Cyst denying
supsu
Join Date: 2012-04-24 Member: 151023Members, Squad Five Blue
Join Date: 2012-04-24 Member: 151023Members, Squad Five Blue
<div class="IPBDescription">is not existing.</div>I really think that cyst hp needs to be lowered, they feel almost like a static building now when they are fully matured or even before that which is a bit silly; needing more than one clip on fully matured cyst is just absurd imo.
Anyways everyone knows this so I'm not going into full details of it but something needs to be done and the only answer is to lower their hp. I don't know how much do they need hp lowering but I feel like a lot, being able to kill 3 cysts with a clip sounds like a start or at least far better than 1 cyst with one clip.
Anyways everyone knows this so I'm not going into full details of it but something needs to be done and the only answer is to lower their hp. I don't know how much do they need hp lowering but I feel like a lot, being able to kill 3 cysts with a clip sounds like a start or at least far better than 1 cyst with one clip.
Comments
dude seriously ?!
100% mature cysts even take 1 1/2 lmg clips (weapons lvl 0) before they die :/ way too much for a 1 tres building ...
<!--quoteo(post=1947726:date=Jun 29 2012, 06:14 PM:name=supsu)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (supsu @ Jun 29 2012, 06:14 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1947726"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I really think that cyst hp needs to be lowered, they feel almost like a static building now when they are fully matured or even before that which is a bit silly; needing more than one clip on fully matured cyst is just absurd imo.
Anyways everyone knows this so I'm not going into full details of it but something needs to be done and the only answer is to lower their hp. I don't know how much do they need hp lowering but I feel like a lot, being able to kill 3 cysts with a clip sounds like a start or at least far better than 1 cyst with one clip.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
+1
Anyways everyone knows this so I'm not going into full details of it but something needs to be done and the only answer is to lower their hp. I don't know how much do they need hp lowering but I feel like a lot, being able to kill 3 cysts with a clip sounds like a start or at least far better than 1 cyst with one clip.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
+1
Cyst spam is still out of control. Needs a drastic hp reduction (like 1/5th of current HP) plus perhaps a 5 second cooldown.
Reduce their HP to ~300 (half current hp) and give them a 5 second cooldown.
For aliens commander its annoying to have to constantly replace the cysts chains. For marines, its annoying to constantly be on their knees knifing the damn things. Aliens themselves probably love them though, as it leaves marines open for attack often.
Reduce their HP to ~300 (half current hp) and give them a 5 second cooldown.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
5 second cooldown is fine for lategame, but early game that would make expansion so hard.
Ah ok. Somehow I assumed they would go.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Ah ok. Somehow I assumed they would go.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I thought so too. My thought was flamethrowers would be used to kill DI.
It takes about that time for the cysts to grow anyways, so it wouldnt really affect early expansion. Agree that cysts should be much easier to kill and need to be scanned before you can find/shoot em. Cyst spam is definitely a huge problem as always, very cripling for marines. Even more so now that you get very severe slowdown on infestation as a marine which is utter bull######.
Since arcs can no longer target cysts, aliens spamming these are extremely effective, especially in the marine base. Turrets can't kill them fast enough. Marines have the option to shoot or axe them, but then they are defenseless against incoming aliens as they will be reloading, or have an axe out.
The marines are damned if they leave the cysts up, infestation with healing bed will help aliens and it opens the possibility of Alien Comm spamming whips, and damned if they attack the cysts leaving them defenseless against alien attacks and delaying them from taking or defending RT's across the map.
Used to be the case, but the result was that aliens could cover the marine base in infestation before they teched up and there'd be nothing they could do about it.
Try to keep it constructive please. FYI: Cysts are here to stay, at least for 1.0 and probably much longer. It's a matter of balancing and I'm sure a solution will be found.
A good one would be to increase flamethrower dmg vs cysts - there you have it, an easy counter for the DI, like it used to be.
Saying "late game tech should fix the early/mid game problem!" is just..
If a rooms infested rines could build a power node. But with mature cysts they'd need to deal with them to get rid of infestation. Ergo light room and border control.
Flamers do nice damage to cysts. Spams not a issue axe a mature cyst down. Shoot any re spam not imediantly infornt of you. If you don't have a flamer. Or skip over two or three cysts and sever the chain. Which dang that can cause issues. And is just as bad as losing a phase gate at forward base. The only difference is you Ned to baby sit the cyst spam which costs trez.kharaa structures kill them self. Waiting period. Kharaa sever a forward base. They have to kill every thing time wasted.
The reclaiming difference work better in rines favor. As well. Kharaa have to come down a corridor rines are baby sitting with guns while their structures die, shooting galley.
Kharaa have to chomp structures rines travel the distance till they can shoot them, kharaa have to break off chomping structures and. Run a shooting gallery. If they split their forces takes longer to chomp. They need to be baby sat. So rines don't jump them. But can effectively deny rines. But puts the number back in rines favor. Best situation is a vocal forward scout. Still one less chomper
Sure rines can split and take down structures but can still effectively deny a area with range at the click of a button. I have noticed its far more easier as a marine to take back lost ground than kharaa. No matter the equipment. And kharaa it's harder with out higher life forms. Or a variation of life forms. E.g fade protection gorge bile bomb. Skulk support lerk running scout. These roles can all be done with skulk but it's paper thin and takes longer.
Complete changelog:
<b>Alien:</b>
- Infestation is visible, cyst are invisible(can be detected with scan, or when you hit them).
- Cyst now cost 2 (was 1). Really pondering on 2tres or 3tres: 2tres equals 3rts at the beginning 3tres cost equals 2rts at the beginning.
- Placing Cyst now has cooldown of 1 seconds (was 0.3 seconds).
- Cyst now doesn't take any damage when unconnected.
- Cyst mature and nonmature health is now 120 (was 400,650).
Other changes:
(We are not planning on keeping these, just waiting uwe to come one's senses and making these changes themselves)
- Changed kPlayerResPerInterval to 0.175, was 0.125, to get the lifeforms at the same time when they used to(at 7min~ mark fade etc with 3res nodes).
- Additional armor from carapace is now same than in build 210 (s=30, g=120, l=80, f=80, o=550) (was: s=50, g=150, l=100, f=80, o=600). Speed reduction is still there.
- Research leap cost increased to 40 (was 25). In order to avoid 40second leap; fix it uwe already, it's just meant to be in 5-7min mark(or when second hive pops up) not in first minute mark.
Bugs:
- Shade not affecting infestation(we'll try to get it working)
- Alien commander tooltips aren't fixed; it says that cyst costs 1tres when it in reality costs 2tres, leap 25 when in reality 40 etc.(we'll fix it if there's an easy way to fix it, trying to keep this fully serverside).
- ?
Stuff that we'll try get working:
- Shade making infestation invisible.
- Removing infestation slowdown for marines.
<b>Marines:</b>
-Nanoshield cost inceased from 3 to 5.
-Nanoconstruct cost is the same but the effect is reduced from 4 to 2.
*Both will be probably balanced again after some testing and discussion.
We played a few gathers and pcws with these settings except cysts didn't get invisible it played pretty well. Feel free to go try it on exertus' server and give us your feedback.
Changelog and future changes can be found here: <a href="http://q-q.name/balancemod/" target="_blank">http://q-q.name/balancemod/</a>
Its the same problem as nano/med spam but you did nothing to fix that..
Anyways I'm not trying to achieve ultimate balance with this mod or fix all the problems that's currently in the game, just trying to make the game a bit more playable and see what weaker cyst does to the game balance-wise, to see if it'd be good, which i think and hope it'll be.
The mod feels like it probably reaffirms the importance of killing cysts despite the universal hatred players feel towards doing menial tasks. That's why I think it's just a misguided attempt to do what you're doing.
Reducing the cyst hp, assuming you are keeping them, is definitely better than leaving them as is. A cyst with much less hp is much less of a problem than a cyst with more hp. If this is is enough or not is debatable, but it is absolutely undeniable that it isn't worse.
Also, as far as balance mods go, simple changes are better than complex changes. Removing cysts is a much more drastic fix than just lowering their hp. The bar is set incredibly high if you're going to make such huge changes from the vanilla game. I'm not sure that cysts meet that requirement.