Upgrade "farms" idea
Imbalanxd
Join Date: 2011-06-15 Member: 104581Members
Join Date: 2011-06-15 Member: 104581Members
<div class="IPBDescription">some gameplay aspects, more cinematic though</div>So after reading about the new upgrade structure change for aliens, it got me thinking. I didn't entirely like the old system, but I think I like the idea of the new system less. What it creates is this situation where you either have dispersed structures all over the map, or a collection of 2 or 3 of the same structures each supporting a random assortment of upgrades. I see two "problems" with this approach. The first is managing these structures. The alien commander will probably quickly forget which upgrade structures where support which specific upgrades (I assume the upgrades are lost if that structure is destroyed). With a clump of them you wouldn't know either and would have to go through each one to find out which is which. The second problem is from a "cinematic" point of view. Marines are just going to come across these random structures, probably alone, or at most 3 in the same area, and they don't do anything, they pose no threat, and if you destroy one it gets rebuilt for nothing. Kind of a bland mechanic in my opinion.
So I think where the problem came in is the separation of practical use and the providing of upgrades. The crags do the healing, the shells provide the upgrade, so why build more than 3? It essentially becomes a wasted aspect of the game once you get those 3 or so upgrade structures, then you can forget about them.
So I thought up this idea, maybe not as a serious proposal, just as a thought experiment, of upgrade farms. This probably has more to do with the image it inspired in my mind than actual gameplay impact, so bare with me. So it would revert back to the old system of upgrading regen or carapace ect at a single shell, and then the number of shells would determine how powerful the upgrade was (level 1, 2 or 3). However, in this case the increase wouldn't stop at 3. The benefit of the upgrade would continue to increase as more and more shells were built. A linear increase would be way too powerful, so diminishing returns would be a better approach. In such a system, with very rough numbers that would obviously need play testing to balance, a shell structure would cost the same, and you would need three to reach the currently gained level of carapace. After that however, building a further 6 shells would be the equivalent of two max level carapace upgrades, maybe building a further 12 would make it three times as powerful. This kind of system could be used for all upgrades; regeneration simply increases the amount regained, camouflage increases the speed at which you cloak and at which you can run while cloaked, silence... eeh I'll think of something.
So the reasons for this system are many fold, and I'll go through each.
First, the cinematic aspect. So picture this, you're a lone marine wandering through infestation, you come across an alien hive, and what do you see in the corner of the room? Not a bunch of oddly placed hydras, nor a collection of out of range whips, but a virtual sea of shells, the bodies of many of which are obstructed, only making the tip of each visible. Kind of straight of out Alien really, because in my opinion, the two current upgrade structure models bare a striking resemblance to the eggs from Alien.
The next reason is the way the role of alien lifeforms change as the game progresses. Even in a very close game between aliens and marines, the role of a skulk 30 minutes in does not resembles its role 2 minutes in. This is because level 3 weapons and armour essentially renders the skulk useless. Lerks have the same problem, being fearless dive bombers early game, and being relegated to distant passageways to make pot-shots towards the end of a game, fearing the oneshot. Allowing upgrades to scale as the game continues would allow these life forms to still stay relevant. Obviously the scaling would need to be reduced for the bigger life forms. An onos with 3x regeneration is a scary though.
This also gives aliens something to spend their res on. At the moment its simply a case of getting enough resources to drop another hive. No available hives? Just drop one we know won't survive, but who cares we have nothing else to spend this res on. Camping every hive room could leave marines in a situation where they get overrun by aliens who spent 75 res on getting super tough carapace.
And lastly, it would give marines another target other than the hive to focus attacks on, and similarly, would give aliens another target other than the hive to focus defences on. I mean, if you put 80 res into building a shell farm, would you allow it all to be ruined by a single marine with a grenade launcher? Ofcourse not. There would be Crags interspersed among the shells using umbra on every cooldown, whips on all sides throwing any grenade that was fired back at the perpetrator. Aliens would have to fight tooth and nail to keep their upgrades, just as they would for a hive. It would also be equally as advantageous for marines to focus down upgrade farms before attacking a hive, weakening the defending aliens in the process.
So yeah, that's just a rough idea I had for the upgrade structures, because I don't really like how "uninvolved" they are in the game at the moment.
So I think where the problem came in is the separation of practical use and the providing of upgrades. The crags do the healing, the shells provide the upgrade, so why build more than 3? It essentially becomes a wasted aspect of the game once you get those 3 or so upgrade structures, then you can forget about them.
So I thought up this idea, maybe not as a serious proposal, just as a thought experiment, of upgrade farms. This probably has more to do with the image it inspired in my mind than actual gameplay impact, so bare with me. So it would revert back to the old system of upgrading regen or carapace ect at a single shell, and then the number of shells would determine how powerful the upgrade was (level 1, 2 or 3). However, in this case the increase wouldn't stop at 3. The benefit of the upgrade would continue to increase as more and more shells were built. A linear increase would be way too powerful, so diminishing returns would be a better approach. In such a system, with very rough numbers that would obviously need play testing to balance, a shell structure would cost the same, and you would need three to reach the currently gained level of carapace. After that however, building a further 6 shells would be the equivalent of two max level carapace upgrades, maybe building a further 12 would make it three times as powerful. This kind of system could be used for all upgrades; regeneration simply increases the amount regained, camouflage increases the speed at which you cloak and at which you can run while cloaked, silence... eeh I'll think of something.
So the reasons for this system are many fold, and I'll go through each.
First, the cinematic aspect. So picture this, you're a lone marine wandering through infestation, you come across an alien hive, and what do you see in the corner of the room? Not a bunch of oddly placed hydras, nor a collection of out of range whips, but a virtual sea of shells, the bodies of many of which are obstructed, only making the tip of each visible. Kind of straight of out Alien really, because in my opinion, the two current upgrade structure models bare a striking resemblance to the eggs from Alien.
The next reason is the way the role of alien lifeforms change as the game progresses. Even in a very close game between aliens and marines, the role of a skulk 30 minutes in does not resembles its role 2 minutes in. This is because level 3 weapons and armour essentially renders the skulk useless. Lerks have the same problem, being fearless dive bombers early game, and being relegated to distant passageways to make pot-shots towards the end of a game, fearing the oneshot. Allowing upgrades to scale as the game continues would allow these life forms to still stay relevant. Obviously the scaling would need to be reduced for the bigger life forms. An onos with 3x regeneration is a scary though.
This also gives aliens something to spend their res on. At the moment its simply a case of getting enough resources to drop another hive. No available hives? Just drop one we know won't survive, but who cares we have nothing else to spend this res on. Camping every hive room could leave marines in a situation where they get overrun by aliens who spent 75 res on getting super tough carapace.
And lastly, it would give marines another target other than the hive to focus attacks on, and similarly, would give aliens another target other than the hive to focus defences on. I mean, if you put 80 res into building a shell farm, would you allow it all to be ruined by a single marine with a grenade launcher? Ofcourse not. There would be Crags interspersed among the shells using umbra on every cooldown, whips on all sides throwing any grenade that was fired back at the perpetrator. Aliens would have to fight tooth and nail to keep their upgrades, just as they would for a hive. It would also be equally as advantageous for marines to focus down upgrade farms before attacking a hive, weakening the defending aliens in the process.
So yeah, that's just a rough idea I had for the upgrade structures, because I don't really like how "uninvolved" they are in the game at the moment.