Be sure to check out my progress thread here: <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=108745" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...howtopic=108745</a>
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
<!--quoteo(post=1758432:date=Mar 10 2010, 01:39 AM:name=eye_em_kewl)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (eye_em_kewl @ Mar 10 2010, 01:39 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1758432"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->you got all of the 3 big manly things there, alcohol reference, a fast car, and a model.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Yeah but drunk driving in a fast car while oogling good looking girls alongside the road... Not such a good thing :P
@CIOnDIEu
Nice shot, I'd however put some more light on the resnode. It is the center of atention, light can help in that cause
<!--quoteo(post=1758336:date=Mar 10 2010, 12:19 AM:name=Draco_2k)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Draco_2k @ Mar 10 2010, 12:19 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1758336"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Spark has no leaks. :p
But yeah, it's a damn neat tool.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Wait... seriously? So enclosing all these model-based walls with brush walls wasn't even necessary? =/
Slayer, just a comment on your design. It seems everything in your map is blocky, and then you have two pillars on each side of the room. Make them blocky to go with the design.
Just my suggestion :D
And yes, I do have a fast car, I do drink, and No I don't drink and drive. I praise the meaning of life.
<!--quoteo(post=1758484:date=Mar 10 2010, 05:32 AM:name=UncleRay)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (UncleRay @ Mar 10 2010, 05:32 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1758484"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Here's my WIP. This is an Homage to those who first made NS. This is NS_Hera ( hopefully I can use the name :D )<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
You know, even though catwalks look very cool. Particular this shot with the darkness (I think it is a little bit to dark though for some older monitors).
Anyway, the problem I forsee with catwalks is that the short range melee Khaara classes will have lot's of trouble closing the distance in these narrow choke-points of death...
I'm not really going to call it NS_Hera... that would be bad lol. However, I'm basing the map OUT of the old Hera. I just need to find screenshots of the very first Hera, this way I can work around it.
I have 2 routes to every location, 1 main route (Onous & Fade Havens) and one Back route (Skulk & Lerk Haven). That is a back route.
Back routes are longer than Main routes. Back routes are higher and thinner where as Main routes are Wider.
My goal is to create 2 options, You get there fast but risk more so running into an Onous & Fade, or you take the the longer darker route where you might have a better chance of getting through against Lerks and Skulks. The shape design goals is to act as deterrants for certain clesses to linger around certain parts of the levels.
<!--quoteo(post=1758565:date=Mar 10 2010, 03:05 PM:name=Kouji_San)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kouji_San @ Mar 10 2010, 03:05 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1758565"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You know, even though catwalks look very cool. Particular this shot with the darkness (I think it is a little bit to dark though for some older monitors).
Anyway, the problem I forsee with catwalks is that the short range melee Khaara classes will have lot's of trouble closing the distance in these narrow choke-points of death...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree, remember that catwalks are very restrictive to both teams. The Onos is pretty much as big as a cat walk and a catwalk leaves very little room for props to hide behind. They are pretty much only good for 2nd-ary routes unless they are stretched to be wide enough. With the in mind you should use the walls as a primary route for skulks and give them odd rocks to hide behind so they don’t just get shot up by marines walking along the catwalk. But light the walls pretty well, with spot lights and leave dark areas for Kharaa to hide, maybe even a semi dark route that snakes across the whole wall. Catwalks also make it harder for the Kharaa to attack, as they can only attack the top half of a marine, and only from above the catwalk, as their are barriers that marines can shoot through from a marines waist all the way down.
The trick is, either double up the cat walk. (one next to another, making them twice as wide, or put two next to each other with a gap in the middle and maybe some rock pillars to give bother teams two routes to choose from and plenty of cover. They should join together at either end, creating a small, short choke point that can be used to defend adjoining rooms from.) Other ideas to get around catwalk issues are hanging pipes under the catwalk, so marines can shoot down onto Kharaa that maybe trying to hide under the catwalk. Another good idea is, indents in the walls around the catwalk, like caves or vents that run along the side the catwalk, basically places where Kharaa can jump into and get into cover while they try and work out what to do next. These are all pretty much similar rules for creating long corridors or rooms, where the openness of the area leaves the Kharaa with a major disadvantage.
slayer20Killed a man once.Join Date: 2007-12-13Member: 63157Members, Reinforced - Shadow
<!--quoteo(post=1758621:date=Mar 10 2010, 01:26 PM:name=matfra)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (matfra @ Mar 10 2010, 01:26 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1758621"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't post too mutch on forum, but I think this catwalk own. I wish Ns Team will integrate community map or prefab in official map<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1758651:date=Mar 11 2010, 12:41 AM:name=slayer20)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (slayer20 @ Mar 11 2010, 12:41 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1758651"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It is possible to get your map released with NS2.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Yes, provided you follow certain standards (high quality, good gameplay, no copyrighted stuff, in-universe, etc.)
One thing I would like to mention about all the work being done here is the general patterns in regular NS maps that made them good. If memory serves me correctly; Hera, Tanith, and Eclipse were probably the top three played maps by regular NS players. Hopefully some of you mappers have realized what made these maps good.
<b>Marine-biased vs Alien-biased</b> - Remember that dark maps generally favor the aliens, while lighter maps favor the marines. It would be my suggestion that many mappers take this into consideration when creating their maps. A good map should have a combination of contrasts... areas that prefer marines and areas that prefer aliens. One will always notice that most popular maps from the NS-era do contain more light areas than dark areas.
<b>Res-Node Placement</b> - There's usually an option to take one or two paths to the first res-node from either the marine start or alien start. The double res-node is always beyond the first (easy-cap) res node, and generally hard to maintain by either the marine or alien side. Which suggests a pattern of both light and dark areas in the double res room.
<b>Design</b> - Since most of the information regarding gameplay has not been released yet, we must assume that there will be three hives and a marine start -- creating a 4-point map. Although some mappers have became rather artistic and idealistic when it comes to mapping, very few good maps deviated from these bounds. It is always a good idea to plot out your map before you start to create it. This will make mapping life much easier since you have basic idea of how to create it.
Most mappers should want their map to be played, which means that they want it to be popular. The above points are some things that I've noticed in about 2/3rds of all maps posted in this thread. Remember that popularity of a map is not based on artistic ability (well it is somewhat) but rather by how balanced the map seems for both the aliens and the marines!
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited March 2010
I don't particular think that the most played maps are also the very best... There were a lot of other maps out there that were good, but the core players do not like to play other then the top played maps... Giving them no playtime, cause they had to learn the new maps, making them feel out of control...
Judging with the current hardcore vets, who do not acknowledge other maps at all, is no measurement :P
[edit] The points you made are however good ones :)
Yeh that damn votemap mod has been a burden on some good maps that aint played anymore cause people wont vote for them, They only vote for the ones they know inside and out.
More cave further back: <img src="http://www.unitedworlds.co.uk/online-gaming/ns2_map10.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<!--quoteo(post=1758697:date=Mar 10 2010, 07:01 PM:name=Dtere)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dtere @ Mar 10 2010, 07:01 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1758697"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->...we must assume that there will be three hives and a marine start -- creating a 4-point map.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There are the Marine and Alien Start, and 2 to 4 extra tech points that act as extra Hives or Command stations.
<!--quoteo(post=1758697:date=Mar 10 2010, 08:01 PM:name=Dtere)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dtere @ Mar 10 2010, 08:01 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1758697"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><b>Design</b> - Since most of the information regarding gameplay has not been released yet, we must assume that there will be three hives and a marine start -- creating a 4-point map. Although some mappers have became rather artistic and idealistic when it comes to mapping, very few good maps deviated from these bounds. It is always a good idea to plot out your map before you start to create it. This will make mapping life much easier since you have basic idea of how to create it.
Most mappers should want their map to be played, which means that they want it to be popular. The above points are some things that I've noticed in about 2/3rds of all maps posted in this thread. Remember that popularity of a map is not based on artistic ability (well it is somewhat) but rather by how balanced the map seems for both the aliens and the marines!
-Dtere (aka Bubz)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Your missing the most important point. The power grid. Here's an article: <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns/news/2009/4/marine_power_grid_design" target="_blank">news</a> I tried a quick search for a post that had 8 or so suggested power grids. Can't find it. I'm mapping mods, tech rooms, halls, res areas and waiting for the game.
Comments
But seriously.... this is MUCH better.
<img src="http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/9250/evalunchroom.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Be sure to check out my progress thread here: <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=108745" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...howtopic=108745</a>
This picture is of the Lunch Room area.
i'm glad you have that forum signature there - wouldn't want anyone think you're not straight. phew glad that's all cleared up...
you got all of the 3 big manly things there, alcohol reference, a fast car, and a model.
welcome to the club.....
Yeah but drunk driving in a fast car while oogling good looking girls alongside the road... Not such a good thing :P
@CIOnDIEu
Nice shot, I'd however put some more light on the resnode. It is the center of atention, light can help in that cause
But yeah, it's a damn neat tool.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wait... seriously? So enclosing all these model-based walls with brush walls wasn't even necessary? =/
Just my suggestion :D
And yes, I do have a fast car, I do drink, and No I don't drink and drive. I praise the meaning of life.
<img src="http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/6150/sc1h.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/8946/sc2m.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Don't. Please.
<img src="http://www.unitedworlds.co.uk/online-gaming/ns2_map09.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://www.unitedworlds.co.uk/online-gaming/ns2_map09.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wow, that looks great! Really though it looks awesome, its very realistic looking.
Anyway, the problem I forsee with catwalks is that the short range melee Khaara classes will have lot's of trouble closing the distance in these narrow choke-points of death...
That is a back route.
Back routes are longer than Main routes.
Back routes are higher and thinner where as Main routes are Wider.
My goal is to create 2 options, You get there fast but risk more so running into an Onous & Fade, or you take the the longer darker route where you might have a better chance of getting through against Lerks and Skulks.
The shape design goals is to act as deterrants for certain clesses to linger around certain parts of the levels.
Anyway, the problem I forsee with catwalks is that the short range melee Khaara classes will have lot's of trouble closing the distance in these narrow choke-points of death...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree, remember that catwalks are very restrictive to both teams. The Onos is pretty much as big as a cat walk and a catwalk leaves very little room for props to hide behind. They are pretty much only good for 2nd-ary routes unless they are stretched to be wide enough. With the in mind you should use the walls as a primary route for skulks and give them odd rocks to hide behind so they don’t just get shot up by marines walking along the catwalk. But light the walls pretty well, with spot lights and leave dark areas for Kharaa to hide, maybe even a semi dark route that snakes across the whole wall. Catwalks also make it harder for the Kharaa to attack, as they can only attack the top half of a marine, and only from above the catwalk, as their are barriers that marines can shoot through from a marines waist all the way down.
The trick is, either double up the cat walk. (one next to another, making them twice as wide, or put two next to each other with a gap in the middle and maybe some rock pillars to give bother teams two routes to choose from and plenty of cover. They should join together at either end, creating a small, short choke point that can be used to defend adjoining rooms from.) Other ideas to get around catwalk issues are hanging pipes under the catwalk, so marines can shoot down onto Kharaa that maybe trying to hide under the catwalk. Another good idea is, indents in the walls around the catwalk, like caves or vents that run along the side the catwalk, basically places where Kharaa can jump into and get into cover while they try and work out what to do next. These are all pretty much similar rules for creating long corridors or rooms, where the openness of the area leaves the Kharaa with a major disadvantage.
<!--quoteo(post=1758559:date=Mar 10 2010, 09:55 AM:name=SgtBarlow)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SgtBarlow @ Mar 10 2010, 09:55 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1758559"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->45 Degree Angle Catwalk Saves the day!
<img src="http://www.unitedworlds.co.uk/online-gaming/ns2_map09.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It is possible to get your map released with NS2.
Yes, provided you follow certain standards (high quality, good gameplay, no copyrighted stuff, in-universe, etc.)
<b>Marine-biased vs Alien-biased</b> - Remember that dark maps generally favor the aliens, while lighter maps favor the marines. It would be my suggestion that many mappers take this into consideration when creating their maps. A good map should have a combination of contrasts... areas that prefer marines and areas that prefer aliens. One will always notice that most popular maps from the NS-era do contain more light areas than dark areas.
<b>Res-Node Placement</b> - There's usually an option to take one or two paths to the first res-node from either the marine start or alien start. The double res-node is always beyond the first (easy-cap) res node, and generally hard to maintain by either the marine or alien side. Which suggests a pattern of both light and dark areas in the double res room.
<b>Design</b> - Since most of the information regarding gameplay has not been released yet, we must assume that there will be three hives and a marine start -- creating a 4-point map. Although some mappers have became rather artistic and idealistic when it comes to mapping, very few good maps deviated from these bounds. It is always a good idea to plot out your map before you start to create it. This will make mapping life much easier since you have basic idea of how to create it.
Most mappers should want their map to be played, which means that they want it to be popular. The above points are some things that I've noticed in about 2/3rds of all maps posted in this thread. Remember that popularity of a map is not based on artistic ability (well it is somewhat) but rather by how balanced the map seems for both the aliens and the marines!
-Dtere (aka Bubz)
Judging with the current hardcore vets, who do not acknowledge other maps at all, is no measurement :P
[edit]
The points you made are however good ones :)
More cave further back:
<img src="http://www.unitedworlds.co.uk/online-gaming/ns2_map10.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
There are the Marine and Alien Start, and 2 to 4 extra tech points that act as extra Hives or Command stations.
Most mappers should want their map to be played, which means that they want it to be popular. The above points are some things that I've noticed in about 2/3rds of all maps posted in this thread. Remember that popularity of a map is not based on artistic ability (well it is somewhat) but rather by how balanced the map seems for both the aliens and the marines!
-Dtere (aka Bubz)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your missing the most important point. The power grid. Here's an article:
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns/news/2009/4/marine_power_grid_design" target="_blank">news</a>
I tried a quick search for a post that had 8 or so suggested power grids. Can't find it.
I'm mapping mods, tech rooms, halls, res areas and waiting for the game.
<a href="http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/6267/comm2.jpg" target="_blank">http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/6267/comm2.jpg</a>
<a href="http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/5074/comm3.jpg" target="_blank">http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/5074/comm3.jpg</a>
<b>
Click the links for undeveloped map/greybox...</b>