My problem with some of the maps

Wolpertinger

This has annoyed me for a very long time now. There are some vents in NS2 Maps that might look like you can easiyl enter them as a Marine, but if you try, you will fail all the time.

Especially these ones:
<img src="http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/9488/2012052300001.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img840.imageshack.us/img840/3276/2012052200002.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/2355/2012052200001.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

And in Warehouse it looks like you can get to certain areas on the ceiling, but invisible walls just won't let you. I am talking about that spot.
<img src="http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/9727/2012042700001r.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

Please, dear mappers, make it visually clear whether you can go somewhere, or not.


And just for fun, here is a giant egg:
<img src="http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/5664/2012041300004.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

Forever_rusty

I think its the point to not let marine access them

Wolpertinger

<!--quoteo(post=1939331:date=May 27 2012, 06:55 PM:name=Forever_rusty)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Forever_rusty @ May 27 2012, 06:55 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1939331"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think its the point to not let marine access them<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Thus, make it obvious, that you can't...

Asraniel

You can actually go into the first vent :)

Jayaris

<!--quoteo(post=1939335:date=May 27 2012, 09:19 AM:name=Asraniel)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Asraniel @ May 27 2012, 09:19 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1939335"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You can actually go into the first vent :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

And the third, Jetpacks make it easier - Alternately being boosted by a team-mate. I actually managed to jump into the third vent by myself once, but I never managed to do it again.

You can also use mines to help.

Wolpertinger

Yes, haha!

Jetpacks and mines. How stupid am I. Of course. It is so obvious...

ScardyBob

You can get in the first one without any help by sprinting and timing the jump just right.

Tweadle

It's needlessly difficult, though.

Jayaris

<!--quoteo(post=1939341:date=May 27 2012, 09:44 AM:name=Wolpertinger)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Wolpertinger @ May 27 2012, 09:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1939341"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yes, haha!

Jetpacks and mines. How stupid am I. Of course. It is so obvious...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Are you being sarcastic?

internetexplorer

<!--quoteo(post=1939353:date=May 27 2012, 02:27 PM:name=Jayaris)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jayaris @ May 27 2012, 02:27 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1939353"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Are you being sarcastic?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

if you ever have to ask this, something has gone wrong

player

A valid long-standing issue of free-flowing movement is being adressed here, namely that it isn't obvious what limitations there are in terms of movement. In NS1 you know exactly what you could get away with, in which vents you could fit (each one actually, so that's a bit of a no-brainer), the distances you could cross jumping, over what railings you could duck-jump, it was all EXTREMELY tight and reliable. NS2 has moved more towards the modern FPS movement-mechanic, where you feel more like you're on a rail, and dare not deviate from it in fear of hitting invisi-walls.

Wolpertinger

<!--quoteo(post=1939364:date=May 27 2012, 10:46 PM:name=player)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (player @ May 27 2012, 10:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1939364"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->A valid long-standing issue of free-flowing movement is being adressed here, namely that it isn't obvious what limitations there are in terms of movement. In NS1 you know exactly what you could get away with, in which vents you could fit (each one actually, so that's a bit of a no-brainer), the distances you could cross jumping, over what railings you could duck-jump, it was all EXTREMELY tight and reliable. NS2 has moved more towards the modern FPS movement-mechanic, where you feel more like you're on a rail, and dare not deviate from it in fear of hitting invisi-walls.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

This gentleman hits the spot very good.
Invisible walls are the death of fun in the movement.

The prime example for rail-mechanic are CoD Modern Warfar maps...

rantology

The vents in the OP, most railings in the game, and most boxes in the game are pretty much just player troll-bots. That stupid upper RT at central in mineshaft comes to mind as a great example.

Tweadle

Gimped marine movement and troll-boxes are one thing. A mechanic that forces skulks to not only navigate, but expressly utilise, the complicated clutter in every map just to get from A to B is another. I've often found myself hitting a trailing or dangling wire (you know, the ones that make this game immersive and atmospheric!) which totally kills my speed.

NurEinMensch

I agree with the OP.

TimMc

I would have expected all vents should be usable by marines (as was in NS1). Marines just will be at a disadvantage since slow movement and its not a long corridor to shoot down.

Wolpertinger

To be clear, I know that one can get into the first and third vent, but they are placed to low, that there is no reason for a Marine not being able to climb into it.

paradoxum

Op nails it. If marines shouldn't be able to get into these vents then move them higher up so it's more obvious, if they are supposed to be able to get into them easy then fix them so it's easier.

<!--quoteo(post=1939368:date=May 27 2012, 09:04 PM:name=rantology)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rantology @ May 27 2012, 09:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1939368"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The vents in the OP, most railings in the game, and most boxes in the game are pretty much just player troll-bots. That stupid upper RT at central in mineshaft comes to mind as a great example.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Ughh yes that ###### upper RT. And those troll-boxes where you can jump on to the first one but not the second one! (Warehouse is the only example of this I can think of now but I know there's more)

rantology

Oh and let's not forget <a href="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/Drakuu/VENTtrolls.jpg" target="_blank">THESE things</a> X_x

paradoxum

<!--quoteo(post=1939394:date=May 27 2012, 11:08 PM:name=rantology)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rantology @ May 27 2012, 11:08 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1939394"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Oh and let's not forget <a href="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/Drakuu/VENTtrolls.jpg" target="_blank">THESE things</a> X_x<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

do they actually stop you? I assumed you just clipped through them

Mendasp

<!--quoteo(post=1939415:date=May 28 2012, 03:05 AM:name=paradoxum)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (paradoxum @ May 28 2012, 03:05 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1939415"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->do they actually stop you? I assumed you just clipped through them<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not sure how it is in other maps, but in summit they have their collisions disabled, so you clip through them.

As for the vent in the OP, I had it in the plans to make it easier to access (because I was told about it the second I got in charge of summit), and this thread reminded me of this so...

<img src="http://i.imgur.com/cvNsL.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

Also, it is very painful to make a map semi-smooth for player movement, which is like 95% of the summit updates (stuck points and smoothing out player collisions), but if you report me any annoying movement problems with the map I will try to fix them ASAP. <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=118200" target="_blank">Here's the summit feedback thread</a>.

A lot of these issues are with the props themselves anyways and I can't do anything about them, but I can still give it a try.

Arkanti

<!--quoteo(post=1939344:date=May 28 2012, 03:58 AM:name=ScardyBob)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ScardyBob @ May 28 2012, 03:58 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1939344"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You can get in the first one without any help by sprinting and timing the jump just right.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

You can get through all three, but the second one is the trickiest.

_Necro_

If I'm not wrong, crouching while jumping negates your jump speed. Makes it difficult to get into vents you need to crouch for.
Can't this be changed?