Playing old builds

Racer1

Due to NS2 using Steam for updates/distribution, players are basically forced to use the most recent version of the game (once they have updated). This means it is very difficult for UW to make a "work in progress" release with certain features missing, since it could potentially break the only playable build -- we have seen this in the past.

If players could playtest a new build while being able to somehow revert to an old build when desired, it would provide much more freedom to the developers and players alike.

Possible solutions:

1. Have two separate NS2 "games", one that follows the development releases, and one that follows the beta releases.

2. Deliver each new release with two versions of the game. One would be the last stable "beta" release, and the other could be the most recent public "development" release. Once a release is development release is determined high enough to be beta quality, it would become the new beta release.

3. Provide a built-in mechanism to back-up each delivered release on the client. Players could choose to restore whichever version they want. The steam auto-update mechanism might have to be disabled for NS2 while playing old versions.

(Of course, servers would have to be set up to run the desired versions, but that is a different issue).

I don't know the effort involved in these, and don't want UW to spend much time working on it either. However, if we are talking about another year of development (wild guess), with potential for many game-breaking releases, this might be worth thinking about.

Kouji_San

The system you're proposing is what quite similar to what's used for the internal play test builds, the result of which you can follow on the <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/progress" target="_blank">NS2 development progress page</a>. However to at least have some control on feedback and not get swamped by duplicate reports, a dedicated smaller internal team is preferred as the dev team has way more control and also has a better overview on what's going on with the things they implement for testing purposes. And it will also give the dev team the possibility to test "secret" content, because the internal builds are a NDA

It's best to have a working version out there for the public so the game is enjoyed for what it is and report bugs or provide feedback on features from that version. This way the devs can use that info and work internally on that stuff if it rhymes with their ideas.


I'd also expect bad publicity and a splitting of the community if you have players on different and potentially buggy/game breaking versions of the game :/

Dghelneshi

So, instead of having 1-2 full servers at a time and having discussion on current gameplay, you want to have 1-2 half-full servers in two seperate games and make discussion extremely difficult and confusing due to people playing different states of the game?

Public alpha testing just doesn't work. People will complain all the time that the newest version won't run and the older, stable one, is sooooo boring and that there is noone playing either version.

Grizzy

<!--quoteo(post=1886330:date=Nov 23 2011, 07:54 PM:name=Dghelneshi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dghelneshi @ Nov 23 2011, 07:54 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1886330"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->People will complain all the time<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Fixed it for you.

Racer1

I'm not talking about making the internal test builds public.

This provides UW with the ability to make more frequent releases to the public if desired, without having to worry so much about problems. You may recall recent <u>public</u> builds that caused serious issues. This is expected in a beta. However, if it was possible for players to revert to an earlier build (for whatever reason), then UW wouldn't have to spend so much time polishing beta releases, and the process would presumably go faster.

I also disagree with "public alpha testing doesn't work". If managed properly, public testing of under-development software is possible. You just have to do a good job of managing both the people and the process -- something that my idea attempts to address.

konata

This will slow development.

Ergo, I give this a -10 and not a +1.

Grizzy

<!--quoteo(post=1886335:date=Nov 23 2011, 08:04 PM:name=Racer1)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Racer1 @ Nov 23 2011, 08:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1886335"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm not talking about making the internal test builds public.

This provides UW with the ability to make more frequent releases to the public if desired, without having to worry so much about problems. You may recall recent <u>public</u> builds that caused serious issues. This is expected in a beta. However, if it was possible for players to revert to an earlier build (for whatever reason), then UW wouldn't have to spend so much time polishing beta releases, and the process would presumably go faster.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Dude ... go do some research on progress and success.

Grizzy

<!--quoteo(post=1886335:date=Nov 23 2011, 08:04 PM:name=Racer1)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Racer1 @ Nov 23 2011, 08:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1886335"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I also disagree with "public alpha testing doesn't work". If managed properly, public testing of under-development software is possible. You just have to do a good job of managing both the people and the process -- something that my idea attempts to address.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Who in the current UWE team would have time to manage a large scale alpha beta test?

There is a set team that does the actual testing for progress builds, which is more than enough to find the issues in new releases of the minute proportions they are. That doesn't mean the UWE don't listen to the general public of the testers. My bet is that if UWE had an other way, there would not be this so called ''public alpha test''.

Dghelneshi

<!--quoteo(post=1886335:date=Nov 23 2011, 07:04 PM:name=Racer1)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Racer1 @ Nov 23 2011, 07:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1886335"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm not talking about making the internal test builds public.

This provides UW with the ability to make more frequent releases to the public if desired, without having to worry so much about problems. You may recall recent <u>public</u> builds that caused serious issues. This is expected in a beta. However, if it was possible for players to revert to an earlier build (for whatever reason), then UW wouldn't have to spend so much time polishing beta releases, and the process would presumably go faster.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If UWE doesn't polish as much, NO version will be playable. Also, what would be the reason for frequent updates if noone gets to play them anyway? There won't be enough players to populate the servers, especially with a very unstable build (be it technically or gameplay-wise).

We also still have the problem of a divided community, making everything confusing and probably annoying everyone a lot more than just being able to play one build at a time. Especially new and/or less tech-savvy players would be absolutely confused by the process and complain about unplayable builds.
UWE will also have bug reports and gameplay discussions from multiple builds all over the place, making it very hard for them to listen to community input, too.

Floodinator

Disable auto update on steam, if a new build comes out copy the NS2 folder and reactivate autoupdates. Now you have 2 playable versions of the game. If you team/clanmates do the same you can open a server and play on a older build.