A step in the right direction with fades
Xostean
Join Date: 2012-02-17 Member: 146370Members
Join Date: 2012-02-17 Member: 146370Members
<div class="IPBDescription">you have my approval</div>I know this patch is not exactly universally loved but i think the direction the devs have taken with the fade is good.
I like that the fade can no longer strafe in blink. But at the same time Shadow step can be a very dangerous tool if used correctly. It is also a huge help that we can now see where the fade travels while in blink.
After playing about 5 matches ive come to the conclusion that with the fade update they are much easier to kill, but not so easy that they cant still go on a bloody rampage.
What is your guy's thoughts? Do you feel this update has made them Overpowered, Underpowered, or Balanced (not to imply that its 100% perfect)
I like that the fade can no longer strafe in blink. But at the same time Shadow step can be a very dangerous tool if used correctly. It is also a huge help that we can now see where the fade travels while in blink.
After playing about 5 matches ive come to the conclusion that with the fade update they are much easier to kill, but not so easy that they cant still go on a bloody rampage.
What is your guy's thoughts? Do you feel this update has made them Overpowered, Underpowered, or Balanced (not to imply that its 100% perfect)
Comments
Balance can be tweaked outside of movement changes. I felt like fades were previously balanced, just an overwhelming majority of marines and comms did not know how to fight them. I do like the new, longer cooldown on swipe coming out of a blink.
The new side stepping I do not like. And I was a UT2k4 player for many years.
Really?
Well that is unfortunate, I think its in balance that they cant use 100% precise movement while being invisible and immune to all damage.
<!--quoteo(post=1909371:date=Mar 2 2012, 09:01 PM:name=Schimmel)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Schimmel @ Mar 2 2012, 09:01 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1909371"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i was playing UT only a few months and was actually never a big fan of that double tap mechanic. we are trying now another approach: use shift + movement direciton for shadow step. the ability has now also a soft cooldown. that means when you shadow step within 2 seconds it's effectiveness will be reduced. so you can still perform a shadow step as often as before, but it will be simply less effective in case you spam it<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And that is awesome to hear (the DR).
That is a good plan, I think. I was actually just sitting here talking with rantology about how awkward the double tap side step is and randomly imagined using it with shift + direction. It will definitely be more controllable that way.
I also feel like the fade keeps a little too much momentum coming out of the blinks, but that may just be some relearning for me.
Sounds like you never played NS1. Aliens have to be able to traverse the map quickly, the fade most of all.
<!--quoteo(post=1909368:date=Mar 3 2012, 02:53 AM:name=GORGEous)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GORGEous @ Mar 3 2012, 02:53 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1909368"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->My problem with 199 fade changes is that it makes playing fade feel loose and unprecise. Fade movement was previously very intuitive and precise. Now it's awkward and reminds me of my old EQ1 mount. I understand maintaining momentum can be helpful for fighting jetpacks, but for 98% of the other things you'll be doing as fade, it sucks.
Balance can be tweaked outside of movement changes. I felt like fades were previously balanced, just an overwhelming majority of marines and comms did not know how to fight them.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The momentum for me is great for travel. I hated the old blink because you would run out of energy from one room the the other and have to walk most times. Really lame. It would be like a lerk without glide and having to flap constantly to keep you aloft. The lerk would turn into a skulk that could jump real high lol.
I really loved the ns1 fade. Skills meshed well and properly played you were not only an awesome killing machine but it felt great playing the class, mastering the cohesion of skills with your playstyle. I think the invul blink looks awesome but is terrible for game play. I also hate the "cloak" view but thats another thread. In the future i think more players will get annoyed with it as i am as aneedless immersion element that only looks good on promotional videos.
But eh, i still want NS1:Spark and stil have a hard time of letting go =p
I'm used to play with the fade mod which has almost no delays, so I might be biased, but I found very hard to hit jetpacks. Delays should be removed anyway, simply because they feel bad. There is other ways to balance the fade, for example the energy cost, it's 50 in vanilla and 250 in the fade mod.
The drain is calculated very differently from the fade mod to the vanilla fade.
Those two numbers can't really be related anymore because of that.
some workarounds to solve the issue:
<ul><li>greater momentum such as in your mod allows the fade to be visible for longer periods of time out of blink, allowing the marine a chance to fight.
this greater momentum also makes sneaky, subtle, positioning behind a marine more difficult, and allows you get JPers that much easier.
</li><li><b>have a very obvious and loud "blinking travel sound" for an audio cue of general detection</b> instead of the "poof" out of blink which usually means <i>you are too late! </i>(think of the trade off with the skulk's leap, you can hear it coming.)</li></ul>
if you implement these then there is no need for a frustrating delay.
At this point though, the overall balance of the fade may benefit from an increased energy cost. Allowing the user to decide, should I blink for initiation, or save it for an escape. As it stands a fade can 2 shot a marine, and stands to live against a quick hit and run vs 4 marines.
Add carapace and regen to the mix and you have an unstoppable killing machine.
Overall I love the way the fade plays and feels, but as a regular Kharaa player I feel like marines don't have much they can do at this point if fades are gotten early.
It can be said that if marines are properly played they can prevent this from happening, etc etc. But with skulk mobility its too easy as kharaa to prevent a marine advance, especially if the game is not quite as populated, for example 5v5.
Marines don't become mobile until JP's and phase, which I feel are relatively expensive to acquire in the amount of time it takes for fades to be produced.
This is all very situational, and the same can be said if marines push quickly, and prevent an alien advance. But on the overall as an alien player I feel that we generally have the advantage.
It happens so often for me, maybe it's because the way I play, that I almost stopped playing it. But when I play him it's nice to use shadowstep to gain momentum for speedblinks (great movement/atack delay chance), and his general new speed in higher rooms.
Dare I say this again (I know it's been brought up a million times), but when they fix performance issues and people are trying to hit the fade with 40+ FPS instead of 10-20 I think they will be going down a lot more often as well. Marines are so much more deadly when they can actually aim :P