Some missing stuff
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Join Date: 2004-09-07 Member: 31483Members, NS1 Playtester, Constellation
Join Date: 2004-09-07 Member: 31483Members, NS1 Playtester, Constellation
<div class="IPBDescription">that would help and might be easy</div>More maps.
Shift: stick to walls as a skulk
Phase Gates
Siege Cannons
Fades can blink themselves out of the map, falling to infinity crashing the game.
Performance dudes, performance. Most good ns1 players i know haven't played ns2 very much because of performance issues.
commander modes don't "feel" good. They feel buggy, laggy, like, "made out of wet paper" in a strange way. It should feel more like sc2, or even ns1. Maybe thinking about sounds and click effects might help.
I think lerks need bite.
Gotta do something about the flamethrower, it's still dumb right now.
I think the gorge has been really hurt by moving all construction to the alien comm. The gorge needs to be more compelling somehow. I guess you could say that the gorge player should comm, just to take advantage of everything. That might work out, I don't know. I'm not too sure about this criticism.
Siege scenarios and all the tactics surrounding them were one of the most interesting themes in ns1. I'd like that in.
The stuff that needs the most work is the game design. I feel like development has been so focused on tools and assets that a compelling game was never developed for them to all be a part of. NS was great because the resource system made sense, it was simple and obvious, but how it actually implemented in the game was dynamic and complex. In competitive ns every second of the game counted. For instance, you knew marines were heading from MS to a hive, so you need to stop them, they start to put up a phase gate, you need to stop them, they start building a TF, you need to stop them, seiges start building up, you need to stop them, the hive is getting hit you need to stop... ect ect... Like the tension built in a compelling way, and people knew that non action in certain scenarios was deadly. It was what made it feel like a "team game" because you couldn't stop stuff like that on your own, you needed your team to be as organized and desperate as the other team, and if they were being stupid, and not playing well, you would lose because of it, and so people would help other people understand what was happening, people yelled at each other and it was amazing because people got excited enough about the game to yell. It always felt like defcon 1. The way marines walk into hives with a flamethrower in these builds is just dumb comparatively. In fact, a lot of what made ns good i feel is missing, and it was a lot of stuff that people claimed "not to like." Like that you need marines to build structures, they can't buy their own guns, that aliens did not have a comm but it's made up because of an extra person in the field. That the comm could beacon and yell to phase, and people would, and if they ran off instead, the comm would just beacon again. Ejecting commanders! Every decision made in ns1, was made for a reason that led to more compelling game play. Alien movement was a big part of that. I know a lot of people never liked bunny hopping, but everybody who was good at it did. The reason was that because the game was so tense, having a skill curve on movement as aliens was what allowed some alien players to be so much better than others. That is in ns2 as the new blink, and that is awesome, but the other aliens don't move as well as their ns counterparts. I understand all the arguments about this, but there was a reason alien teams would bhop around a map for ten minutes. Cause that exact way to bounce down a big ramp was the difference between hat tricking a pressure team, and not standing a chance. That's tantalizing.
This is Exigent's frag video. Watch this. Nadagast and PainUser are both now ranked in the top 50 north american star craft 2 players. I want you to make a game that will bring them back. This video, and feeling how it makes me feel is why I love this game.
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlZ_sZ-xXjE&feature=related" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlZ_sZ-xXjE...feature=related</a>
Now that being said I understand that this isn't ns1, and the dynamics are bound to be different and you can't think about it like the old game and all that stuff. But are you making natural selection? Do you understand what made ns1 good?
Shift: stick to walls as a skulk
Phase Gates
Siege Cannons
Fades can blink themselves out of the map, falling to infinity crashing the game.
Performance dudes, performance. Most good ns1 players i know haven't played ns2 very much because of performance issues.
commander modes don't "feel" good. They feel buggy, laggy, like, "made out of wet paper" in a strange way. It should feel more like sc2, or even ns1. Maybe thinking about sounds and click effects might help.
I think lerks need bite.
Gotta do something about the flamethrower, it's still dumb right now.
I think the gorge has been really hurt by moving all construction to the alien comm. The gorge needs to be more compelling somehow. I guess you could say that the gorge player should comm, just to take advantage of everything. That might work out, I don't know. I'm not too sure about this criticism.
Siege scenarios and all the tactics surrounding them were one of the most interesting themes in ns1. I'd like that in.
The stuff that needs the most work is the game design. I feel like development has been so focused on tools and assets that a compelling game was never developed for them to all be a part of. NS was great because the resource system made sense, it was simple and obvious, but how it actually implemented in the game was dynamic and complex. In competitive ns every second of the game counted. For instance, you knew marines were heading from MS to a hive, so you need to stop them, they start to put up a phase gate, you need to stop them, they start building a TF, you need to stop them, seiges start building up, you need to stop them, the hive is getting hit you need to stop... ect ect... Like the tension built in a compelling way, and people knew that non action in certain scenarios was deadly. It was what made it feel like a "team game" because you couldn't stop stuff like that on your own, you needed your team to be as organized and desperate as the other team, and if they were being stupid, and not playing well, you would lose because of it, and so people would help other people understand what was happening, people yelled at each other and it was amazing because people got excited enough about the game to yell. It always felt like defcon 1. The way marines walk into hives with a flamethrower in these builds is just dumb comparatively. In fact, a lot of what made ns good i feel is missing, and it was a lot of stuff that people claimed "not to like." Like that you need marines to build structures, they can't buy their own guns, that aliens did not have a comm but it's made up because of an extra person in the field. That the comm could beacon and yell to phase, and people would, and if they ran off instead, the comm would just beacon again. Ejecting commanders! Every decision made in ns1, was made for a reason that led to more compelling game play. Alien movement was a big part of that. I know a lot of people never liked bunny hopping, but everybody who was good at it did. The reason was that because the game was so tense, having a skill curve on movement as aliens was what allowed some alien players to be so much better than others. That is in ns2 as the new blink, and that is awesome, but the other aliens don't move as well as their ns counterparts. I understand all the arguments about this, but there was a reason alien teams would bhop around a map for ten minutes. Cause that exact way to bounce down a big ramp was the difference between hat tricking a pressure team, and not standing a chance. That's tantalizing.
This is Exigent's frag video. Watch this. Nadagast and PainUser are both now ranked in the top 50 north american star craft 2 players. I want you to make a game that will bring them back. This video, and feeling how it makes me feel is why I love this game.
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlZ_sZ-xXjE&feature=related" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlZ_sZ-xXjE...feature=related</a>
Now that being said I understand that this isn't ns1, and the dynamics are bound to be different and you can't think about it like the old game and all that stuff. But are you making natural selection? Do you understand what made ns1 good?
Comments
Maybe.... I find it hard to pin down the new direction sometimes, and its -still- worth commenting on what's in the game now.
I feel like I shouldn't be agreeing to this, support the troops and all, but as an avid NS1 player I agree with all of this. Do understand the devs wanting to make a different game though, for mainstream appeal.
Edit: have only played 40 hours of the new beta also.
<blockquote><b>Community:</b> OMG, work on the engine issues already</blockquote>
<b>UWE:</b> We have fixed some rather large bugs concerning server stability.
<blockquote><b>Community:</b> OMG man, work on the gameplay featues and artwork!</blockquote>
<b>UWE:</b> We're doing a holiday sale for NS2
<blockquote><b>Community:</b> RAGE!!! I just bought it...</blockquote>
<b>UWE:</b> We're going to release plushies!
<blockquote><b>Community:</b> But we want hats</blockquote>
<b>UWE:</b> We're going to let you guys have hats...
<blockquote><b>Me:</b> But I just want pantz for my Fade!</blockquote>
OVERALL you shouldnt be talking about this, this is a bit too soon.
perhaps comment about ns2 in a critical way when the final product/newest beta is out? maybe then they might talk back to you lol...
The rest is obvious.
<blockquote><b>Community:</b> OMG, work on the engine issues already</blockquote>
<b>UWE:</b> We have fixed some rather large bugs concerning server stability.
<blockquote><b>Community:</b> OMG man, work on the gameplay featues and artwork!</blockquote>
<b>UWE:</b> We're doing a holiday sale for NS2
<blockquote><b>Community:</b> RAGE!!! I just bought it...</blockquote>
<b>UWE:</b> We're going to release plushies!
<blockquote><b>Community:</b> But we want hats</blockquote>
<b>UWE:</b> We're going to let you guys have hats...
<blockquote><b>Me:</b> But I just want pantz for my Fade!</blockquote><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Lol. Sad and true. :(
That was the worst wall of text I've read in a long while.All you basically did was complain that NS2 is not identical to NS1 yet. It's a beta. Ideas are good, but not squashed inside a mountain of gibbering whining when the developers are actually looking for useful feedback on the current feature set.
Take the ranged ability away from the Lerk and you gimp the entire Alien team. The Lerk is way to valuable as a ranged class right now. Give it both bite and spikes/spores and it becomes an over powered class. Lerk is fine the way it is.
And sorry I agree with everyone else...this post is useless.
I bought NS2 because it will be different from NS1, not a carbon copy on a new engine. UWE said this a lot, and I want this. It should be a new concept based on NS1, but with new strategies and things to learn.
Most people that want the exact same thing as in NS1 don't want to learn anything new, they want to jump on the game and play the same way they did for the past 5 years. And for some suggestions I have read around, they want a console game, something that is played by itself.
Of course, the game still needs a lot of work on every aspect of it, but it don't need to downgraded to NS1.
Most people here barely scratched the surface what NS1 had to offer and explaining stuff gets you ignored the part you skipped explaining the "warm welcome" so far.
What key bind?
I want skulks to be more sticky.
I'm not playtesting ns2, I was in the ns1 playtesters group. I was invited to that after writing a comprehensive guide to commanding in competitive league ns. My teams went undefeated in the last 2 regular seasons we played, and I comm'd for team usa in the ns world cup for 2 years. I've only played 4-6 hours of ns2.
<!--quoteo(post=1819174:date=Dec 24 2010, 06:29 PM:name=glimmerman)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (glimmerman @ Dec 24 2010, 06:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1819174"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->terrible post. seeing as almost all of that stuff is meant to be in anyway, I would say that if they could put it in the game already it would already be there.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Great, I haven't gone back through all the talk and everything about what is and isn't planned for ns2. I'm commenting on the game that is installed on my computer now, and that's it.
<!--quoteo(post=1819181:date=Dec 24 2010, 07:04 PM:name=_Thresh_)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (_Thresh_ @ Dec 24 2010, 07:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1819181"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->as an avid NS1 player I agree with all of this.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
thanks, it's nice to know I'm not totally nuts.
<!--quoteo(post=1819252:date=Dec 25 2010, 02:03 AM:name=louis cardinal)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (louis cardinal @ Dec 25 2010, 02:03 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1819252"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->my eye balls almost exploded, i copy and pasted your huge chunk of text and paragraphed it in parts so i could read it.
OVERALL you shouldnt be talking about this, this is a bit too soon.
perhaps comment about ns2 in a critical way when the final product/newest beta is out? maybe then they might talk back to you lol...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Dude, we're in "Beta." Usually software betas are more or less feature complete, and it's bug squashing time to polish something to present to the public. This is the time to say critical things. I'm not cloaking or hedging my criticisms I'm stating them plainly so that hopefully they are considered without too much bs getting in the way. I understand ns2 might not be feature complete, but shouldn't it be?
Also in a good game of natural selection, there is no time to worry about "paragraph breaks", it's always as fast as a stream of consciousness, and that breathlessness was what I was trying to convey with the big paragraph. But hey, I'm not a poet or an English major.
<!--quoteo(post=1819293:date=Dec 25 2010, 03:46 AM:name=SafetyHelmet)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SafetyHelmet @ Dec 25 2010, 03:46 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1819293"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That was the worst wall of text I've read in a long while.All you basically did was complain that NS2 is not identical to NS1 yet. It's a beta. Ideas are good, but not squashed inside a mountain of gibbering whining when the developers are actually looking for useful feedback on the current feature set.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1819460:date=Dec 26 2010, 12:09 AM:name=PaiSand)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PaiSand @ Dec 26 2010, 12:09 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1819460"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Please don't, not another "make NS2 = NS1" thread.
I bought NS2 because it will be different from NS1, not a carbon copy on a new engine. UWE said this a lot, and I want this. It should be a new concept based on NS1, but with new strategies and things to learn.
Most people that want the exact same thing as in NS1 don't want to learn anything new, they want to jump on the game and play the same way they did for the past 5 years. And for some suggestions I have read around, they want a console game, something that is played by itself.
Of course, the game still needs a lot of work on every aspect of it, but it don't need to downgraded to NS1.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Don't be silly you two. If you're making a sequel to a game, you better know what made the first one good. And THAT is not quite there right now. That's all. I thought since I played a lot at a very high level of play, I might be able to share what I think about that.
<!--quoteo(post=1819367:date=Dec 25 2010, 11:46 AM:name=OPIE)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (OPIE @ Dec 25 2010, 11:46 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1819367"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Take the ranged ability away from the Lerk and you gimp the entire Alien team. The Lerk is way to valuable as a ranged class right now. Give it both bite and spikes/spores and it becomes an over powered class. Lerk is fine the way it is.
And sorry I agree with everyone else...this post is useless.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The lerk has gone back and forth between spikes/spore vs bite/spore, and in ns1, they settled on bite/spore and no spikes. I like it better that way, but I understand what you're saying. With spikes instead of bite, a lerk will have a hard time killing a medspammed marine. If your fade goes down, you're not left with a higher level alien that can really deal with 2 marines and guns/meds.
There's a lot of hate around here for people that feel disappointed with the state of things. The truth is that the state of things is a little disappointing to me, BUT I BELIEVE THEY CAN DO IT. I'm not trying to be a ######, and I wish the best for the game and the developers. If ns2 releases in a state near where it is now, I wont be happy with it, and I will not spend much time on it. That's all there is to it. Ya'll can think and do whatever you want. I just thought my input might be considerable.
This is coming from someone who played ns more than just about anybody, and was a top ranked player. I joined the constellation early, I was a playtester, and I purchased ns2 18 months ago. I've been a pretty solid card carrying member of the ns community for years and years, and I hope to still be years and years from now but that is contingent on there being a good, fun, game to play... I mean, right? I would hope the developers would value my thoughts and I do wish them well on this project because I hope to enjoy the product of their very hard work for years to come.
I want skulks to be more sticky.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
In ns1, when you press shift a skulk will stick to the wall no matter what. The main thing is you can go around 90 degree corners with it.
There's just something wrong with that.
Oh, and in fact in addition to spikes they also have spores, which are some serious area denial. Its damage is nothing to scoff at, either. And it's also ranged.
Please put that at the beginning of your wall of text next time. Thank you.
My game is so bugged (seriously, that graphics glitch needs to be fixed) that I actually can't "play" for more than half an hour at a time. What I've learned from my sessions is:
Lerk is superior to marines at range.
One good fade will give you some serious grief.
Red emergency lighting is ugly.
Skulk movement isn't very good, or I'm just ###### and I need practice.
"Booking" it is actually quite useful.
It's just two long, winding corridors out of marine start.
It's hard to aim with Lerk while flying, so just fly at someone's back and spike them to death.
People don't like to own up to being the cause of server lag due to hydra spam.
Flamethrower wrecks aliens, too bad I haven't been able to try it myself, because of a graphics glitch.
Not being able to see anything 50% of the time due to the aforementioned graphics glitch makes it very hard to play.
I die a little inside everytime I have to type 'kill' into the console.
...among other things.
And I know all this with less than 3 hours of actual playtime.
Losing the classic NS feel is basically the same feeling as when they introduced combat mode, and that was a terrible feeling.
Shift: stick to walls as a skulk
Phase Gates
Siege Cannons
Fades can blink themselves out of the map, falling to infinity crashing the game.
Performance dudes, performance. Most good ns1 players i know haven't played ns2 very much because of performance issues.
commander modes don't "feel" good. They feel buggy, laggy, like, "made out of wet paper" in a strange way. It should feel more like sc2, or even ns1. Maybe thinking about sounds and click effects might help.
I think lerks need bite.
Gotta do something about the flamethrower, it's still dumb right now.
I think the gorge has been really hurt by moving all construction to the alien comm. The gorge needs to be more compelling somehow. I guess you could say that the gorge player should comm, just to take advantage of everything. That might work out, I don't know. I'm not too sure about this criticism.
Siege scenarios and all the tactics surrounding them were one of the most interesting themes in ns1. I'd like that in.
The stuff that needs the most work is the game design. I feel like development has been so focused on tools and assets that a compelling game was never developed for them to all be a part of. NS was great because the resource system made sense, it was simple and obvious, but how it actually implemented in the game was dynamic and complex. In competitive ns every second of the game counted. For instance, you knew marines were heading from MS to a hive, so you need to stop them, they start to put up a phase gate, you need to stop them, they start building a TF, you need to stop them, seiges start building up, you need to stop them, the hive is getting hit you need to stop... ect ect... Like the tension built in a compelling way, and people knew that non action in certain scenarios was deadly. It was what made it feel like a "team game" because you couldn't stop stuff like that on your own, you needed your team to be as organized and desperate as the other team, and if they were being stupid, and not playing well, you would lose because of it, and so people would help other people understand what was happening, people yelled at each other and it was amazing because people got excited enough about the game to yell. It always felt like defcon 1. The way marines walk into hives with a flamethrower in these builds is just dumb comparatively. In fact, a lot of what made ns good i feel is missing, and it was a lot of stuff that people claimed "not to like." Like that you need marines to build structures, they can't buy their own guns, that aliens did not have a comm but it's made up because of an extra person in the field. That the comm could beacon and yell to phase, and people would, and if they ran off instead, the comm would just beacon again. Ejecting commanders! Every decision made in ns1, was made for a reason that led to more compelling game play. Alien movement was a big part of that. I know a lot of people never liked bunny hopping, but everybody who was good at it did. The reason was that because the game was so tense, having a skill curve on movement as aliens was what allowed some alien players to be so much better than others. That is in ns2 as the new blink, and that is awesome, but the other aliens don't move as well as their ns counterparts. I understand all the arguments about this, but there was a reason alien teams would bhop around a map for ten minutes. Cause that exact way to bounce down a big ramp was the difference between hat tricking a pressure team, and not standing a chance. That's tantalizing.
This is Exigent's frag video. Watch this. Nadagast and PainUser are both now ranked in the top 50 north american star craft 2 players. I want you to make a game that will bring them back. This video, and feeling how it makes me feel is why I love this game.
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlZ_sZ-xXjE&feature=related" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlZ_sZ-xXjE...feature=related</a>
Now that being said I understand that this isn't ns1, and the dynamics are bound to be different and you can't think about it like the old game and all that stuff. But are you making natural selection? Do you understand what made ns1 good?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
you realise this is a beta? at least 6 months from being finished...