What did you do?!?
<div class="IPBDescription">or... what did UWE do, to Ns2_tram</div>So, the last time I played tram(probably a few patches ago, since no one plays it anymore) even if it wasnt the best layout for a map, it was playable, in the sense you could finish a game. So I wanted to get a feel for some of the map again, and wow, my video card cant even handle the map anymore. It wont load half of the entities, there is significant lag with just me on the server, and the console just keeps spewing out "not enough video memory" errors. So, I was thinkin maybe they expanded the map when I wasnt payin attention. But, to my disappointment, upon loading the editor, they did not expand it (except a tiny bit in observation) So anyways, looking at it from a map editor's POV, it would seem like they were working on optimizing things, since things were much better organized in the layers and such, since the last time I looked at it in the editor. So my question is, why the video errors? The size of the file is a bit larger than summit, but not vastly. And the map size compared to summit is probably very close, if not smaller than Summit. And from what I looked at in the editor, it didnt seem like they went nuts on props or geo... so... im just wondering what the issue is, since its not apparent, at a glance anyways.
My video card really isnt up to snuff, but its reasonable, at least to play on summit, so just what did they change in tram to make my video card cry :( he didnt deserve it!
My video card really isnt up to snuff, but its reasonable, at least to play on summit, so just what did they change in tram to make my video card cry :( he didnt deserve it!
Comments
Try running around the map using:
cheats 1
r_wireframe 1
To see what is being rendered behind the walls, which should not be visible.
If whoever has these issues wants to give some proper feedback try loading Tram after a fresh restart of NS2 (and maybe even reboot to be sure) and compare it to loading Tram after playing Summit or Rockdown without restarting NS2.
It might even be worth checking if this is connected to the level in the Main Menu. I'm not sure if one can load NS2 without the Main Menu Background level by using a command or wether it's possible to just delete/rename the .level to get a black background or something without errors.
Edit: You can rename the menu.level in /ns2/maps/ and the main_menu.cinematics in /ns2/cinematics/ so the game doesn't load them, but I don't think it'll help.
ie: "somedrive\Steam\SteamApps\common\natural selection 2\NS2.exe" map ns2_sample-build179
O________O
Same exact thing happens to me when I try to play on this map. Its really wierd. Unplayable. Missing graphics, broken scorboard same old thing. And that is if it even can load the map lol.
[edit]
I can load it and it runs in between roughly 18-35FPS... You guys sure you ain't got a botched up ns2_tram?
Filesize: 8,55 MB (8.968.175 bytes)
Sounds quite similar when I try running NS2 at high quality on my HD4850 512Mb, models don't load and most likely the game just outright crashes. Lack of Vram is my problem and the reason I can't play it on anything higher then medium
I tried to gather some information to find the crux of the matter. At first I looked for a place with many draw calls in summit and I think such place is the alien start:
<img src="http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8054606/2011-09-01_00001.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Almost 2000 draw calls but it still runs very smooth (36 fps). At the most times on summit I'am around 1000 draw calls.
and now lets check for tram:
<img src="http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8054606/tram_check.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
At first you see I had to use my digital camera to make that "screenshot" because there wasn't enough graphic ram for taking it with steam or fraps.
I got 4000 draw calls in that tram tunnel and also usually around 2000 calls on other places in Tram.
My conclusion about that results: Trams layout/geometry is to open compared to summit which is quite contorted. Also its geometry is to complex (to much details like pipes etc.). An open geometry means there is not much for occlusion culling to do to reduce that load. At last I think there are to much textures loaded in Tram.
Possibly solutions for tram:
<ul><li>more barriers to help occlusion culling</li><li>reduce world complexity</li><li>reduce texture usage</li></ul>
But maybe I'am misreading some data, further comments much appreciated!
It is kind of odd that tram works fine in the editor for me tho, if the reason is just because of overdetailing... although it helps that most of the map has been reorganized and each section can be turned off in layers.
There are two more things:
-There are very short spikes in the draw calls when moving your view or position that suggest that the engine takes more in than necessary for a few ms (you can't see additional stuff popping up in wireframe mode though), which I think is due to all the gaps in Tram's geometry filled with props
This issue sometimes blends in with the 2nd one below due to similar effects on drawcalls.
-It's not only open geometry and long view distance, but too much of that and too much detail in different directions. This means, when you change your view or position the engine renders what comes ahead of you + the stuff you just saw, which can double the draw calls in some areas resulting in fps spikes.
You can test this by slowly moving and checking draw calls and then do fast rapid movement:
-Strafing and slightly turning from Alien Start to its tram tunnel entrance and back while watching in hive direction
-or standing near the wall in the middle of dbl-res (repair room) and moving your view from the one entrance to the other (~180°) and back.
An LOD system is almost imperative if UWE wants Spark to be able to support outside maps too (that doesn't necessarily mean just NS2, but any Spark-created game). Spark in all it's glory, would die if it attempted to render something like a city, or village.