Why aliens struggle with map control
Xarius
Join Date: 2003-12-21 Member: 24630Members, Reinforced - Supporter
Join Date: 2003-12-21 Member: 24630Members, Reinforced - Supporter
<div class="IPBDescription">An analysis of alien map control mechanisms and their flaws</div><i>Before you proceed to read the wall of text that follows below, it is important to note that this analysis of the current flaws in alien map control mechanisms are less apparent than they would otherwise be. Therefore many may currently hold the perception that there is essentially nothing wrong with the alien's team ability to maintain map control. Maps such as ns_mineshaft and the current massive emphasis on rushing a second hive certainly do cater to that perception, where as the reality of the matter, as will be explained below, is entirely different. </i>
It has been stated by UWE developers that they will be addressing the current heavy emphasis on an elien second hive in future builds. (See also <a href="https://docs.google.com/document/d/139ySUrBsO0m0Z4ilq0YsDEHJLQhBa6RrIjJIsckL2kE/edit?hl=en&authkey=CLCo8Z0J)" target="_blank">https://docs.google.com/document/d/139ySUrB...thkey=CLCo8Z0J)</a> I quote: ''This would add more dynamics to the game and still give either team a chance to pull out a win. It would also put a higher priority to having resources and map control rather than "2 hives.†This is definitely going to be an important and welcome change to the game, however it could also prove a dramatic one for aliens if their issues with map control remain unresolved.
As the second hive will made less of a gamechanger and as more features will be added to 1-hive alien play there will be a greater emphasis on holding resource towers and extending the map control further from the main hive than is currently the case. It is not viable for aliens to extend their map control too far down a map, since unlike marines they do not have a system of phasegates, do not have the ability to lock down areas as effectively and have to run a vulnerable network of cysts for great lenghts just to keep a forward position operational. These are essentially what I would describe as the primary flaws in the alien team's ability to compete with marines in terms of map control.
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<b><u>A closer look at the flaws in alien map control</u></b><!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
The first mentioned flaw is an obvious one, and one that will already be addressed in a future build, with the implementation of the shift. (Which from my understanding is essentially going to be similar in role to the marine phase gate) With that in mind, I will not go into further detail on this.
A second flaw, and in my opinion the most pressing one currently, is the alien's complete lack of reliable mechanisms to defend an area. If we look at marines, we note that there are essentially 2 primary ways for them to 'defend' an area and/or deter/slow possible attackers from destroying an important structure or forward position. One being the use of mines, at 15 p.res for 3 and thus 5 p.res per mine, and the other being the use of sentry guns. The former is more often seen early on in the game, when they are incredibly cost effective and the latter is usually introduced a little later on, allowing marines to effectively shut down corridors, hallways and in greater numbers secure forward positions much more reliably. Now if we compare this with the alien team, it's immediately apparent they have to play a whole different ball game. Currently alien map control relies very heavily on forward pressure from the point aliens want to defend, which means that players have to be PRESENT in order for the alien team to maintain map control. This is not the case on the marine team, or at least only to a lesser extent, when there are also mines and sentries in place. This is a significant advantage the marines have over aliens currently, one that can hardly be underestimated as it basically gives the marine team a much larger flexibility in their map control (by not not always requiring marines to be present at every part of the 'frontline')
At 10 p.res on the gorge, the hydra could be considered to fill somewhat of a similar role to mines on the marine team. They are 'soft defenses', with the commander being able to build 'hard defenses' (Supposedly whips would then be hard defenses, or even some kind of siege equipment, more on this later). Though when one overlooks the role distribution between the alien khamm and gorges it could be stated that the commander is largely in charge of 'establishing map control' where as the gorge is responsible for maintaining that map control (through heal and its ability to place defenses) Whichever way we look at it, it's hard to acknowledge the role of hydras as being either soft or hard defenses in their current state. A single hydra will not deter marines from moving forward on a position (assuming there is no gorge present to keep it healed and provide additional fire support), it won't even slow them down in most cases. This where as 2 mines at the same 10 p.res can easily do so for enemy skulks.
At 12 team res (10 + 2 for drifter) whips can hardly be considered similar in purpose to sentries. Their ability to lock down an area is non existent, at best they will just slow down some marines advancing on a position and occasionally they will prevent a marine from knifing an alien structure instead of shooting it (forcing him to spend some ammo). So that's essentially 12 t.res spent on a structure that bounces back grenades. Now I'm sure they weren't designed to be similar in role to the sentry, since they seem more intended to be some kind of hybrid structure but from the many games I have already played I can definitely tell that whatever their real purpose then supposedly is, I have yet to see it in action. This also means that with the hydra not filling that hard defense role and the whip certainly not doing it either, aliens currently do not have any type of hard defense structure that comes even remotely close to being as effective as the marine sentry.
Thirdly, the implementation of the infestation mechanic. Personally I'm a big fan of this mechanic, though it's hard not to notice the obvious flaws that come with it when compared to it's marine counterpart the powernode. A first big difference with the power node is that they require an investment in personal resources, where as a powernode when taken down can be restored for no cost. In addition to this, aliens in order to establish and maintain map control have to lay out a vulnerable chain of cysts all the way from their hive. Powed nodes on the other hand are entirely independent from one another and require no 'supply line' as you will. Those are two pretty significant disadvantages in my book, further exacerbated by the fact that the alien commander can only place them on the floor (making them even more vulnerable than they already are, as marines will more easily spot them and be able to take them out without having to waste ammo)
A fourth and 'secondary' flaw that I would like to identify is the lack of recycling and 'shielding' on the alien side. A marine commander can shield buildings or power nodes under attack to win time or, when no help is in sight, recycle them to regain 75% of the original resources. These recycled resources can then again be spent on restoring the lost map control more easily. (Where as if an alien harvester is lost there can be a much greater loss of team resources)
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<b><u>Potential steps forward in addressing these flaws</u></b><!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
Now that the flaws have been pointed out in detail, I would like to briefly bring up some design suggestions that could go a long way in making alien map control competitive, more dynamic and increase the strategic options available to the alien team throughout the game.
In regards to the second flaw, a solution need not be complex. It can be as simple as beefing up the hydra to make it proper form of 'hard defense' similar to the offensive chamber in NS 1. There have been many threads about the hydra already, and there are various ways in which they can be buffed. I will not go into detail on this as I'm sure anything I come up with has already been proposed by someone in one shape or form. Even if the desire is to have the hydra be some sort of 'soft defense' (though personally I am of the opinion that turning it into proper hard defences will make gorge play more enjoyable) similar to mines, they should still be looked at in detail, as I don't think anyone in their right mind will argue that the hydra at 10 p.res comes anywhere near the effectiveness of 2 mines for the same amount of buck. Personally I would also suggest making the whip's role more obvious and pronounced. Even if we consider it to be some sort of hybrid structure, I find it hard to currently consider it a worthy investment of team resources. (Usually khamms just build this when they have nothing else to spend res on). In addition, if it is decided that neither the whip nor the hydra should fill the 'hard defense' role for aliens, then the addition of a third structure to do so would be greatly warranted.
The issue of cysts is also one that can be addressed on various levels, and it would definitely be interesting to hear some of the many suggestions the community has to offer on this subject. My personal favourite would be the upgrade or ability to have 'poisonous cysts', either through a khamm ability or when destroyed (after a khamm update or whatever) they release a poisonous, damage over time and visibility hindering, cloud similar to the one the lerk sprays. This would be a fun area denial mechanism. Another good idea I have already read in a different thread would be having the ability or upgrade to turn cysts invisible. (Barring the use of scans and obs) These changes would make the cyst network a little more robust, by allowing it to slow down marine advances and/or by being harder to detect/kill. I reckon you wouldn't even need invisibility if somehow the commander was able to place/hide cysts on walls and/or ceilings as well. (Like the gorge can)
Lastly, I see very little reason not to allow shades to passively cloak static structures. This would add a much greater dimension to the use of shades, and allow for at least that initial surprise effect when building a forward position, much like was the case in NS 1. Shades could then be used also to hide vulnerable parts of the cyst network. (Indirectly also benefiting alien map control)
Thanks for reading
It has been stated by UWE developers that they will be addressing the current heavy emphasis on an elien second hive in future builds. (See also <a href="https://docs.google.com/document/d/139ySUrBsO0m0Z4ilq0YsDEHJLQhBa6RrIjJIsckL2kE/edit?hl=en&authkey=CLCo8Z0J)" target="_blank">https://docs.google.com/document/d/139ySUrB...thkey=CLCo8Z0J)</a> I quote: ''This would add more dynamics to the game and still give either team a chance to pull out a win. It would also put a higher priority to having resources and map control rather than "2 hives.†This is definitely going to be an important and welcome change to the game, however it could also prove a dramatic one for aliens if their issues with map control remain unresolved.
As the second hive will made less of a gamechanger and as more features will be added to 1-hive alien play there will be a greater emphasis on holding resource towers and extending the map control further from the main hive than is currently the case. It is not viable for aliens to extend their map control too far down a map, since unlike marines they do not have a system of phasegates, do not have the ability to lock down areas as effectively and have to run a vulnerable network of cysts for great lenghts just to keep a forward position operational. These are essentially what I would describe as the primary flaws in the alien team's ability to compete with marines in terms of map control.
<!--sizeo:4--><span style="font-size:14pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->
<b><u>A closer look at the flaws in alien map control</u></b><!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
The first mentioned flaw is an obvious one, and one that will already be addressed in a future build, with the implementation of the shift. (Which from my understanding is essentially going to be similar in role to the marine phase gate) With that in mind, I will not go into further detail on this.
A second flaw, and in my opinion the most pressing one currently, is the alien's complete lack of reliable mechanisms to defend an area. If we look at marines, we note that there are essentially 2 primary ways for them to 'defend' an area and/or deter/slow possible attackers from destroying an important structure or forward position. One being the use of mines, at 15 p.res for 3 and thus 5 p.res per mine, and the other being the use of sentry guns. The former is more often seen early on in the game, when they are incredibly cost effective and the latter is usually introduced a little later on, allowing marines to effectively shut down corridors, hallways and in greater numbers secure forward positions much more reliably. Now if we compare this with the alien team, it's immediately apparent they have to play a whole different ball game. Currently alien map control relies very heavily on forward pressure from the point aliens want to defend, which means that players have to be PRESENT in order for the alien team to maintain map control. This is not the case on the marine team, or at least only to a lesser extent, when there are also mines and sentries in place. This is a significant advantage the marines have over aliens currently, one that can hardly be underestimated as it basically gives the marine team a much larger flexibility in their map control (by not not always requiring marines to be present at every part of the 'frontline')
At 10 p.res on the gorge, the hydra could be considered to fill somewhat of a similar role to mines on the marine team. They are 'soft defenses', with the commander being able to build 'hard defenses' (Supposedly whips would then be hard defenses, or even some kind of siege equipment, more on this later). Though when one overlooks the role distribution between the alien khamm and gorges it could be stated that the commander is largely in charge of 'establishing map control' where as the gorge is responsible for maintaining that map control (through heal and its ability to place defenses) Whichever way we look at it, it's hard to acknowledge the role of hydras as being either soft or hard defenses in their current state. A single hydra will not deter marines from moving forward on a position (assuming there is no gorge present to keep it healed and provide additional fire support), it won't even slow them down in most cases. This where as 2 mines at the same 10 p.res can easily do so for enemy skulks.
At 12 team res (10 + 2 for drifter) whips can hardly be considered similar in purpose to sentries. Their ability to lock down an area is non existent, at best they will just slow down some marines advancing on a position and occasionally they will prevent a marine from knifing an alien structure instead of shooting it (forcing him to spend some ammo). So that's essentially 12 t.res spent on a structure that bounces back grenades. Now I'm sure they weren't designed to be similar in role to the sentry, since they seem more intended to be some kind of hybrid structure but from the many games I have already played I can definitely tell that whatever their real purpose then supposedly is, I have yet to see it in action. This also means that with the hydra not filling that hard defense role and the whip certainly not doing it either, aliens currently do not have any type of hard defense structure that comes even remotely close to being as effective as the marine sentry.
Thirdly, the implementation of the infestation mechanic. Personally I'm a big fan of this mechanic, though it's hard not to notice the obvious flaws that come with it when compared to it's marine counterpart the powernode. A first big difference with the power node is that they require an investment in personal resources, where as a powernode when taken down can be restored for no cost. In addition to this, aliens in order to establish and maintain map control have to lay out a vulnerable chain of cysts all the way from their hive. Powed nodes on the other hand are entirely independent from one another and require no 'supply line' as you will. Those are two pretty significant disadvantages in my book, further exacerbated by the fact that the alien commander can only place them on the floor (making them even more vulnerable than they already are, as marines will more easily spot them and be able to take them out without having to waste ammo)
A fourth and 'secondary' flaw that I would like to identify is the lack of recycling and 'shielding' on the alien side. A marine commander can shield buildings or power nodes under attack to win time or, when no help is in sight, recycle them to regain 75% of the original resources. These recycled resources can then again be spent on restoring the lost map control more easily. (Where as if an alien harvester is lost there can be a much greater loss of team resources)
<!--sizeo:4--><span style="font-size:14pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->
<b><u>Potential steps forward in addressing these flaws</u></b><!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
Now that the flaws have been pointed out in detail, I would like to briefly bring up some design suggestions that could go a long way in making alien map control competitive, more dynamic and increase the strategic options available to the alien team throughout the game.
In regards to the second flaw, a solution need not be complex. It can be as simple as beefing up the hydra to make it proper form of 'hard defense' similar to the offensive chamber in NS 1. There have been many threads about the hydra already, and there are various ways in which they can be buffed. I will not go into detail on this as I'm sure anything I come up with has already been proposed by someone in one shape or form. Even if the desire is to have the hydra be some sort of 'soft defense' (though personally I am of the opinion that turning it into proper hard defences will make gorge play more enjoyable) similar to mines, they should still be looked at in detail, as I don't think anyone in their right mind will argue that the hydra at 10 p.res comes anywhere near the effectiveness of 2 mines for the same amount of buck. Personally I would also suggest making the whip's role more obvious and pronounced. Even if we consider it to be some sort of hybrid structure, I find it hard to currently consider it a worthy investment of team resources. (Usually khamms just build this when they have nothing else to spend res on). In addition, if it is decided that neither the whip nor the hydra should fill the 'hard defense' role for aliens, then the addition of a third structure to do so would be greatly warranted.
The issue of cysts is also one that can be addressed on various levels, and it would definitely be interesting to hear some of the many suggestions the community has to offer on this subject. My personal favourite would be the upgrade or ability to have 'poisonous cysts', either through a khamm ability or when destroyed (after a khamm update or whatever) they release a poisonous, damage over time and visibility hindering, cloud similar to the one the lerk sprays. This would be a fun area denial mechanism. Another good idea I have already read in a different thread would be having the ability or upgrade to turn cysts invisible. (Barring the use of scans and obs) These changes would make the cyst network a little more robust, by allowing it to slow down marine advances and/or by being harder to detect/kill. I reckon you wouldn't even need invisibility if somehow the commander was able to place/hide cysts on walls and/or ceilings as well. (Like the gorge can)
Lastly, I see very little reason not to allow shades to passively cloak static structures. This would add a much greater dimension to the use of shades, and allow for at least that initial surprise effect when building a forward position, much like was the case in NS 1. Shades could then be used also to hide vulnerable parts of the cyst network. (Indirectly also benefiting alien map control)
Thanks for reading
Comments
While i do see the flaws, i feel that the system currently in place is fine for now. Power nodes shut off all structures and are sometimes difficult to protect, for instance, taking down the power node in the marine's main base (usually located away from all their structures) will normally end that base or the game as they simply wont spawn from unpowered IPs. alien structures die over time when not on creep instead of simply not functioning, and it takes time for creep to disapear.
Also, breaking a cyst chain doesn't mean the death of everything unconnected as the rate at which unconnected cysts die give aliens time to react and reconnect.
Shade should passively cloak- in terms of NS1, the SC was a great way to protect an area by itself
Whereas the gorge had some method to improve them into mature hydras.
Maybe let hydras scale with how many hives you have up
or scale with the natural upgrades the gorge has when he builds them (Carapace/Regen/Swarm/Camo).
I would absolutely love to see the natural structures be far more resilient, regenerating health faster/doing more damage. I would like marines to be somewhat scared of that doorway i plastered with 4-5 hydras, not just grenade it twice and laugh as it's gone.
Sentrys, Hydras etc. shouldnt be the main mechanics for map control => they should be soft defences... (it should be no problem to play games compleatly without turrets on both sides, so its a tactical choice with up and downsides if you decide to do it, not a core gameplay element)
Instead of making turrets stronger we should think about other mechanics that would help you in a similar way. (as already hinted)
Fighting stupid turrets is not fun, i heard nuclear dawn is big on turrets - maybe thats more interessting if you enjoy a game relying mainly on turrets. (note, i never played nuclear dawn - i might be wrong about that - just what i heared)
PS: with turrets i mean defenses like sentrys hydras etc. so i talk about both sides/ the game in general.
^--This. Similar to how whips now autobombard, the shade should autocloak. I'm pretty tired of having to remember, in the middle of everything else, to go back to a structure at my hive and click a button on it every 30 seconds or so. It's repetitive and meaninless, except if I forget to do it my team suffers. No fun.
The dynamic part of dynamic infestation only means that it will look like it grows from the hive to the cysts and spread from there in rooms with veines growing from cyst to cyst etc.
Or I't might be that you only set a direction and the infestation will grow into this direction and placing cysts on their own. (and you can add cysts to reinforce the infestation as commander)
Flamethrower as the only weapon against infestation will not happen, and without cysts how will you attack infestation? Shoot bullets in the ground? (they are not strict about realism, but that would be ridiculous)
Thats why they wasted money on making a new cyst model? And all videos(in the last year) about infestation mechanics were build around cysts as some kind of anchor point for infestation?
Cysts are only logical to use (lik0e creep tumors in sc2), and i dont see a problem with them using it in the final version.
I want that so much.... but only when I'm a Marine ^.^
<!--quoteo(post=1914713:date=Mar 18 2012, 04:02 PM:name=Koruyo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Koruyo @ Mar 18 2012, 04:02 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1914713"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Thats why they waste money on making a new cyst model? And all videos(in the last year) about infestation mechanics were build around cysts?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
*shrug*
I said this was all as far as I knew, and in regards to that, I really don't know.
Glad we went so much offtopic :)
I see, that's why they spontaneously combusted :D
But yeah, Hydras getting a tweak in spike accuracy should do the trick. Hydras rarely hit non-sprinting Marines unless they are running toward/away; ideally, sprinting and/or jetpack Marines should be able easily dodge Hydra spikes, but not as often for walking Marines.
Bombard (with targeting/ball-throwing bugs ironed out) will really help whittle down Marine armor. It's just so darn expensive at 22 TRes, that it's not as viable in early game. I'd like to try a Bombard/Lash mode for Whip, with Bombard Whip only throwing acid balls but no melee attack or grenade whack, while Lash Whip with the reverse.
You're saying, something like your basic Whip can be toggled between one or the other, whereas a Mature Whip can do both simultaneously?
Actually, I was thinking of getting rid of the Mature Whip upgrade all together, but otherwise you're spot on.
A better title would probably why aliens WILL struggle with map control, since currently due to various reasons it's not as noticeable.
In response to flaw 3 and the alien network weaknesses.
I have a possible solution, that requires no changes to the current alien (and very good imho) implementation, but balances it out across teams. I'll use Summit as an example map to help explain the idea.
<!--coloro:#FFFF00--><span style="color:#FFFF00"><!--/coloro-->Marine Power Grid<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
Marines spawn in SA, aliens in Atrium.
Marines power up comp lab, then move into Flight control and power it up. If the aliens were to now take down comp lab, then the grid to FC would be broken. Because this is an electrical grid, it would take down the power immediately. The obvious need here is for the marines to get comp lab back up, but that is going to take time, and while that happens, FC is not producing resources, or not powering PG's. This is very unbalanced and causes a power loss to be too damaging to the marines.
To provide a counter to the loss at FC, and while awaiting the repair of comp lab, marine comm can drop a power pack in FC to power the area. The device plugs the power node and powers all devices in the room, but has a limited duration, and has a commander PRes cost. The powerpack will only power the room if the node in the room has not been destroyed.
Marines have now powered comp lab again, and have spread their power network through summit reception to xroads and to crevice. Aliens take down summit reception, and power is lost to crevice and xroads, but marines power up the area to Xroads on vent side?, so Xroads gets powered again, although crevice is still unpowered. Comm could drop a powerpack at crevice, or recycle, or just wait for a marine to power it up.
This creates a tactical use of powernodes, and makes junctions important points for both teams.
This also enables much more of a map to become an active part of the battlefield. In my own map in development, I have rooms between nodes and TP's, that I'd like to node, to make for interesting gameplay, but in reality, the marines have no reason to power those rooms. This solution potentially addresses that issue, as well as making the power system a much more tactical experience.
It's an idea, but I think it really covers all the bases(pun intended) :)
In response to flaw 3 and the alien network weaknesses.
I have a possible solution, that requires no changes to the current alien (and very good imho) implementation, but balances it out across teams. I'll use Summit as an example map to help explain the idea.
<!--coloro:#FFFF00--><span style="color:#FFFF00"><!--/coloro-->Marine Power Grid<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
Marines spawn in SA, aliens in Atrium.
Marines power up comp lab, then move into Flight control and power it up. If the aliens were to now take down comp lab, then the grid to FC would be broken. Because this is an electrical grid, it would take down the power immediately. The obvious need here is for the marines to get comp lab back up, but that is going to take time, and while that happens, FC is not producing resources, or not powering PG's. This is very unbalanced and causes a power loss to be too damaging to the marines.
To provide a counter to the loss at FC, and while awaiting the repair of comp lab, marine comm can drop a power pack in FC to power the area. The device plugs the power node and powers all devices in the room, but has a limited duration, and has a commander PRes cost. The powerpack will only power the room if the node in the room has not been destroyed.
Marines have now powered comp lab again, and have spread their power network through summit reception to xroads and to crevice. Aliens take down summit reception, and power is lost to crevice and xroads, but marines power up the area to Xroads on vent side?, so Xroads gets powered again, although crevice is still unpowered. Comm could drop a powerpack at crevice, or recycle, or just wait for a marine to power it up.
This creates a tactical use of powernodes, and makes junctions important points for both teams.
This also enables much more of a map to become an active part of the battlefield. In my own map in development, I have rooms between nodes and TP's, that I'd like to node, to make for interesting gameplay, but in reality, the marines have no reason to power those rooms. This solution potentially addresses that issue, as well as making the power system a much more tactical experience.
It's an idea, but I think it really covers all the bases(pun intended) :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Don't think it will work. It would be way to easy for a single skulk/lerk to brake the powerline(remember, aliens have mobility, marines don't). This would force marines to waste extra 10 res for every forward structures they want to keep up(powerpacks). Team res is already scarce and they would not be able to maintain it.
Aliens don't really struggle with map control, the problem you see on public is that aliens are not using the infestation/map very well. Aliens can travel very fast over the map and defend key areas with ease. They should however attack in groups from many directions, not 1 and 1.
this was all i could think about when reading this thread.
1 - I said the power pack comes from Commander Pres
2 - I haven't suggested a price or specific time limit.
3 - There are alternative routes, all points have at least 2 directions of approach. With this in place, maps would be designed for it and offer plenty of routes.
We could add, power pack can't be destroyed, aliens have to take down the powernode it is powering to unpower the room still.
This is a modification of the alien system, tailored towards the marines. Power packs would come from Comm Pres, like cysts do.
This gives more tactical play to the marines who currently just run around the map and cap all the res nodes, while the alien comm is patiently waiting for enough Pres to get his cyst network out. It makes marines think about the best nodes to take, the best way to set up their defence, it brings a whole lot more to the tactical gameplay of the marines.
It also gives aliens more of a reason to go for powernodes. Currently half the time we just rush around the map eating the extractors and leaving the nodes on, time spent eating a node could be spent eating an extractor and is much more valuable.
It could be balanced easily enough with the numbers, but the biggest drawback is it might make the Marine Commander role too hard for most to play. It would require a large step up in tactical awareness and map control, making it a much steeper learning curve.
I am sure the idea needs refinement, but it is eminently workable. The drawback is the complexity, through both tactical awareness and a need for increased APM, that it adds to the commander role.
The alien comm can easily deal with looking after the network as they have to micro their players less.
Whereas the gorge had some method to improve them into mature hydras.
Maybe let hydras scale with how many hives you have up
or scale with the natural upgrades the gorge has when he builds them (Carapace/Regen/Swarm/Camo).
I would absolutely love to see the natural structures be far more resilient, regenerating health faster/doing more damage. I would like marines to be somewhat scared of that doorway i plastered with 4-5 hydras, not just grenade it twice and laugh as it's gone.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
+1
Or make hydras cheaper if they're going to be so weak.
Area denial by whips and hydras only annoy marines, rather than turrets and mines which completely deny access to lower lifeforms.
I would like to see the cyst changes in the OP happen, and when shift is introduced we can re-evaluate it. To be honest I think the response should be for marines to get LESS hard defenses, and force them, like aliens, to defend things manually.