Exertus vs Archaea

ArkantiArkanti pub baddie Join Date: 2011-07-22 Member: 111781Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
in Competitive Play
<div class="IPBDescription">InternetsLive and Arkanti Co-Casting</div>Hiya all, here's another set of games for you- this time between Exertus and Archaea.

<center><object width="450" height="356"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/TCDw7cybIMw"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/TCDw7cybIMw" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="450" height="356"></embed></object></center>

<center><object width="450" height="356"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/umznObxMyvA"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/umznObxMyvA" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="450" height="356"></embed></object></center>

I did find myself having to leave after the second game, but it wasn't the end of the matchup! Catch the rest of it over in the official NS2 stream's archived videos here: <a href="http://www.twitch.tv/naturalselection2/b/314030745" target="_blank">the official NS2 stream's archived videos here.</a>
Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome

Comments

  • DghelneshiDghelneshi Aims to surpass Fana in post edits. Join Date: 2011-11-01 Member: 130634Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited April 2012
    I'm gonna go ahead and post some criticism from me, especially towards InternetsLIVE, since Arkanti seems to do a better job at it. However, I mean no offense by the following rant, it was great you guys casted these matches and I'm looking forward to see more of the same (just not quite the same :) ).

    Don't describe what you see, provide comment on it! We are all very well able to see what is going on and who is killing who ourselves (mostly). That's not to say you shouldn't say anything at all, but focus more on the strategic/tactical aspect and also <b>always</b> keep an eye on your map, no matter how beautiful the GL rush in front of you is.

    A couple of examples:
    In the first match, when the observatory between Sub and Comp Lab went down, I would immediately state that the marines don't have an obs now and cannot beacon. Unfortunately, the aliens didn't exploit this (e.g. by laying low, letting the marines get out of base and then rushing CC), but it may have been game-ending if utilized right. They also didn't have a second IP for quite some time (built one after about 5mins).

    Especially when InternetsLIVE was casting alone, a lot of the time he kept stating "A kills B, A puts up extractor, C kills A, C is chewing on extractor" and so on. It's not interesting to watch someone describe what we can all see very easily on the screen. It's not wrong to comment on the kills and sometimes there's just nothing else happening, but try focusing on "what impact does this kill have on the overall game?", because we can all see the kill, but we can't all know what this means for either team (especially those who don't play NS2, as the official Stream is not just being watched by us here!).

    In the last match (around 1:00:00 on the stream), you didn't see the advanced armory in the base, then didn't really comment on the beacon to base and once you realized it was in fact a GL rush, you didn't comment on that one either. (although the rush wasn't a great one either)
    Even more unfortunate, while watching the next GL rush, you completely missed three aliens going around the back and taking down the command station in DC. You did see the Sub command station afterwards, but not that they were building a new one in DC even though Zeikko was actually on your screen building it (1:04:16).

    You don't need to show all of it on screen, as things do happen simultaneously sometimes, but you always need to be aware of everything that's going on.
    So, tl;dr is: Show the kills on screen, but comment on the overall picture instead of enjoying the action. Casting is hard work! :D

    Of course, it's always easy talking you down after the fact compared to actually casting it realtime, especially when you cast alone, but I think you could do better next time. :)
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • ArkantiArkanti pub baddie Join Date: 2011-07-22 Member: 111781Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1922495:date=Apr 7 2012, 01:40 AM:name=Dghelneshi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dghelneshi @ Apr 7 2012, 01:40 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1922495"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->snip<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Thank you, this is some very productive criticism and you mention some things that have been bothering me as well. I'm doing my best to work on improving some of this stuff.


    One of the biggest hurdles is that we are the camera men, we have to create an interesting viewing experience following the action and setting up informative angles etc. From my own viewing experience, I really don't like it when the caster stays in Skycam mode as it doesn't effectively represent the gameplay going on for the troops on the ground. It's quite difficult to equally divide your mind and body with doing that and providing overarching analysis.

    I now fully understand why Tasteless hated controlling the camera so much :P.


    Again, thanks for the advice, I greatly prefer it to blind praise.
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • DghelneshiDghelneshi Aims to surpass Fana in post edits. Join Date: 2011-11-01 Member: 130634Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited April 2012
    I actually like watching the skycam a lot, as it gives me much more information than a caster desperately trying to get a good camera angle and missing all of the action in the meantime. It's always good to break it up and use both, though I prefer more like 75% skycam.
    What's probably bothering me the most is that switching the camera style also disables the minimap in the corner, effectively making the caster and the viewer doubly blind, since skycam and map both give a lot more overview over what is actually happening.

    I tend to play a lot more by awareness to make up for my lacking shooting skills (especially with as low computer performance as I have), so my playstyle kind of bleeds over into watching a cast of a game.

    By the way, I'd be up for trying some co-casting myself, if I have the time and you don't mind my inexperience and (very) ###### voice destroying the experience for the guys watching. :D
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • ScrajmScrajm Join Date: 2011-10-17 Member: 127859Members
    Perhaps we need a ST_Legend in NS2 aswell. Why not have 2 casters and a camera man? I mean, its not more complicated than just having 2 casters. I´ll gladely be a camera man next time you cast :) I think thats more fun than talking tbh

    And i couldnt agree more with dgh
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • DghelneshiDghelneshi Aims to surpass Fana in post edits. Join Date: 2011-11-01 Member: 130634Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    You can watch me fail at doing what I criticise in other's casting very soon. :) Arkanti and I just recorded a match between teams Archaea and Duplex.

    An extra camera man wouldn't be too great, as you will want to show people some stuff when you're casting and you can't really direct your camera man around. It's good when there's someone commentating on the things not on screen, but it's getting really awkward if the stuff on the screen almost never relates to what is being said.
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • ScrajmScrajm Join Date: 2011-10-17 Member: 127859Members
    I dont know if that is such of a big problem u make it sound. The cam man is ofc gonna be in the same ts3 channel, and with that in mind i doubt that will be an issue
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • ScardyBobScardyBob ScardyBob Join Date: 2009-11-25 Member: 69528Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    edited April 2012
    Nice matches! Sad that there were no marines wins (but not unexpected).

    While some commenting is good, I think the real key during casting is capturing the most interesting pieces of action or information. For example, you seemed to miss the aforementioned beacon+GL rush until you saw the nades going off in computer lab.

    Also, I'm not a fan of music in the background, since it doesn't really add anything to the cast, and can drown out the things I care about such as the commentary and in-game sounds.

    Otherwise, great to see some competitive matches casted and look forward to more in the future.

    Edit: Also, if your computer can handle it, it would be great to see the videos in 1080p rather than 720p.
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • ArkantiArkanti pub baddie Join Date: 2011-07-22 Member: 111781Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1922703:date=Apr 7 2012, 01:44 PM:name=ScardyBob)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ScardyBob @ Apr 7 2012, 01:44 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1922703"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->While some commenting is good, I think the real key during casting is capturing the most interesting pieces of action or information. For example, you seemed to miss the aforementioned beacon+GL rush until you saw the nades going off in computer lab. Also, I'm not a fan of music in the background, since it doesn't really add anything to the cast, and can drown out the things I care about such as the commentary and in-game sounds.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    And this here is an example of why you can't please everyone :P, I'm trying to find the best middle ground in all of this. I'm working on trying to improve my general game awareness while casting but due to the previously mentioned reasons, it's a bit tough if not impossible to capture everything that's happening at all times. With the music I've adjusted it to a level that I feel only removes periods of silence, it shouldn't be drowning anything else out.

    <!--quoteo(post=1922703:date=Apr 7 2012, 01:44 PM:name=ScardyBob)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ScardyBob @ Apr 7 2012, 01:44 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1922703"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Edit: Also, if your computer can handle it, it would be great to see the videos in 1080p rather than 720p.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I have a 16:10 screen limited to 1680x1050 so any 1080 recordings I would do would be reduced to letterboxes within the view regardless (coming down to my poor video editing knowledge I suppose).<a href="http://youtu.be/Fy2fXDYULl4" target="_blank">Here's an example of this.</a> Again I feel that a compromise is best and so record in 720, it's stretched and ugly on my screen while I'm recording but neatly formatted in the end product. It also brings up the frame rate(a big problem when recording with a high ping) and drastically reduces the turnaround time of encoding and uploading videos.
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • ScrajmScrajm Join Date: 2011-10-17 Member: 127859Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1922703:date=Apr 7 2012, 04:44 AM:name=ScardyBob)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ScardyBob @ Apr 7 2012, 04:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1922703"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Edit: Also, if your computer can handle it, it would be great to see the videos in 1080p rather than 720p.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Hehehe, i thought <b>I</b> was fastidious. =)
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • LuitjensLuitjens Join Date: 2010-07-26 Member: 73034Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester
    @Dghelneshi Hey man, thanks for the feedback! Always appreciated, I will definitely improve on my casting, especially when we start seeing research timers more, etc,, (more stuff to talk about), I can stay away from X kills X chatter, since there really isn't much strategy early game except destroying extractors which makes casting at times sort of difficult, when I just want to talk all the time :P

    :)
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • DghelneshiDghelneshi Aims to surpass Fana in post edits. Join Date: 2011-11-01 Member: 130634Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited April 2012
    Yeah, casting is definitely not easy. You always need to think of something new and about what the teams could be doing in the future to make their situation better, it's constant pressure and especially hard if you're not an experienced commander.

    I have a quick client-side-only hackjob mod for Skycam running, which displays current marine upgrades (only already researched, armor and weapons upgrades very unreliable), total tres collected, total pres based off of that, lost RTs and tres spent on RTs (based off lost RTs and current number of RTs). The problem is that the values are only 100% correct while you stay in Skycam mode and you need to reset it manually exactly during the game countdown via a console command.

    I'm currently working on a complete server and client side modification, but have still have some issues as I'm not a very experienced coder.
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • jus7addwaterjus7addwater Join Date: 2012-04-12 Member: 150350Members
    This is going to come off very "######y" and self promoting (sorry for this in advance). I've done well over 1200 cats myself in games ranging from AA, cod, cs, css tf2, dod, dods, t2, and a variety of rts titles. I'm not the best shotucaster but i've work for the best orgs NA has had in recent times. I'd like to sit down and assist in any shoutcasting activities your community pushes for. I just bought the game last week but I think I have lots of exp I can kick over to others who can put it to good use.
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • DghelneshiDghelneshi Aims to surpass Fana in post edits. Join Date: 2011-11-01 Member: 130634Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1925115:date=Apr 13 2012, 09:40 PM:name=jus7addwater)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jus7addwater @ Apr 13 2012, 09:40 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1925115"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I've done well over 1200 cats myself<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    You do cats?! You sick ######!

    Seriously though, this is definitely a welcome addition to the community, as I don't think we have any pro casters yet.
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • ArkantiArkanti pub baddie Join Date: 2011-07-22 Member: 111781Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited April 2012
    As Dghelneshi said, you're more than welcome to assist with any of our competitive coverage :). I can at least speak for myself in that I don't feel that I can quite muster the excitement in casts during moments which really deserve it, so it would be fantastic to have some more experienced "voices" in the scene.

    <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=117286" target="_blank">This thread</a> has contact information for all the currently active clans and their leaders, so I would start by adding them on Steam to get into the know as to when these competitions are going down. From the rumblings of the wind, there should be quite a few games happening over this weekend.
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • ArkantiArkanti pub baddie Join Date: 2011-07-22 Member: 111781Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    Oh and would you be able to give us a link to any of your casts? Would love to see your stuff!
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • jus7addwaterjus7addwater Join Date: 2012-04-12 Member: 150350Members
    edited April 2012
    I accepted the steam add's go ahead and add me JUS7ADDW4T3R

    *EDIT* I'm an idiot / google chrome fail
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • swalkswalk Say hello to my little friend. Join Date: 2011-01-20 Member: 78384Members, Squad Five Blue
    <!--quoteo(post=1925141:date=Apr 13 2012, 10:07 PM:name=Dghelneshi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dghelneshi @ Apr 13 2012, 10:07 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1925141"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't think we have any pro casters yet.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    NS2HD?!
    He is casting games, and getting payed, he must be pro?!
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • MuYeahMuYeah Join Date: 2006-12-26 Member: 59261Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1925277:date=Apr 14 2012, 10:19 AM:name=swalk)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (swalk @ Apr 14 2012, 10:19 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1925277"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->NS2HD?!
    He is casting games, and getting payed, he must be pro?!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


    NS2HD should totally pick up a co-caster, though.
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • GORGEousGORGEous Join Date: 2012-02-19 Member: 146762Members, NS2 Map Tester
    <!--quoteo(post=1925282:date=Apr 14 2012, 06:36 AM:name=MuYeah)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MuYeah @ Apr 14 2012, 06:36 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1925282"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->NS2HD should totally pick up a co-caster, though.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    NS2HD definitely needs an artosis to his tasteless. A wolf to his moletrap.
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
  • ArkantiArkanti pub baddie Join Date: 2011-07-22 Member: 111781Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1925400:date=Apr 15 2012, 05:15 AM:name=GORGEous)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GORGEous @ Apr 15 2012, 05:15 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1925400"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->A wolf to his moletrap.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Nobody wants anything in that sentence :P.

    Wolf is a poor impression of Artosis, and Moletrap is, well, he's Moletrap.
    Off Topic Disagree Agree Awesome
Sign In or Register to comment.