Amazing Power node improvement idea! Very subtle, but amazing
JaMrulezass
Join Date: 2010-04-10 Member: 71296Members, WC 2013 - Silver
Join Date: 2010-04-10 Member: 71296Members, WC 2013 - Silver
<div class="IPBDescription">When biting, you should take some damage from the electricity</div>It seems like its a tad bit too easy for the aliens to just run around in every single room and eat up all the power nodes.
An idea i think would work very well was for the skulks or any lifeform for that matter, to take a TINY bit of damage, say like 1 - 2 DPS whilst meeleing it, it would be great, it would even open the possibility for the commander to upgrade like "electric resistant genes" or something since this is NATURAL SELECTION, there is evolution. It could like, take reduce power node inflicted dmg by like 50% or something, just an idea.
An idea i think would work very well was for the skulks or any lifeform for that matter, to take a TINY bit of damage, say like 1 - 2 DPS whilst meeleing it, it would be great, it would even open the possibility for the commander to upgrade like "electric resistant genes" or something since this is NATURAL SELECTION, there is evolution. It could like, take reduce power node inflicted dmg by like 50% or something, just an idea.
Comments
Nice idea :)
Its a bad idea if you consider the common reward / punishment systems in games whereby you learn the 'rules' , example a Marine will learn that a Hydra is a bad thing because he take damage from it ... what would you be teaching a new player if they bite a power node and take damage from it ?
Yes , NS1 had the electrify upgrade to marine structures and that use to confuse me as a new player until I found out in chat what it was, but it wasnt intuitive as the Aliens are melee heavy and its a valid strategy to attack critical structures so it was counter to the flow of the game I thought... basically the Aliens were been ' punished ' for meleeing enemy structures, wth :P
Prehaps a better alternative would be to allow the Marine Commander to place structures near the Power Node that electrify the power node casing , then the Aliens would need to attack the structure first then the node ( as a advanced research tech ).
also like to add: as the node gets more damaged, the dmg increases at the end
and maybe a final shock as it dies
@ASnogarD new players will have played a tutorial and/or see what teammates are doing
I mean, where is the problem exactly? There are 2 situations where aliens eat the powernodes:
Marine occupied room. Here the simple fact that you look at the powernode and make a lot of noise is danger enough, no need to add additional damage.
Empty room. Here again it is dangerous because you look at the powernode, but you also don't support any attack/defense during that time (it takes some time to bite those powernodes down).
In addition, the fact that the aliens take down the powernodes of unnoccupied rooms is currently the replacement for DI, it adds to the atmosphere of the game that the marines have to conquer the map from a infestated alien zone.
We can talk about increasing the time it takes to get it down, but if a single skulk cannot take down a powernode because he will die, or will be near dead, then thats not a fun game mechanic
And if its something of an add-on that is a partial implementation of the electrified buildings from Ns1, something I kinda liked anyway. Nodes that are not equipped with the electrified case would not be electrified then meaning the side that is outside of marines control would be taken out early in the game as usual.
P.S writing on a smartphone on a train back home, living the future!
also like to add: as the node gets more damaged, the dmg increases at the end
and maybe a final shock as it dies
@ASnogarD new players will have played a tutorial and/or see what teammates are doing<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You have to admit its isnt intuitive, imagine a player starting as a Skulk , runs around the map and see a bright glowing object on the wall ... the help text is telling the player its a power node , destroy this to power down marine structures.
Skulks can only bite down on things so the player takes a chomp, and take damage.
I dont know about you but if I was taking damage I immediately stop what I am doing to work out why am I taking damage.
Have you also considered that taking damage is usually the only warning a Skulk gets that he is under attack from a Marine when biting on a power node ?
It may be my system, but I cant hear the marines footsteps or gunfire while chomping on a power node.
Out of curiosity why is it required to prevent skulks from biting power nodes ?
On the <b>proper</b> maps there will be too many areas or too long a distance for skulks to power down a significant portion of the grid in a timely fashion, definetly not possible to bite down all the nodes before the Marines are able to move out. Mid to late game Lerks and Fades will make the damage a none factor, all it does is hinder early Alien expansion which when DI is implemented will give the Marines a unfair advantage.
... and as Asraniel pointed out, biting power nodes means less Skulks on offence/defence.
I, for one, would then insist that the devs make it that Alien structures bleed acid when struck, ensuring that Marines in melee range of a structure taking damage will get acid splash damage, to balance the electrify power node suggestion :P
I'm not a fan of simple damage based balance, because balance quickly becomes about numbers rather than say, movement or the ability to sneak up on people. For this reason it is harder to see what this change brings to the game because it is not 'physically' obvious.
I'd rather for instance, see marines have more powerful weapons - but make aliens faster. Rather then thinking 'if damage x > damage Y then how does a marine vs alien 1on1 in the whole marine vs skulk balance issue play out'.
You are overcomplicating a situation that is already complicated. Now you have to balance the damage of a skulk vs marine situation + time taken to take down a power node to secure a room + damage taken from the power node. Oh, + how much damage has already been taken from fighting a marine in that room.
See what I mean?
Would maybe need something to combat lerks too; perhaps the electric field could 1/3 the strength of a lerk shot.
Its a bad idea if you consider the common reward / punishment systems in games whereby you learn the 'rules' , example a Marine will learn that a Hydra is a bad thing because he take damage from it ... what would you be teaching a new player if they bite a power node and take damage from it ?
Yes , NS1 had the electrify upgrade to marine structures and that use to confuse me as a new player until I found out in chat what it was, but it wasnt intuitive as the Aliens are melee heavy and its a valid strategy to attack critical structures so it was counter to the flow of the game I thought... basically the Aliens were been ' punished ' for meleeing enemy structures, wth :P
Prehaps a better alternative would be to allow the Marine Commander to place structures near the Power Node that electrify the power node casing , then the Aliens would need to attack the structure first then the node ( as a advanced research tech ).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I really don't get the point. So in Quake you didn't shoot enemies, because they shot back - until you chatted with other players? And in Half-Life you ran around as pacifist because aliens could hurt you?
I'm sorry, but
1. people aren't that stupid
2. we are not horses. a human knows what an electric fence is and even children play around with it.
3. if you want people to understand everything in the game without thinking once (well, I don't want a game like that) there is the possibility of tool tips. ( "bite that even if it hurts a bit" - problem solved)
4. tell me how a commander learns what an observatory does without thinking or asking or reading.
Edit: I didn't want to sound that offensive. I'm sorry, but also too lazy to rewrite ;)
Well, some people try to pee on it ;) well I never did.
But if the fence belongs to an enemy I want to annoy, yes I would just grab the little thing and rip it away, because I know that it only (metaphoric) makes me lose one health - but the enemy has to repair it and gets annoyed/weakened.
Being honest, when someone secures things, I know it is important for him. And if he is my enemy, it is important for me to destroy it. That was what I thought the first time I saw electrical defense in NS1. So I destroyed it. Ok, maybe we are talking about stats-######s *; but you can never avoid them.
Edit: * stats-prostitutes
Edit 2: cool, that works.
Edit 3: Ah, a failure in argumentation. True, the electric kills me when I try do destroy it. But I'd do damage to it anyways - because I want to win the war. It's not reallife, dying as a skulk won't hurt me.
Just say that the player is one of those very rare specimins that dont read manuals or use the tutorials, imagine that players reaction if that player melee attacks a power node and takes damage.
Me ? I would back off and think, well biting this hurts me so there must be some other way of taking this object out...
... prehaps I am just stupid.
When you design games you need to take into consideration the feedback your game gives to its players, take Minecraft for instance ... its not logical to take a bucket and go scoop up the origin of lava so you can take it away, but in the gameworld its acceptable and as your bucket didnt immediately turn to moltem iron and melt your hands off you as a player learn this can be done.
... besides there is other factors to consider as well, like why ? Currently all the nodes belong to the marines at the start of the game, when DI is in the game ( if I understand how DI works ) the DI wont be able to enter a room with the power node active ( nanobites holding the DI back ) so destroying nodes will be a requirement to expansion.
Requiring Skulks to half kill themselves just to take down a uncontested node is an unfair ask, and the difficulty is amplified if Marines are present to contest the Node.
At the start of the round, no rooms have power, except for marine start, and each unpowered room is like a blank canvass. It could become kharaa territory or it could become TSA territory.
Marine buildings can only be built in powered rooms, and likewise alien buildings can only be placed on DI. (of course there would be tricks for each team, like the mobile power node which you could bring in and quickly power up some turrets, even while DI is still in the room - and of course something similar for aliens, like gorges creating temporary clumps of infestation in a powered area)
This way you don't spend so much time in RED lighting environment, as the DI would give off an orangy greeny misty alien glow - while TSA area's are brightly light as they are now. THe only RED areas would be the ones that are "uncaptured"
So at the start of the round if the marines want to go and build in another room, they first have to go there and power it up, and kharaa will also have to spread the DI there. (or use gorge infestation ability or the mobile power node)
I think it would give the game a real ping-pong style gameplay, while allowing for some really cool tactics to break up stalemates (like gorges sneaking into a powered area and putting in DI and then creating a "canal"/portal/nidus worm to allow the aliens to come through for a suprise attack) (or marines bringing a portable power node into a hive, clearing out some DI with the flamethrower and then quickly placing down some turrets to secure the location without actually attacking the hive until they are fortified.)
The marines still would be able to power up any room in any order - but the aliens possibly might have to wait for the DI to grow out from each hive point, BUT it also doesn't dissappear naturally, so once aliens have a room the marines have to clear it out with flamethrowers. So while the marines have the speed, the aliens have a momentum based spread of alien horror :)
At the same time I've been intrigued by the speed at which Aliens run around killing every Power Node at the start. Sure it delays them from hitting Marines directly, but there's also a distinct pressure of "oh gods the Aliens are suddenly taking over the map, we need to get out there and stop them."