Analysis of ns2_tram

yimmasabi

<div class="IPBDescription">Did you compare your map before ?</div>Nowadays I'm testing and developing my map ns2_thedron. I just wanted to see details about ns2_tram map and it is really awesome. This map may be made to overload the ns2 engine by UWE. And that explains why FPS is low and how this Max's Engine is awesome ! I obtained those numbers by filtering lights, objects only.
There are 1742 lights and this is really really awesome. If you are a 3D designer you should know what more then 5 lights are while rendering in 3D Studio Max or Lightwave, Maya etc. Numbers has also meaning when you compare with yours.

This engine also renders in realtime so this is really perfect. In one of a previous version of tram i see 400-500 lights while commanding which means it renders those 500 lights in realtime. And again I just want to say wooww !

On the otherhand 1742 lights are really big it should be reduced by UWE I think. Think your house how many lights do you have? We have 15 lights. And think factories, so number 1742 is really big here for a map imao.


ns2_tram by UWE (a playable fully detailed map including readyroom)
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7684 KB size
116090 total elements
1742 lights
6916 objects
847 entities

ns2_thedron by me (a playable less detailed version including readyroom)
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380 KB size (probably will be 1000-2000 when detailed)
7222 total elements
38 lights (I just focused on this and gonna be about 100-200 lights)
205 elements
424 objects


My map is also playable, there are readyroom, 1 base, 3 hives, 9 res nodes. There are light and dark rooms.
Am I do something wrong while selecting those objects? And what about your map stats?

and again WOOOWW ! :) Congrats UWE for the great engine again !

pSyk0mAn

Your house may have 15 direct lights, but it needs a lot more lights to fake the bouncing of light.
Really nice looking, big houses also have probably more than 15 lights :)

I'm already at around 1200 Lights and I still have to do a few corridors, a tech- and a node-room.

SN.Wolf

Is it not how many lights as to how many lights cast shadows and radius of the lights that make the true performance difference?

I found removing all prop and light shadows then going back and adding shadows at key points on lights and props boosted my frame-rate up substantially.

Until there is a final value of the cost between shadow casting and non-shadow casting lights it is kinda hard to tell in the grand scope of things what these factors will cost overall. And do the numbers include ambient lighting as well?

yimmasabi

Yes all lights included.
I have mostly ambient lights and lights at the corners of hallways which looks to the both sides of hall ways.
I didnt do anyting about disabling cast shadows but i will gonna do later.

I think ns2_tram is a limit for us. Normaly map should have less then 500 lights and should be about 2000-4000 KB for a good performance imao..

SgtBarlow

There are still lots of perforance improvements going on, on the engine side; At the same time Olmy has been trimming back on the number of shadow casting spot lights where he can without effecting the overall look too much so you find a different figure next time you check that out, hes Done a great job with managing the lights to be more efficient but still look great and for shadows to still work everywhere.

Radious/range of the light only matters greatly if its going to be a source of any shadows where there are a lot of objects in its path to cast from.

Plasma

The game's a WIP; I'd not a mapper but I would be interested in seeing maps that push the limits of the existing maps in the alpha.

Your map may be great but run poorly, which would let the UWE team have a good use case to optimize for.

Kouji_San

<!--quoteo(post=1805267:date=Nov 11 2010, 02:58 PM:name=pSyk0mAn)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pSyk0mAn @ Nov 11 2010, 02:58 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1805267"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->but it needs a lot more lights to fake the bouncing of light.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Indeed, bouncing lights is faked here though with the use of more lights in an area. Spark doesn't bounce light in realtime does it? Source's precompiled lightmaps are stilll a huge advantage to bouncing lights, less cost to make things look good at the loss of real-time lighting. Spark has is right though if it can do all of the things Source does, but the realtime!

Insane

Yes, there's no bounce lighting. That needs to be simulated.