I want to spawn as MAC with a little lazer shooting aliens right into the eye <img src="http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n319/D3wurst/zunge.gif" border="0" class="linked-image" />
kerostasis, considering right now leap at hive 1, I think the tension will be even greater. When have you not been attacked by a lone skulk whenever you're building an RT and they have leap? They'll have their upgrades, skulks leaping back and forth, you trying to protect yourself and your lone MAC so that you can get the RT up. You're still going to be pretty vulnerable, whether or not you're the one building the RT.
Not necessarily, an organized attack by aliens on the marines would be effective, but of course trying to gank one of them with a skulk isn't very viable against any entrenched marines.
Possible Scenario: 2 Marines and 1 MAC building a RT, Lerk Gasses the area forces marines to relocate and possible separate them, skulk moves in for kill with possible help with Lerk, bam both marines can now be dead and a MAC be open for destruction.
<!--quoteo(post=1789574:date=Jul 30 2010, 07:30 PM:name=Kerostasis)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kerostasis @ Jul 30 2010, 07:30 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1789574"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If holding E was all you did, it wouldn't be engaging -- the engaging part is the tension that comes from being vulnerable. What happens if a skulk sneaks up on me while I'm building? Will I be able to defend myself? Can my buddies keep me alive long enough to finish this?
The MAC has the potential to remove that tension and make it boring again. What fun is it to stand next to a MAC while IT holds "e" instead of you? Most of the time you won't even be shooting stuff, because skulks still don't like rushing emplaced marines.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So the game will be boring if you can't walk up to something and press e for 15 seconds?
You talk about tension but surely it's the same thing waiting for the MAC to finish building as it would be holding down 'e'; you're just swapping places.
Killpo, where are these medpacks that the commander drops? Also don't forget you can always take the MAC off from the RT during the time, so that even the MAC can attack or even weld the marines during that time.
<!--quoteo(post=1789553:date=Jul 30 2010, 06:46 PM:name=Revi.uk)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Revi.uk @ Jul 30 2010, 06:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1789553"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->There is no point though, why does everyone believe that pressing 'e' on a target is the be all and end all of natural selection. It's not fun and it's not engaging. It's boring and pointless when you can have a robot do it for you whilst you do the fun things like shoot stuff.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wow, you talk as if every single ns player shares your exact opinion. Get over yourself.
You can quite easily not build the building, run off and shoot aliens. Let the guys that enjoy building things have their fun too.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited July 2010
<!--quoteo(post=1789546:date=Jul 30 2010, 07:32 PM:name=Taxen0)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Taxen0 @ Jul 30 2010, 07:32 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1789546"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Why not add a 'engineering tool' at the marine armory? takes up a slot and allows the marine to build. (maybe even limit other weapon selections) and for the aliens the heal spray should work as their 'engineering tool', and is limited by class. sounds balanced =)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> This!
You can choose your role, heck I want to build stuff. Supporting or helping the MAC's. And with this I invest my own hard earned virtual money into it. To be able to actually build stuff. I'll gladly give up my switchaxe (or maybe even my gun) for a building tool (welder to weld people/doors and other stuff maybe?). This way the MAC's don't become useless, because not everyone will buy a buildtool. But at least the players have a choose to give up some firepower for a support class...
Why do some of you people insist that building stuff isn't fun, that is your opinion. You can go out and kill/defend stuff with your bullets. I'd rather be a techie that supports the troops... Go away trying to enforce your opinion on others! it also doesn't hurt to have more options, you can still ignore them, the MAC's still will take care of the job as well, but would you rather depend on a AI robot or a human?
Being able to build stuff and repair the other's armor and the MAC's and welding stuff shut or open. while also helping the others shoot stuff, with less firepower, due to one slot taken up by the builder/welder tool. THAT sounds like a more fun game to me...
Engineers are severely underrated by the guys who just like to shoot stuff...
See having an Option for the MAC to be manually taken over would benefit you would it not? You won't actually get a "welder" But the MAC will be your tool indirectly in a way, With it you'll be able to assist the squad by welding, clearing out infestation , and speeding up building. Personally I think that'd be pretty ba would it not? Sure allow it to be automated so it doesn't have to be manned, but give benefits for it being manned.
<!--quoteo(post=1789579:date=Jul 30 2010, 12:36 PM:name=Revi.uk)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Revi.uk @ Jul 30 2010, 12:36 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1789579"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So the game will be boring if you can't walk up to something and press e for 15 seconds?
You talk about tension but surely it's the same thing waiting for the MAC to finish building as it would be holding down 'e'; you're just swapping places.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> You're missing the point, Revi.
The fun part isn't hitting 'e'. The fun part is situating yourself in a position where you know you're vulnerable -- generally facing directly toward a structure and not out toward where you can shoot oncoming aliens -- yet doing it anyway because there is a reward for succeeding.
It's not at all the same thing waiting for the MAC to build, because there you're not setting yourself in a vulnerable position, if anything, you're lessening you're vulnerability because you're not moving, and you're actively watching for enemy opposition to come along.
It's not the building, per se, that's fun, it's the additional risk of knowingly being in a bad position should an alien attack and undertaking that risk for the additional reward of getting the building done to help your team. Take out the risk part, (which is what happens when you're defending the MAC) and the reward isn't as sweet.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited July 2010
<!--quoteo(post=1789596:date=Jul 30 2010, 08:58 PM:name=Killpo1)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Killpo1 @ Jul 30 2010, 08:58 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1789596"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->See having an Option for the MAC to be manually taken over would benefit you would it not? You won't actually get a "welder" But the MAC will be your tool indirectly in a way, With it you'll be able to assist the squad by welding, clearing out infestation , and speeding up building. Personally I think that'd be pretty ba would it not? Sure allow it to be automated so it doesn't have to be manned, but give benefits for it being manned.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> No because that could be abused! people taking over MAC's to annoy the commander and also takes one more marine out of the battle. It actually adds two problems. The MAC's need to be commander/AI controlled and the delivery platform for buildings.
The buildtool solves those problems and also keeps the MAC's in their important role (being the delivery system of buildings). Besides I don't want to drive around with a MAC. I want to be out on the battlefield, supporting the troops and MAC's
A battle is not decided by just firepower! Support troops are just as important.
<i> <b>Think of it this way (SC2 example)</b>
A battlegroup of medics, marines, air support, heavy tanks is way stronger then a much large zerg group of single type heavy firepower units. They may have superior firepower, but their health drain will in the end take it's tole.
In the case of the builder/weld tool, you can support the troops out on the battlefield and even add your own firepower to the battle. Which is of course crippled, but firepower none the less...
<b>Company of Heroes example</b>
A big heavy tank is much more menacing with engineers/pioneers behind it, fixing it...</i>
<!--quoteo(post=1789574:date=Jul 30 2010, 01:30 PM:name=Kerostasis)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kerostasis @ Jul 30 2010, 01:30 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1789574"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If holding E was all you did, it wouldn't be engaging -- the engaging part is the tension that comes from being vulnerable. What happens if a skulk sneaks up on me while I'm building? Will I be able to defend myself? Can my buddies keep me alive long enough to finish this?
The MAC has the potential to remove that tension and make it boring again. What fun is it to stand next to a MAC while IT holds "e" instead of you? Most of the time you won't even be shooting stuff, because skulks still don't like rushing emplaced marines.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Exactly. The person building probably has the most engaged role. You have to check every vent, keep as many entrances in sight as possible and listen for alien footsteps. And you can stop building and contribute to attacking.
<!--quoteo(post=1789610:date=Jul 30 2010, 08:07 PM:name=Stardog)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Stardog @ Jul 30 2010, 08:07 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1789610"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Exactly. The person building probably has the most engaged role. You have to check every vent, keep as many entrances in sight as possible and listen for alien footsteps. And you can stop building and contribute to attacking.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I love pressing 'e'. Makes me feel like I'm actually there!
Ok new idea Kouji, you not actually having to be engaged and driving the MAC, for the majority of stuff have it AI controlled, but having a Techie, maybe some one with carrying the equipment for the MAC *welder*, but you being able to tell the MAC like what do, as in Weld a door, Weld a Marines broken armor, so basically your supporting the troops, but the MAC functions as your welder. Mainly because having the MACs only purpose to deliver buildings seams almost why bother, just have it the same way as NS1 if that's the case.
Oh and about people abusing things, Yeah of course people are going to be ###### and do that stuff occasionally that's why you have vote kick/admin kick/ or possible give the commander the ability to assign techies.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited July 2010
Ah, but what is wrong with having more options in the game. Do they scare the people who just like to shoot stuff?
That suggested buildtool with my explanation will actually implement something nice into the game, which is fun for the people who want to play the game in such a way. While still keeping the shooters happy as well and keeping an eye on a few problem that might occur, when it is exactly like NS1 (pressing "e", without any mandatory equipment). And still keep the MAC's as very important building delivery units...
Pressing "e" might sound simple, as you are obviously trying to make it look. But the points made for this are valid, if you can't see this or refuse to acknowledge it. You are indeed trolling <img src="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/smileys/smile.gif" border="0" class="linked-image" />
@Killpo1
I dunno, that seems very clunky to deal with out on the battlefield with fast moving Khaara trying to kill you. Not to mention the commander deciding who is going to be a techie, that is also something they wanted to eliminate. Just let the players choose themselves, by using the armory for tools.
But what is wrong with keeping the MAC's in their building delivery role, that is exactly what they are doing right now <img src="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/smileys/biggrin.gif" border="0" class="linked-image" /> Keeping them in that role, leavesthem important enough to defend. I actually like the new system they have in mind vs the old NS1 phasing in of buildings anywhere.
<!--quoteo(post=1789619:date=Jul 31 2010, 03:15 AM:name=Revi.uk)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Revi.uk @ Jul 31 2010, 03:15 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1789619"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm not trolling, Just getting tired of the poor arguments for pressing 'e'.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
They are just as valid as your argument for pressing 'w' and 'MOUSE 1'.
Some people like to build, some like to shoot, most like to do both. To be honest I think the old system was much better than this MAC thing but maybe I''m just "old school".
At their current state MACs are more of a burden then anything else, they really need some more umpf to them, I'm certainly not trying to make the marine team rely on them, but currently MACs aren't very useful, their just something marines have to deal with to build stuff. What im simply trying to do is suggest roles the MAC could also fulfill that would make them more valuable and in turn cause them no longer to be a burden, but an asset.
If all we did was want to shoot aliens we would all just be playing alien swarm. The whole idea behind NS and the reason I loved it so much was I got to build stuff and you had to support your commanders build selection or boot him in favor of someone else.
My guess is Revi.uk was that guy on the team that would run out and get a ton of alien kills but not help build the base or RT's because he felt it was beneath him.
I think it could be done in a balanced manner. Like was suggested, allow marines to assist the MAC. Might need to make it so you have 2+ marines assisting to make it really worthwhile. Or maybe have an upgrade that would allow the comm to spawn MACs at distance and the players need to build it first.
<!--quoteo(post=1789634:date=Jul 30 2010, 08:30 PM:name=Asimov)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Asimov @ Jul 30 2010, 08:30 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1789634"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If all we did was want to shoot aliens we would all just be playing alien swarm. The whole idea behind NS and the reason I loved it so much was I got to build stuff and you had to support your commanders build selection or boot him in favor of someone else.
My guess is Revi.uk was that guy on the team that would run out and get a ton of alien kills but not help build the base or RT's because he felt it was beneath him.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hello, what's this now?
Careful, there's no need to lower the tone of this wonderful little discussion we've got going on here.
I kind of like the idea of a build/weld tool. You will need a way to repair MACs on the field and it provides a way for a marine to help the commander out with plasma if the comm is low on carbon.
Also, I feel like it's a little TOO easy to get MACs right now. They are really really cheap which diminishes the incentive to protect them. I think once the resource model starts to get balanced then we'll see that the commander won't spam them so freely and the marines will be more motivated to help them build around the map.
<!--quoteo(post=1789639:date=Jul 30 2010, 08:39 PM:name=Asimov)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Asimov @ Jul 30 2010, 08:39 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1789639"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->There are another couple on this section. Your not open to ideas or discussion, either you are trolling or don't care. Its one of the two.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm completely open, I just don't agree. Fortunately the way I like it is already in the game so I don't have to fill this thread with accusations on a persons playing habits.
A friendly reminder here - #1 Your opinions are not what everyone else necessarily shares. #2 Just because someone else has a different opinion doesn't make it wrong - that's why they are <i>opinions</i> and not<i> facts</i>. From reading your posts it sounds like you're never satisfied with something someone else says if it doesn't agree with your <i>opinions</i>. I'm sure you're going to respond with some witty retort against me, but I was getting tired of reading this thread with your little "my way or the highway" approach. It is a discussion forum after all.
That aside, I agree with the people supporting the want-to-build option. Personally I really enjoyed the tension from the first NS of having to get the RT finished before you were bum-rushed by skulks. I also agree that skulks will be less prone to attack a group of rines if they're simply bunkered down in the corner defending the MAC.
The build tool idea sounds awesome, that way you could "specialize" particular marines to help with building (which I'm sure some people would really enjoy) while leaving the others to go fight battles around the map.
See my problem is that most of you only see the MAC as being some type of burden. Only there to build stuff you don't seem to be thinking about how else he could be used. I would fully agree with people about them wanting to be building RTs but 7 1/2 years of playing and I still always see marines dying to 1 hive skulks while they are building an RT. Now in NS2 you don't have a simple skulk running towards you you have it leaping at you, which is even faster than a bhopping skulk. Imagine early game there being no MAC to build, you by yourself or maybe with another person building an RT oh look at this 2 skulks are coming buy they leap directly to the RT you barely have a chance, but now you have a MAC who can build with you and maybe someone else covering, now if there are 2 skulks leaping who are coming towards the RT, there's a good chance that you'll probably kill them besides being the ones killed.
Also just as a question do the commanders still have the ability to synthesize medkits from thin air? I really think either a Medic/ or a MAC ability to heal surrounding squad mates would be nice, with the appropriate balancing of course so you wouldn't have a squad of marines stand by a MAC dispensing constant health of course.
<!--quoteo(post=1789644:date=Jul 30 2010, 02:42 PM:name=Frhoe)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Frhoe @ Jul 30 2010, 02:42 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1789644"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->See my problem is that most of you only see the MAC as being some type of burden. Only there to build stuff you don't seem to be thinking about how else he could be used. I would fully agree with people about them wanting to be building RTs but 7 1/2 years of playing and I still always see marines dying to 1 hive skulks while they are building an RT. Now in NS2 you don't have a simple skulk running towards you you have it leaping at you, which is even faster than a bhopping skulk. Imagine early game there being no MAC to build, you by yourself or maybe with another person building an RT oh look at this 2 skulks are coming buy they leap directly to the RT you barely have a chance, but now you have a MAC who can build with you and maybe someone else covering, now if there are 2 skulks leaping who are coming towards the RT, there's a good chance that you'll probably kill them besides being the ones killed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree it will up the survival rate, but what happens when the skulk just kills the MAC in route or the new RT is behind enemy lines? I think the MAC can have a role, but I don't like it being the only option for the team in terms of building. I really believe it takes the commanders on both sides out of the game, and it becomes a simple marines vs aliens shooter with partial convoy coverage missions.
There has to be some middle ground we can work towards in this Alpha.
A friendly reminder here - #1 Your opinions are not what everyone else necessarily shares. #2 Just because someone else has a different opinion doesn't make it wrong - that's why they are <i>opinions</i> and not<i> facts</i>. From reading your posts it sounds like you're never satisfied with something someone else says if it doesn't agree with your <i>opinions</i>. I'm sure you're going to respond with some witty retort against me, but I was getting tired of reading this thread with your little "my way or the highway" approach. It is a discussion forum after all.
That aside, I agree with the people supporting the want-to-build option. Personally I really enjoyed the tension from the first NS of having to get the RT finished before you were bum-rushed by skulks. I also agree that skulks will be less prone to attack a group of rines if they're simply bunkered down in the corner defending the MAC.
The build tool idea sounds awesome, that way you could "specialize" particular marines to help with building (which I'm sure some people would really enjoy) while leaving the others to go fight battles around the map.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually no, it's not "my way or the highway", as my way is already in the game so technically you're all along for the ride anyway. :)
Comments
Possible Scenario: 2 Marines and 1 MAC building a RT, Lerk Gasses the area forces marines to relocate and possible separate them, skulk moves in for kill with possible help with Lerk, bam both marines can now be dead and a MAC be open for destruction.
The MAC has the potential to remove that tension and make it boring again. What fun is it to stand next to a MAC while IT holds "e" instead of you? Most of the time you won't even be shooting stuff, because skulks still don't like rushing emplaced marines.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So the game will be boring if you can't walk up to something and press e for 15 seconds?
You talk about tension but surely it's the same thing waiting for the MAC to finish building as it would be holding down 'e'; you're just swapping places.
Wow, you talk as if every single ns player shares your exact opinion. Get over yourself.
You can quite easily not build the building, run off and shoot aliens. Let the guys that enjoy building things have their fun too.
and for the aliens the heal spray should work as their 'engineering tool', and is limited by class.
sounds balanced =)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This!
You can choose your role, heck I want to build stuff. Supporting or helping the MAC's. And with this I invest my own hard earned virtual money into it. To be able to actually build stuff. I'll gladly give up my switchaxe (or maybe even my gun) for a building tool (welder to weld people/doors and other stuff maybe?). This way the MAC's don't become useless, because not everyone will buy a buildtool. But at least the players have a choose to give up some firepower for a support class...
Why do some of you people insist that building stuff isn't fun, that is your opinion. You can go out and kill/defend stuff with your bullets. I'd rather be a techie that supports the troops... Go away trying to enforce your opinion on others! it also doesn't hurt to have more options, you can still ignore them, the MAC's still will take care of the job as well, but would you rather depend on a AI robot or a human?
Being able to build stuff and repair the other's armor and the MAC's and welding stuff shut or open. while also helping the others shoot stuff, with less firepower, due to one slot taken up by the builder/welder tool. THAT sounds like a more fun game to me...
Engineers are severely underrated by the guys who just like to shoot stuff...
You talk about tension but surely it's the same thing waiting for the MAC to finish building as it would be holding down 'e'; you're just swapping places.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're missing the point, Revi.
The fun part isn't hitting 'e'. The fun part is situating yourself in a position where you know you're vulnerable -- generally facing directly toward a structure and not out toward where you can shoot oncoming aliens -- yet doing it anyway because there is a reward for succeeding.
It's not at all the same thing waiting for the MAC to build, because there you're not setting yourself in a vulnerable position, if anything, you're lessening you're vulnerability because you're not moving, and you're actively watching for enemy opposition to come along.
It's not the building, per se, that's fun, it's the additional risk of knowingly being in a bad position should an alien attack and undertaking that risk for the additional reward of getting the building done to help your team. Take out the risk part, (which is what happens when you're defending the MAC) and the reward isn't as sweet.
No because that could be abused! people taking over MAC's to annoy the commander and also takes one more marine out of the battle. It actually adds two problems. The MAC's need to be commander/AI controlled and the delivery platform for buildings.
The buildtool solves those problems and also keeps the MAC's in their important role (being the delivery system of buildings). Besides I don't want to drive around with a MAC. I want to be out on the battlefield, supporting the troops and MAC's
A battle is not decided by just firepower! Support troops are just as important.
<i>
<b>Think of it this way (SC2 example)</b>
A battlegroup of medics, marines, air support, heavy tanks is way stronger then a much large zerg group of single type heavy firepower units. They may have superior firepower, but their health drain will in the end take it's tole.
In the case of the builder/weld tool, you can support the troops out on the battlefield and even add your own firepower to the battle. Which is of course crippled, but firepower none the less...
<b>Company of Heroes example</b>
A big heavy tank is much more menacing with engineers/pioneers behind it, fixing it...</i>
The MAC has the potential to remove that tension and make it boring again. What fun is it to stand next to a MAC while IT holds "e" instead of you? Most of the time you won't even be shooting stuff, because skulks still don't like rushing emplaced marines.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactly. The person building probably has the most engaged role. You have to check every vent, keep as many entrances in sight as possible and listen for alien footsteps. And you can stop building and contribute to attacking.
I love pressing 'e'. Makes me feel like I'm actually there!
-roll eyes-
-roll eyes-<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Troll more... <img src="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/smileys/trollface.gif" border="0" class="linked-image" />
I'm not trolling, Just getting tired of the poor arguments for pressing 'e'.
Oh and about people abusing things, Yeah of course people are going to be ###### and do that stuff occasionally that's why you have vote kick/admin kick/ or possible give the commander the ability to assign techies.
That suggested buildtool with my explanation will actually implement something nice into the game, which is fun for the people who want to play the game in such a way. While still keeping the shooters happy as well and keeping an eye on a few problem that might occur, when it is exactly like NS1 (pressing "e", without any mandatory equipment). And still keep the MAC's as very important building delivery units...
Pressing "e" might sound simple, as you are obviously trying to make it look. But the points made for this are valid, if you can't see this or refuse to acknowledge it. You are indeed trolling <img src="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/smileys/smile.gif" border="0" class="linked-image" />
@Killpo1
I dunno, that seems very clunky to deal with out on the battlefield with fast moving Khaara trying to kill you. Not to mention the commander deciding who is going to be a techie, that is also something they wanted to eliminate. Just let the players choose themselves, by using the armory for tools.
But what is wrong with keeping the MAC's in their building delivery role, that is exactly what they are doing right now <img src="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/smileys/biggrin.gif" border="0" class="linked-image" /> Keeping them in that role, leavesthem important enough to defend. I actually like the new system they have in mind vs the old NS1 phasing in of buildings anywhere.
They are just as valid as your argument for pressing 'w' and 'MOUSE 1'.
Some people like to build, some like to shoot, most like to do both. To be honest I think the old system was much better than this MAC thing but maybe I''m just "old school".
My guess is Revi.uk was that guy on the team that would run out and get a ton of alien kills but not help build the base or RT's because he felt it was beneath him.
My guess is Revi.uk was that guy on the team that would run out and get a ton of alien kills but not help build the base or RT's because he felt it was beneath him.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hello, what's this now?
Careful, there's no need to lower the tone of this wonderful little discussion we've got going on here.
Also, I feel like it's a little TOO easy to get MACs right now. They are really really cheap which diminishes the incentive to protect them. I think once the resource model starts to get balanced then we'll see that the commander won't spam them so freely and the marines will be more motivated to help them build around the map.
-roll eyes-<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There are another couple on this section. You're not open to ideas or discussion, either you are trolling or don't care. Its one of the two.
I'm completely open, I just don't agree. Fortunately the way I like it is already in the game so I don't have to fill this thread with accusations on a persons playing habits.
A friendly reminder here - #1 Your opinions are not what everyone else necessarily shares. #2 Just because someone else has a different opinion doesn't make it wrong - that's why they are <i>opinions</i> and not<i> facts</i>. From reading your posts it sounds like you're never satisfied with something someone else says if it doesn't agree with your <i>opinions</i>. I'm sure you're going to respond with some witty retort against me, but I was getting tired of reading this thread with your little "my way or the highway" approach. It is a discussion forum after all.
That aside, I agree with the people supporting the want-to-build option. Personally I really enjoyed the tension from the first NS of having to get the RT finished before you were bum-rushed by skulks. I also agree that skulks will be less prone to attack a group of rines if they're simply bunkered down in the corner defending the MAC.
The build tool idea sounds awesome, that way you could "specialize" particular marines to help with building (which I'm sure some people would really enjoy) while leaving the others to go fight battles around the map.
I really think either a Medic/ or a MAC ability to heal surrounding squad mates would be nice, with the appropriate balancing of course so you wouldn't have a squad of marines stand by a MAC dispensing constant health of course.
I agree it will up the survival rate, but what happens when the skulk just kills the MAC in route or the new RT is behind enemy lines? I think the MAC can have a role, but I don't like it being the only option for the team in terms of building. I really believe it takes the commanders on both sides out of the game, and it becomes a simple marines vs aliens shooter with partial convoy coverage missions.
There has to be some middle ground we can work towards in this Alpha.
A friendly reminder here - #1 Your opinions are not what everyone else necessarily shares. #2 Just because someone else has a different opinion doesn't make it wrong - that's why they are <i>opinions</i> and not<i> facts</i>. From reading your posts it sounds like you're never satisfied with something someone else says if it doesn't agree with your <i>opinions</i>. I'm sure you're going to respond with some witty retort against me, but I was getting tired of reading this thread with your little "my way or the highway" approach. It is a discussion forum after all.
That aside, I agree with the people supporting the want-to-build option. Personally I really enjoyed the tension from the first NS of having to get the RT finished before you were bum-rushed by skulks. I also agree that skulks will be less prone to attack a group of rines if they're simply bunkered down in the corner defending the MAC.
The build tool idea sounds awesome, that way you could "specialize" particular marines to help with building (which I'm sure some people would really enjoy) while leaving the others to go fight battles around the map.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually no, it's not "my way or the highway", as my way is already in the game so technically you're all along for the ride anyway. :)