 2009, 08:50 AM:name=Mendasp)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mendasp @ Nov 20 2009, 08:50 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1738381"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm not sure if I understand your question.

We get the mapping tools. People will make levels, and if people make levels, that means... you get screenshots (not from UWE, from the community). Pretty much like with the first NSTR before NS was released...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

What I mean is, the devs released an "in-engine" video of lighting and whatnot and I was wondering whether people get to preview their maps like that or they just have a render from the mapping program.

C4K3

<!--quoteo(post=1738368:date=Nov 20 2009, 07:42 AM:name=BigText)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BigText @ Nov 20 2009, 07:42 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1738368"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm glad they're being released, but levels of excitement are more for the tools instead of the alpha or beta, it seems.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


You are correct, and that's because the photoshopped screenshots and the updates about what are "doing" are so weird and lame that everyone including me are looking forward for something useful to remake / drop the whole crap and get an improved Natural Selection game instead this... Bizarre thing. So basically, they are spending most of the time making content for the trash (like sounds, animations, obstructive gun models), so we have to wait and meanwhile we can start figuring out how to get rid of all those mensa-like features.

Kouji_San

Well seeing as the tools are linked into the game, as in you change something in the editor and instantly see it in the game, I'd guess they will release some form of Spark with the tools to actually preview the content ingame (now if this is trough marine/alien player viewpoints or noclip spectator view, doesn't really matter to me. Mainly because spectator/noclip is what I mainly use to tweak areas in maps anyways. Lateron I'll check if for instance an Onos fits trough a door (but for NS1 we knew the player hull dimensions anyeway... Here's to hoping they will release those numbers as well :P)

monopolowa

UWE has been promoting the fact that "what you see is what you get" with regard to lighting, etc. Flying through the level in the map editor is supposed to look the same as moving through the map in game with noclip on

zex

What I don't understand is how its possible to make functional maps without knowing specifics of the gameplay - exact character and building sizes for scale reference, jump heights of every unit, weapon efficiency across whatever line of sight, and most important being able to playtest with two teams to balance the level layout. I mean, it'll be cool just to learn the ropes for when the actual game is out, but...

Kouji_San

That why I want the collision hull numbers :P

Gameplay/flow can be quite easy to change, well the way I map anyways. I pimp out certain main areas and have some form of control as to where the exits will be and have the possibility to move them around and connecting them with hallways to change the walkin distances and flow of a map.

With this in mind, I think the main rules of NS1 units still apply to some extend. And adjusting them to NS2 shouldn't be all that big of a deal... Playtesting is where a map will show its true flaws like welding times/walking distances/siege ranges/resnode placing/lork on clorf areas :P But getting to that stage we do need some kind of NS2 core game, which isn't going to happen during the tool release, I guess...

pallie

Anyone here NOT excited for the tools?

I am not at all excited for the tools. :(

d$k

<!--quoteo(post=1738368:date=Nov 20 2009, 08:42 AM:name=BigText)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BigText @ Nov 20 2009, 08:42 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1738368"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I feel at times as though I'm the only person who preordered just to PLAY the alpha/beta, instead of messing with the mapping tools. Is there anyone else here NOT looking forward to the tools? I mean, I'm glad they're being released, but levels of excitement are more for the tools instead of the alpha or beta, it seems.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

If you'd ever made a model ... map or something else in the past that you'll be able to make with the to-be-released tools then you'd know what all the fuzz is about

Insane

<!--quoteo(post=1738382:date=Nov 20 2009, 03:56 PM:name=Rehnquist)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Rehnquist @ Nov 20 2009, 03:56 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1738382"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What I mean is, the devs released an "in-engine" video of lighting and whatnot and I was wondering whether people get to preview their maps like that or they just have a render from the mapping program.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

You'll be able to preview your maps in-editor. It actually runs a version of the engine itself, so there won't be any discrepancies between what you see in there, and what you get in-game.

The editor will come with documentation, including a set of Mapping Guidelines, which will continue to be updated as playtests go on.

IronFist

I'm pretty much in it for early access. No free time to work on any personal projects these days. I will probably check them out though, since I'm a pretty big NS fan.

FocusedWolf

Hope the tools kick ass and are released early.

NS thrived on custom content... i.e. vanilla servers suck... The faster people learn the moding/mapping tools, the better. (Also good for squashing those bugs)

Unless their's some tools, which the devs currently sell separate (like that thing with that lua product they made), then in reality the tools should be free so all those that didn't order (for whatever reason, maybe their waiting for steam preorder) can access them.

Sirot

I am awaiting to see how the tools look like. I am very interested in the maximum size a map could be, since my grand intent is to create a modification that takes place in wide open fields. If the map limit is way too small, that makes my goals somewhat impossible.

CoolCookieCooks

This topic is a real silly question. No tools means less maps in alpha which means more work for the dev team. Its a pretty straight forward thing to get. If you didnt notice already, NS1 had the NSTR which has been mentioned many times already in the thread. With the NSTR out early, people were able to make alot of great maps before the game was released. Maybe im just a grumpy old-timer, but I remember how the original NSTR was such a good idea.

sicbud

I'm excited for them, I just hope that they actually come out this month like they're supposed to.

Jimyd

I wonder if they will let us place structures/weapons/EXOs within the map editor for the NS2TR.

Although I guess some stuff will just be wireframe boxes for now, but it would just give a general helpful idea for placing "scenario stuff".

At the very least the structures that are finished. I'm guessing most of the Kharaa stuff isn't near finished quality, unless... they are just hiding all of it from us. One can only hope for the latter. =D

CoolCookieCooks

Jimyd - it does. :)

"The game is now set up to allow mappers to pre-place structures, weapons, etc., just like you always wanted for NS1! Good for scenarios." - NS2 Twitter Feed

M00_cow

I am excited about the release of the tools because I think that mapping is WICKED GOOD FUN TIMES JOY AND OTHER STUFF!

I have made a few CSS maps, all small bloodstrike type maps with choke points etc and while I do get bored eventually, for awhile, mapping is as fun as playing the actual game because you get to design the encounters to a certain point and in NS, that is only made greater because there are aerial encounters and wall climbing... ugh... I... I... want it now... *runs away crying

In short, I am excited because it will be amazing.

BadMouth

I am only excited for the tools, because it is an indication of something being done. Kind of like a 50% mark on a progress bar on the whole scale of NS2 completeness. And the 50% is just an example.

I won't even use the tools.