Being "tier 3" doesn't really mean anything at the moment. The abilities are ridiculously easy to research and use. You probably have access to tier 3 abilities before marines can even get jetpack tech.
Xeno must be as strong or weak, that considering marines have armor 2 or 3 it never gets more effective to just sucide bomb, respawn and repeat ALL THE TIME than actually playing smart as skulk until you can afford a higher lifeform again.
To make it work like that it cant do too much damage - since its also aoe...
Basically the damage should be around 2 bites strong, you need to consider it has the potential to weaken a group of marines (also a bit on structures) - so other lifeforms will need to make 1-2 less hits if you placed a perfect xeno - imagine lerk gas and umbra in addition with a fade cleaning up after...
I know its frustrating for ppl to support others when you dont get any feedback ingame like a frag - maybe we get an assist system for the scoreboard at some point, so ppl realize that not beeing the one that gets the frag can still be very beneficial for your team.
<!--quoteo(post=1946102:date=Jun 24 2012, 02:56 AM:name=Koruyo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Koruyo @ Jun 24 2012, 02:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1946102"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Xeno must be as strong or weak, that considering marines have armor 2 or 3 it never gets more effective to just sucide bomb, respawn and repeat ALL THE TIME than actually playing smart as skulk until you can afford a higher lifeform again.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I might be missing something, I've only recently started playing again since initial release, and I'm not that good, but... I don't see how you can "play smart as a skulk" when marines have high tier equipment and research.
You can sneak up on them and get one bite in, but then they just fly off and waste you from range with their Weapons 3 shotgun or rifle or GL. The low level skulk technique of bite, evade, reacquire, bite etc just isn't viable once they know you are in the area (for me at least), so an effective one-off attack that rewards sneaking up on marines would allow you to still be relevant.
Playing smart as a skulk means that you dont engage first or alone, and you try to focus on keeping rts down or try to snipe some other structures... its not your main priority at this point to kill marines anymore. (you work with the higher lifeforms, and do the stuff that would be a waste of time for them - like destroying rts for fades etc. while they try to protect you)
I feel like you think it should be okay for the alien team to lose/fail with all high lifeforms and still have no troubles at all having xeno on skulks - xeno is not here to replace bite.
What are the agreed-upon specs to run the game with a stable high(ish) fps right now? I just played some docking and couldn't get into it because my framerate was dipping so hard..
<!--quoteo(post=1946130:date=Jun 23 2012, 02:26 PM:name=internetexplorer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (internetexplorer @ Jun 23 2012, 02:26 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1946130"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What are the agreed-upon specs to run the game with a stable high(ish) fps right now? I just played some docking and couldn't get into it because my framerate was dipping so hard..<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I playtest with an i7 920 @ 2.66Ghz. I usually only dip to really bad framerate late-game if I play transatlantic, due to CPU-heavy lag compensation and prediction.
<!--quoteo(post=1946190:date=Jun 23 2012, 06:39 PM:name=Obraxis)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Obraxis @ Jun 23 2012, 06:39 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1946190"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I playtest with an i7 920 @ 2.66Ghz. I usually only dip to really bad framerate late-game if I play transatlantic, due to CPU-heavy lag compensation and prediction.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What video card? What screen resolution? What is an acceptable framerate to you?
<!--quoteo(post=1946197:date=Jun 23 2012, 05:17 PM:name=internetexplorer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (internetexplorer @ Jun 23 2012, 05:17 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1946197"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What video card? What screen resolution? What is an acceptable framerate to you?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Indeed... I used to play with an i7 860 @ 2.8 ghz until a month or so ago and I found the game to be pretty unplayable. ~40 frames early game and then an abysmal 10-20 once anything started happening in the game.
ArgathorJoin Date: 2011-07-18Member: 110942Members, Squad Five Blue
I play with an i7 @ 4.2ghz / ATI HD5850 / 12GB RAM / NS2 on SSD and do not find the performance acceptable yet, although it is considerably better than say 6 months ago.
<!--quoteo(post=1946197:date=Jun 24 2012, 12:17 AM:name=internetexplorer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (internetexplorer @ Jun 24 2012, 12:17 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1946197"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What video card? What screen resolution? What is an acceptable framerate to you?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I have a GeForce 470, running at 1080p. Framerate acceptability seems to differ from person to person. Personally, I rate 60fps+ the most playable on PC titles. However for me, I can play games decently from about 30fps+. Anything less than ~24fps I tend to have issues with, as that drops below the framerate of movies. My average framerate start-game is about 40-60 fps, with end-game going down to about 25-35 fps. Performance increases are coming, but for now I can enjoy playing the game on my setup.
<!--quoteo(post=1944601:date=Jun 18 2012, 02:41 PM:name=ironhorse)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ironhorse @ Jun 18 2012, 02:41 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1944601"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Nice post, Rantology. Agree with everything but removing free hydras. (lets not start that one again ;-p)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Does anyone happen to still have a link to the original justification for free gorge structures? I swear I read something by Flayra about it causing a problem with too many structures in high pop count games, but I don't remember were I read it. And yes I'm responding to something that was said a week ago to justify posting this, but it seemed more reasonable than posting a whole new topic to ask for the link, and I can't find it! :p
AurOn2COOKIES! FREEDOM, AND BISCUITS!AustraliaJoin Date: 2012-01-13Member: 140224Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Forum staff
ballanced game =/= fun game Terribuild. Lot of problems made in previous builds that havent been fixed (or even realised.) and too many new features that haven't been properly ballanced to the point where its not op, not boring and doesnt destroy gameplay (well, too much anyway) The Asymmetry level is far too high. its gone so far as to be "if one team has this, the other team cant get something even remodely similar" (hydras anyone?)
IronHorseDeveloper, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributorJoin Date: 2010-05-08Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts
edited June 2012
@Auron2, well this is where you come in with useful feedback on how it can be improved. :)
@Yuuki, the argument is a very good one, but beaten to death regardless. I agree regarding the hard cap - its too much.
@Serpico, i dont want to start that discussion again on these forums, 4 threads of 8 pages long was enough, so if you want some clear answers PM / steam me i'd be more than happy to fill you in on the reasons, according to charlie.
IronHorseDeveloper, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributorJoin Date: 2010-05-08Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts
edited June 2012
Only <i>one </i>out of three reasons you just posted have anything to do with what you drew out previously and <b>what i was responding to</b>: That free hydras are good because a low hydra count is good. Which, clearly, is not what i would consider a "very good" reason.
ScardyBobScardyBobJoin Date: 2009-11-25Member: 69528Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
<!--quoteo(post=1946197:date=Jun 23 2012, 04:17 PM:name=internetexplorer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (internetexplorer @ Jun 23 2012, 04:17 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1946197"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What video card? What screen resolution? What is an acceptable framerate to you?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I have a 2500k OCd to 4.5GHz with a Radeon HD 6950 at 1920x1080 and the latest benchmark I took (Fraps, 20 min gameplay) gave me an average 47 fps, ranging from a min of 11 to a max of 99. Of that 20 min, I was >60fps 9.67% of the time 30-60fps 85.67% of the time <30fps 4.67% of the time I should also add that I disable as much as the graphic options as I can to achieve this (i.e. no atmospherics, bloom, shadows, fog, etc).
Personally, I'd prefer a consistent >60fps (because then my 60hz monitor becomes the limiting hardware), but anything above 30fps is playable, if not desirable for me.
Comments
To make it work like that it cant do too much damage - since its also aoe...
Basically the damage should be around 2 bites strong, you need to consider it has the potential to weaken a group of marines (also a bit on structures) - so other lifeforms will need to make 1-2 less hits if you placed a perfect xeno - imagine lerk gas and umbra in addition with a fade cleaning up after...
I know its frustrating for ppl to support others when you dont get any feedback ingame like a frag - maybe we get an assist system for the scoreboard at some point, so ppl realize that not beeing the one that gets the frag can still be very beneficial for your team.
I might be missing something, I've only recently started playing again since initial release, and I'm not that good, but... I don't see how you can "play smart as a skulk" when marines have high tier equipment and research.
You can sneak up on them and get one bite in, but then they just fly off and waste you from range with their Weapons 3 shotgun or rifle or GL. The low level skulk technique of bite, evade, reacquire, bite etc just isn't viable once they know you are in the area (for me at least), so an effective one-off attack that rewards sneaking up on marines would allow you to still be relevant.
I feel like you think it should be okay for the alien team to lose/fail with all high lifeforms and still have no troubles at all having xeno on skulks - xeno is not here to replace bite.
i7 or i5 clocked at 4+ ghz.
What video card? What screen resolution? What is an acceptable framerate to you?
Indeed... I used to play with an i7 860 @ 2.8 ghz until a month or so ago and I found the game to be pretty unplayable. ~40 frames early game and then an abysmal 10-20 once anything started happening in the game.
I have a GeForce 470, running at 1080p. Framerate acceptability seems to differ from person to person. Personally, I rate 60fps+ the most playable on PC titles. However for me, I can play games decently from about 30fps+. Anything less than ~24fps I tend to have issues with, as that drops below the framerate of movies. My average framerate start-game is about 40-60 fps, with end-game going down to about 25-35 fps. Performance increases are coming, but for now I can enjoy playing the game on my setup.
Agree with everything but removing free hydras. (lets not start that one again ;-p)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Does anyone happen to still have a link to the original justification for free gorge structures? I swear I read something by Flayra about it causing a problem with too many structures in high pop count games, but I don't remember were I read it. And yes I'm responding to something that was said a week ago to justify posting this, but it seemed more reasonable than posting a whole new topic to ask for the link, and I can't find it! :p
Terribuild. Lot of problems made in previous builds that havent been fixed (or even realised.) and too many new features that haven't been properly ballanced to the point where its not op, not boring and doesnt destroy gameplay (well, too much anyway)
The Asymmetry level is far too high. its gone so far as to be "if one team has this, the other team cant get something even remodely similar" (hydras anyone?)
@Yuuki, the argument is a very good one, but beaten to death regardless. I agree regarding the hard cap - its too much.
@Serpico, i dont want to start that discussion again on these forums, 4 threads of 8 pages long was enough, so if you want some clear answers PM / steam me i'd be more than happy to fill you in on the reasons, according to charlie.
Free hydras (A)
Hard cap causes low hydra count (B causes C)
Low hydra count is good
Therefor, free hydras is good.
*
A
B causes C
C is good
Therefor A is good.
*
Very good argument ?
- It's simpler
- Hydra are abilities, abilities don't cost pres!
- Hydra costing pres promotes high hydra count; free hydras solve this problem.
Which, clearly, is not what i would consider a "very good" reason.
I have a 2500k OCd to 4.5GHz with a Radeon HD 6950 at 1920x1080 and the latest benchmark I took (Fraps, 20 min gameplay) gave me an average 47 fps, ranging from a min of 11 to a max of 99. Of that 20 min, I was
>60fps 9.67% of the time
30-60fps 85.67% of the time
<30fps 4.67% of the time
I should also add that I disable as much as the graphic options as I can to achieve this (i.e. no atmospherics, bloom, shadows, fog, etc).
Personally, I'd prefer a consistent >60fps (because then my 60hz monitor becomes the limiting hardware), but anything above 30fps is playable, if not desirable for me.