Let's talk about resource nodes
Wheeee
Join Date: 2003-02-18 Member: 13713Members, Reinforced - Shadow
Join Date: 2003-02-18 Member: 13713Members, Reinforced - Shadow
I was reading the mapping guidelines last night, and it struck me that they state that the number of res nodes per map should be N+1 or N+2 where N is the number of tech points on the map. Just going from recollection, it seemed that the original NS had a lot more res nodes than open hive spots (e.g. tanith had 9). I realize that this is because res nodes now have upgrades to increase the rate of resource generation; but part of me wonders if this promotes turtling, because it seems like it's rather easy to tech up to end-game just on 2 upgraded res nodes. I
In NS1, a significant portion of a gorge or commander's resources went to capping and recapping nodes. At any time, perhaps only 2-4 resource nodes were "secure," and even then a particularly well-executed attack could destroy res towers that were "locked down." As a result, teams had to constantly push out and patrol territory, pressure the other team to prevent bases from being overrun. Just from my initial feel from b155, it seems like it's way too easy to lock down a base with the base node + the expansion node, then camp and defend until advanced tech becomes available. Partially this is due to static defenses being too strong right now (Whip definitely needs to be a tier 2 structure btw).
It seems to me that with only N+1 or N+2 nodes, 2 of which will be spawn area nodes, and 2 of which will probably be easily accessible/defensible expansion nodes, then there will be only 2-4 nodes to fight over, none of which will make a big impact because if territories are exchanged often, then the nodes won't have time to 1) pay for themselves or 2) be upgraded.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that I would like to see more resource nodes in play. More resource nodes means that map control is more important, giving teams an incentive to fight to take and hold territory. Anyone else?
In NS1, a significant portion of a gorge or commander's resources went to capping and recapping nodes. At any time, perhaps only 2-4 resource nodes were "secure," and even then a particularly well-executed attack could destroy res towers that were "locked down." As a result, teams had to constantly push out and patrol territory, pressure the other team to prevent bases from being overrun. Just from my initial feel from b155, it seems like it's way too easy to lock down a base with the base node + the expansion node, then camp and defend until advanced tech becomes available. Partially this is due to static defenses being too strong right now (Whip definitely needs to be a tier 2 structure btw).
It seems to me that with only N+1 or N+2 nodes, 2 of which will be spawn area nodes, and 2 of which will probably be easily accessible/defensible expansion nodes, then there will be only 2-4 nodes to fight over, none of which will make a big impact because if territories are exchanged often, then the nodes won't have time to 1) pay for themselves or 2) be upgraded.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that I would like to see more resource nodes in play. More resource nodes means that map control is more important, giving teams an incentive to fight to take and hold territory. Anyone else?
Comments
In the livestreams i watched (the one linked in a thread in the forum) it seems like khaara can rush 3 hives instantly, and thats before a single resnode's capped (atleast as far as i saw).
So i think a big problem is the resource welfare that seems to be overflowing the servers, if resources were harder to come buy, people would cherish the resnodes more and then the turfwar is automatically on its way.
Personally I believe, if there were more territories to "claim" that couldn't adequately be protected by more automated means (IPs/MGs) creating power-struggle situations, the games would be more drawn out, more action-packed and generally more entertaining.
I think 4-5 resource nodes per team is a good average. That's a natural expansion and 2-3 battleground expansions for each team. So 8-10 resource nodes total for the average game would be good.
We want a couple low resource maps to have quick rush games on (6 nodes) and a few high resource maps to have long and drawn out high tech battles on (12-15 nodes) so NS2 provides a plethora of game options.
The turtling problem will definitely be solved by NS2 identical resource systems. Allow me to prove it.
NS2 Marines can turtle just as well (or even better if you can upgrade resource towers), but aliens now reap the rewards of total resource acquisition immediately so there's no 4 minute grace period before aliens build up 50 resources each to buy a fade each. Even if NS2 Marines get one ninja JP/SG trying to set up the one ninja PG, it will be fighting whatever the aliens had before plus 3 more fades and probably 5 more whips and probably 10 more hydras. And even if they do some how beat that and ninja assault a hive and 2 resource nodes and claw back into the game barely, the aliens will have had 8 resource nodes for 2 minutes and still be at an advantage.
If the marines can over come that, it's because of luck and skill. Not because the alien's resource model is stupidly and brokenly underpowered in comparison to marines' model. And that would be a great game.
I'm so very relieved and pleased NS2 won't be that imbalanced for resource acquisition, that Unknown Worlds Entertainment has learned lessons from making a great modification and will make an even better game.
In the livestreams i watched (the one linked in a thread in the forum) it seems like khaara can rush 3 hives instantly, and thats before a single resnode's capped (atleast as far as i saw).
So i think a big problem is the resource welfare that seems to be overflowing the servers, if resources were harder to come buy, people would cherish the resnodes more and then the turfwar is automatically on its way.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
this is because it makes it 100000x easier to tech up and actually test other things then just skulk and gorge
Ono's haven't even been added yet, this is to early to judge as of yet, at least wait till all the alien classes are in.
Agree.
Ono's haven't even been added yet, this is to early to judge as of yet, at least wait till all the alien classes are in.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
naah it seems that you need 3 hives or CCs
I hope they will do a remake of tanith or veil or something, in it's original proportions.
Of course the game is not balanced yet, but plz don't let it be like Fade up after 2 minutes. Not the start has to be faster, the end as to be (in NS1 you know 10 minutes before the game ends, who the winner is).
^this
I understand that having plenty of res allows players to test/have fun with their advanced classes in the short amounts of time servers are currently stable, but in the long run either costs will have to be jacked up, res intake drastically reduced, or just nix the whole upgrading RTs.
(however, I like the idea that even a team that can only secure one RT will still have res to have a small chance)
Maps are smaller now for more intense action => no place for a RT at every corner.
Aliens are faster = its easier to get map control on big maps with lots of rts....
No phasegate anymore.
No sarcasm, I love it.