<!--quoteo(post=2040360:date=Dec 5 2012, 03:20 PM:name=current1y)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (current1y @ Dec 5 2012, 03:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2040360"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->180ish..I was wrong before i have about 160 hrs as gorge not 120 :)
But your right, It doesn't happen a lot that's for sure it still can happen though.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yea, that's my point. I'm not saying it's bad, at all, it's pretty awesome.
But, assuming average 20min match duration, 180 hours = 540 matches played.
Those joke posts.. love it. No i dont mean the topic starter!
Gorge is a ###### joke, no matter how often those *** repeat how omg godlike he is. Without heal/bile the would be 0 reason to go gorge.
Oh and i got like 400hrs of ns2... just sayin cause this seems to be a "my opinion ###### counts.. yeah ###### im right" thing around here.
90% of the time i see a gorge as a rine.. its a dead gorge. Only if he is near a ramp (slide boost) and i got no jp he may surivive... well or in addition to clogwall and hydras (both a joke) there are like 2 skulks or something like this. If only a clogwall... 1 clog dies.. marine jumps over... gorge dies while hydras do a troll face... rine goes to save distance or strafe and kills all the 3 res graves.
The impact comes from when your Hydra gets that random kill and you go "WOW MY HYDRA JUST GOT A KILL!"
Though I've seen and done some effective Gorge wall setups, but it usually involved at least 2 Gorges to build up the wall due to the size of most chokepoints. Great for a delaying strat in the early game, but not that rewarding having to baby a wall with hydras. Though I suppose it does increase your chance of getting the random spit kill, which is nice when it does happen.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Without heal/bile the would be 0 reason to go gorge.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Without assault rifles and shotguns, there would be 0 reason to go marine.
<!--quoteo(post=2040379:date=Dec 5 2012, 10:56 AM:name=oMe)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (oMe @ Dec 5 2012, 10:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2040379"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Those joke posts.. love it. No i dont mean the topic starter!
Gorge is a ###### joke, no matter how often those *** repeat how omg godlike he is. Without heal/bile the would be 0 reason to go gorge.
Oh and i got like 400hrs of ns2... just sayin cause this seems to be a "my opinion ###### counts.. yeah ###### im right" thing around here.
90% of the time i see a gorge as a rine.. its a dead gorge. Only if he is near a ramp (slide boost) and i got no jp he may surivive... well or in addition to clogwall and hydras (both a joke) there are like 2 skulks or something like this. If only a clogwall... 1 clog dies.. marine jumps over... gorge dies while hydras do a troll face... rine goes to save distance or strafe and kills all the 3 res graves.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> That's the whole point we're all making. Gorges aren't there to solo marines, they're there to support other aliens. If the gorge is off alone in some corner of the map he deserves to die. But if he's not, if he's in a position that aliens are defending, and marines want, then hydras are great. They make nearby skulks and ESPECIALLY fades SO much more annoying, because you can't just chase them down, and you can't run into the room and camp the best positions for defending from skulks. You get stuck right in a door way where any lifeform can fly in at any time and tenderly love you from behind without your consent if you know what I mean.
Hydras are weapons of attrition, Ex: double on viel, 5 rines jump the clog wall to find 3 skulks, 1 gorge and 3 hydras, hydras don't get any kills but the constant pecking away of armor and health take rines down from 3-4 bite kills to 1-2 bite kills.
An abandoned hydra is lost res, but a hydra with a gorge and a skulk nearby is huge... Gorge heel hydra, skulk eat rine when he is reloading... Ex: double on viel, 3 hydras at entrance with clog wall gorge heal hydras as 3 rines shoot at them, Skulk runs out other side goes up through vent and drops down on rines who are reloading and distracted. Skulk get 3 kills gorge saves hydras, aliens win engagement.
This is why hydras are useful. What you want is a postition that allows you to kill skulks, allows you to kill hydras, is safe from skulks, and is safe from hydras, and to be able to move forward. If hydras are well placed, you can't have those options.
In position 1 you are safe from skulks and hydras, you can kill skulks if they come at you, but you cannot kill hydras, and you are not moving forwards. In position 2, you are safe from hydras, and you can kill hydras, but you are very unsafe from skulks, and it's hard to kill skulks, forward movement requires moving from 1 to 2. In position 3 you once again get a position that's not too bad for killing skulks, but you must sacrifice being unsafe from hydras. You can kill the hydras, maybe, if there aren't skulks you are forced to fight first, but in any position you can't guarantee both safety from skulks and safety from hydras without just staying back and not moving forward. If you don't move forward, then the hydras have accomplished their goal.
So yeah, hyrdas are bad if there are no skulks to threaten you in position 2, and that can make them very difficult to use properly (so much so that personally, I don't drop hydras). But if there are skulks, hydras suddenly become a pretty big problem.
<!--quoteo(post=2040397:date=Dec 5 2012, 11:45 AM:name=Gorgenapper)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Gorgenapper @ Dec 5 2012, 11:45 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2040397"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Without assault rifles and shotguns, there would be 0 reason to go marine.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
LOL...
but ya his 90% kill rate of gorges I think is a valid point if I understand what he's saying correctly. With no support if you call their hydra clog wall bluff they'll easily die. I find it happening more and more now that marines are learning to deal with them. Clog walls+hydras may stop up to 3 marines if support can come but this is because they focus on trying to kill your wall and hydras until there is no trace and not kill the gorge behind it.
That said..i still think the idea is for your wall and hydras to delay marines not stop them. The problem in my opinion that if at least 1 marine (alone) knows what they are doing it doesn't really delay them, other then the cip it takes to kill one.
For the moment I wouldn't mind seeing clogs and hydras remain as they are except cost 1 pres less and give hydra damage indicators on the gorges screen so I know when to stop defense and go on offense.
U just make up rare situations that for a gorge feel weak and this way boring to be the true gorge play... hell maybe in clan matches. But i say ###### clans to hell and back.
Im a ns1 gorge only player and i barely touch gorge in ns2 anymore (not since he cant even defend a chokepoint against 1 or 2 rines). Well late game for a rush as heal and bile B i t c h.. So yeah, everything is fine.
This is why hydras are useful. What you want is a postition that allows you to kill skulks, allows you to kill hydras, is safe from skulks, and is safe from hydras, and to be able to move forward. If hydras are well placed, you can't have those options.
In position 1 you are safe from skulks and hydras, you can kill skulks if they come at you, but you cannot kill hydras, and you are not moving forwards. In position 2, you are safe from hydras, and you can kill hydras, but you are very unsafe from skulks, and it's hard to kill skulks, forward movement requires moving from 1 to 2. In position 3 you once again get a position that's not too bad for killing skulks, but you must sacrifice being unsafe from hydras. You can kill the hydras, maybe, if there aren't skulks you are forced to fight first, but in any position you can't guarantee both safety from skulks and safety from hydras without just staying back and not moving forward. If you don't move forward, then the hydras have accomplished their goal.
So yeah, hyrdas are bad if there are no skulks to threaten you in position 2, and that can make them very difficult to use properly (so much so that personally, I don't drop hydras). But if there are skulks, hydras suddenly become a pretty big problem.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hydras can simply be ignored. I've had a gorge build up clogs and hydras around a similar scenario as you posted. I just ran past the hydras and pretended they didn't exist. They maybe did 20 damage to me? They are easy to dodge. I just ran past them and continued to destroy skulks coming my way, after I killed the Gorge, of course. People keep saying that they keep people at bay, even if temporarily. Those are players who doesn't realize how little threat hydras actually are. Ones you get marines who know better, they'll just run right past them. Even if you do take damage, all you have to do is ask for a medpack and you continue on your merry way. The hydras aren't even worth killing. They are that laughable. Long story short, they are only good at delaying marines who don't realize how little of a threat they are.
I prefer to play Gorge because I cling on the nostalgia of the Gorge from NS1. I just love being a support unit. One viable use I've seen for Hydras are to put them out of sight and mind well above corridors and doors. I create clogs sporadically as "fallback" points as the marine comes in to kill the hellpess Gorge. As I'm retreating I dodge in and out of clog spots as I randomly spit at the marine. They often just think it's just me hitting them and not realize they are being tickled to death from hydras which are now behind them striking them in the back.
The problem is that this is very much a one trick pony. Once the marine dies, he knows what's there and either kills them or runs past them out of range then tries to chase me out of my area.
Other viable uses is for the alien commander to go gorge once he has some res, place hydras at the upgrade buildings, go back to skulk again and then hop back in the hive. The hydras act as a decoy while the commander can hop out and bite the marine the moment he has to reload. Additionally, gorges can drop hydras at resource towers to help persuade marines from just letting the RT live. The problem with that is that viable option isn't fun or engaging. It's drop and forget.
>Place hydras literally 1 m from the starting hive. >Only lowest will grow.
Siriuosly, wtf is that. You know that alien start at ref? So I place hydras In a straight vertical line on a door way right next to the hive. Height is about marine height, the are like in front of the hive, facing towards it. And they won't even grow by themselves. Wtf.
Hydras are support structures. They persist throughout the game, so they're pretty useful if they stay defended. They're obviously not going to be useful if you position them badly. The commander can also drop a mist in a room with a lot of hydras to give them more health. Point is, just because they don't kill marines, doesn't mean they don't drastically affect the game. Clogs don't kill marines, but they do stop them and buy time for aliens, just as hydras function.
<!--quoteo(post=2040454:date=Dec 5 2012, 01:07 PM:name=Champlo0)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Champlo0 @ Dec 5 2012, 01:07 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2040454"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Hydras are support structures. They persist throughout the game, so they're pretty useful if they stay defended. They're obviously not going to be useful if you position them badly. The commander can also drop a mist in a room with a lot of hydras to give them more health. Point is, just because they don't kill marines, doesn't mean they don't drastically affect the game. Clogs don't kill marines, but they do stop them and buy time for aliens, just as hydras function.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes but clogs are free. A full hydra drop costs 9 res for very little in return. In fact, it's only situationally useful. Imagine if clogs costed 2 res each.
ScardyBobScardyBobJoin Date: 2009-11-25Member: 69528Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
<!--quoteo(post=2040324:date=Dec 5 2012, 03:53 AM:name=buhehe)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (buhehe @ Dec 5 2012, 03:53 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2040324"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I saw a gorge rush.
Once.
In a video.
What are the odds of a WHOLE pub team going gorge? Probably close to 0, hence pointless statement.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<a href="http://www.twitch.tv/naturalselection2/b/344293814" target="_blank">http://www.twitch.tv/naturalselection2/b/344293814</a> Go to the 49 min mark. This happened last Friday, in a competitive match, and was actually quite refreshing to watch.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I saw a gorge rush.
Once.
In a video.
What are the odds of a WHOLE pub team going gorge? Probably close to 0, hence pointless statement.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Happened 6 times in a row on the KKG servers. It's all fun and games until the GLs research (I suppose the alien comm SHOULD have been expanding while the gorges rush, and getting whips to support the gorges).
Lets be honest,hydras are garbage.They are not cost-effective,annoying(but not fearsome) for marines,die in no time.
The main idea is that non-players should not affect game very much when unsupported by players?Add ability for gorge to manually target hydras,increasing their HP and damage output.Think wrangler from TF2.
<!--quoteo(post=2040530:date=Dec 5 2012, 01:10 PM:name=ComboBreaker)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ComboBreaker @ Dec 5 2012, 01:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2040530"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Lets be honest,hydras are garbage.They are not cost-effective,annoying(but not fearsome) for marines,die in no time.
The main idea is that non-players should not affect game very much when unsupported by players?Add ability for gorge to manually target hydras,increasing their HP and damage output.Think wrangler from TF2.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There was an idea a while ago that the gorges spit (or another ability) could be used to pick a priority target for hydras, giving them increased accuracy and firing rate against the painted enemy.
Think Pheremones acting as a catalyst for hydras. Give spit more utility!
Players forget that this is an FPS/RTS hybrid and not just an FPS. the unit itself is actually pretty good, since you can just passively put it down and then if you die/switch to another lifeform then at least the clogs/hydras you placed are still an effective barrier that needs time to be removed/avoided. Most people focus too hard on their individual contributions when using their personal res to place something instead of the effect it has toward the team's success, its the same thing as mines for marines, passive defense that slows down the other team protecting your res points or important structures, this passive defense can also provide advantage your team needs to win the turning point most of the time in very tense battles in highly critical locations "how many games have been won just by placing mines/hydras in nano grid?" They aren't meant to kill players by themselves, but they sure as hell have a huge impact on the game, if you fail to infer that from your gameplay so far perhaps you just need to play some more? (idunno.)
I also think most people get butthurt about hydra's due to their cost, and because they don't immediately don't see them racking up kills after they place them down. They also get upset because it delays them towards the higher tier lifeforms (something they probably depend on to do well). I think people undervalue the psychology it puts on most average players in games, and that when they actually hit something they make it significantly easier for the other team to do their job well, they are support structures, just like crags or shifts or whatever else have you, except they debuff and deter the enemies that enter the area that they encompass, with the potiential to kill, a very large impact indeed.
I'm surprised no one complains about clogs instead. I can't count the number of times I've held off 2 marines from a door way just by spamming insta clogs, preventing the marines from moving in.
<!--quoteo(post=2040570:date=Dec 5 2012, 11:39 PM:name=Angry Child)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Angry Child @ Dec 5 2012, 11:39 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2040570"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Players forget that this is an FPS/RTS hybrid and not just an FPS. the unit itself is actually pretty good, since you can just passively put it down and then if you die/switch to another lifeform then at least the clogs/hydras you placed are still an effective barrier that needs time to be removed/avoided. Most people focus too hard on their individual contributions when using their personal res to place something instead of the effect it has toward the team's success, its the same thing as mines for marines, passive defense that slows down the other team protecting your res points or important structures, this passive defense can also provide advantage your team needs to win the turning point most of the time in very tense battles in highly critical locations "how many games have been won just by placing mines/hydras in nano grid?" They aren't meant to kill players by themselves, but they sure as hell have a huge impact on the game, if you fail to infer that from your gameplay so far perhaps you just need to play some more? (idunno.)
I also think most people get butthurt about hydra's due to their cost, and because they don't immediately don't see them racking up kills after they place them down. They also get upset because it delays them towards the higher tier lifeforms (something they probably depend on to do well). I think people undervalue the psychology it puts on most average players in games, and that when they actually hit something they make it significantly easier for the other team to do their job well, they are support structures, just like crags or shifts or whatever else have you, except they debuff and deter the enemies that enter the area that they encompass, with the potiential to kill, a very large impact indeed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I couldn't describe it better, very very much what are my thoughts about this topic. It is mostly the same with the Flamethrower that <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=125452&hl=" target="_blank">people just don't get it</a> that it is a supportive tool and not a killing machine.
<!--quoteo(post=2041042:date=Dec 6 2012, 10:56 AM:name=MuckyMcFly)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MuckyMcFly @ Dec 6 2012, 10:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2041042"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->2 x Gorge + Hydras + Clogs = Hold key areas with ease untill the GL's come into play.
Last night solo held Locker rooms from three marines rushing, perhaps people arnt playing the class right in the games you've played.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Thats one of my most fav gorge spots because its guaranteed to get some intense action and often times you can hold it as gorge. And due to the door that shuts and door frame so many diff ways you can clog/hydra it up to keep things interesting. + as a bonus it's so easy to do hit and run bile bomb attacks on caf....
I just wish there was a way to shut off the music. I may try to find that file and delete it if possible :).
<!--quoteo(post=2041047:date=Dec 6 2012, 05:12 PM:name=current1y)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (current1y @ Dec 6 2012, 05:12 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2041047"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Thats one of my most fav gorge spots because its guaranteed to get some intense action and often times you can hold it as gorge. And due to the door that shuts and door frame so many diff ways you can clog/hydra it up to keep things interesting. + as a bonus it's so easy to do hit and run bile bomb attacks on caf....
I just wish there was a way to shut off the music. I may try to find that file and delete it if possible :).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Hmm...consistency check?
Don't place hydra's where they can be sniped by an LMG?
I've always put them on the inside wall of a room. Player sees me, thinks i'm an easy kill, or a harvester is an easy kill, walks into a room into 3 hydra's, gets hit a couple times before he knows what's hit him.
Does it kill him? Probably not. Does it make him think twice or run out of range and away from what i'm protecting? Yes.
Though i have to admit, i'd rather save 9 res to go lerk early these days than place an item that can be killed in a single LMG clip. As a marine i tend to just outright ignore hydra's and run past them to the juicy goods like the fleeing gorge. Where i place hydra's is very specific, small rooms where they can't be seen from outside. If i can't do that i don't place them and save for something else.
Comments
But your right, It doesn't happen a lot that's for sure it still can happen though.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yea, that's my point.
I'm not saying it's bad, at all, it's pretty awesome.
But, assuming average 20min match duration, 180 hours = 540 matches played.
4/540 = 0,7% full gorge rushes
Gorge is a ###### joke, no matter how often those *** repeat how omg godlike he is.
Without heal/bile the would be 0 reason to go gorge.
Oh and i got like 400hrs of ns2... just sayin cause this seems to be a "my opinion ###### counts.. yeah ###### im right" thing around here.
90% of the time i see a gorge as a rine.. its a dead gorge.
Only if he is near a ramp (slide boost) and i got no jp he may surivive... well or in addition to clogwall and hydras (both a joke) there are like 2 skulks or something like this.
If only a clogwall... 1 clog dies.. marine jumps over... gorge dies while hydras do a troll face... rine goes to save distance or strafe and kills all the 3 res graves.
Though I've seen and done some effective Gorge wall setups, but it usually involved at least 2 Gorges to build up the wall due to the size of most chokepoints. Great for a delaying strat in the early game, but not that rewarding having to baby a wall with hydras. Though I suppose it does increase your chance of getting the random spit kill, which is nice when it does happen.
Without assault rifles and shotguns, there would be 0 reason to go marine.
Gorge is a ###### joke, no matter how often those *** repeat how omg godlike he is.
Without heal/bile the would be 0 reason to go gorge.
Oh and i got like 400hrs of ns2... just sayin cause this seems to be a "my opinion ###### counts.. yeah ###### im right" thing around here.
90% of the time i see a gorge as a rine.. its a dead gorge.
Only if he is near a ramp (slide boost) and i got no jp he may surivive... well or in addition to clogwall and hydras (both a joke) there are like 2 skulks or something like this.
If only a clogwall... 1 clog dies.. marine jumps over... gorge dies while hydras do a troll face... rine goes to save distance or strafe and kills all the 3 res graves.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's the whole point we're all making. Gorges aren't there to solo marines, they're there to support other aliens. If the gorge is off alone in some corner of the map he deserves to die. But if he's not, if he's in a position that aliens are defending, and marines want, then hydras are great. They make nearby skulks and ESPECIALLY fades SO much more annoying, because you can't just chase them down, and you can't run into the room and camp the best positions for defending from skulks. You get stuck right in a door way where any lifeform can fly in at any time and tenderly love you from behind without your consent if you know what I mean.
An abandoned hydra is lost res, but a hydra with a gorge and a skulk nearby is huge... Gorge heel hydra, skulk eat rine when he is reloading... Ex: double on viel, 3 hydras at entrance with clog wall gorge heal hydras as 3 rines shoot at them, Skulk runs out other side goes up through vent and drops down on rines who are reloading and distracted. Skulk get 3 kills gorge saves hydras, aliens win engagement.
This is why hydras are useful. What you want is a postition that allows you to kill skulks, allows you to kill hydras, is safe from skulks, and is safe from hydras, and to be able to move forward. If hydras are well placed, you can't have those options.
In position 1 you are safe from skulks and hydras, you can kill skulks if they come at you, but you cannot kill hydras, and you are not moving forwards. In position 2, you are safe from hydras, and you can kill hydras, but you are very unsafe from skulks, and it's hard to kill skulks, forward movement requires moving from 1 to 2. In position 3 you once again get a position that's not too bad for killing skulks, but you must sacrifice being unsafe from hydras. You can kill the hydras, maybe, if there aren't skulks you are forced to fight first, but in any position you can't guarantee both safety from skulks and safety from hydras without just staying back and not moving forward. If you don't move forward, then the hydras have accomplished their goal.
So yeah, hyrdas are bad if there are no skulks to threaten you in position 2, and that can make them very difficult to use properly (so much so that personally, I don't drop hydras). But if there are skulks, hydras suddenly become a pretty big problem.
LOL...
but ya his 90% kill rate of gorges I think is a valid point if I understand what he's saying correctly. With no support if you call their hydra clog wall bluff they'll easily die. I find it happening more and more now that marines are learning to deal with them. Clog walls+hydras may stop up to 3 marines if support can come but this is because they focus on trying to kill your wall and hydras until there is no trace and not kill the gorge behind it.
That said..i still think the idea is for your wall and hydras to delay marines not stop them. The problem in my opinion that if at least 1 marine (alone) knows what they are doing it doesn't really delay them, other then the cip it takes to kill one.
For the moment I wouldn't mind seeing clogs and hydras remain as they are except cost 1 pres less and give hydra damage indicators on the gorges screen so I know when to stop defense and go on offense.
They should need an upgrade in middle/lategame and all will be fine.
Im a ns1 gorge only player and i barely touch gorge in ns2 anymore (not since he cant even defend a chokepoint against 1 or 2 rines).
Well late game for a rush as heal and bile B i t c h..
So yeah, everything is fine.
This is why hydras are useful. What you want is a postition that allows you to kill skulks, allows you to kill hydras, is safe from skulks, and is safe from hydras, and to be able to move forward. If hydras are well placed, you can't have those options.
In position 1 you are safe from skulks and hydras, you can kill skulks if they come at you, but you cannot kill hydras, and you are not moving forwards. In position 2, you are safe from hydras, and you can kill hydras, but you are very unsafe from skulks, and it's hard to kill skulks, forward movement requires moving from 1 to 2. In position 3 you once again get a position that's not too bad for killing skulks, but you must sacrifice being unsafe from hydras. You can kill the hydras, maybe, if there aren't skulks you are forced to fight first, but in any position you can't guarantee both safety from skulks and safety from hydras without just staying back and not moving forward. If you don't move forward, then the hydras have accomplished their goal.
So yeah, hyrdas are bad if there are no skulks to threaten you in position 2, and that can make them very difficult to use properly (so much so that personally, I don't drop hydras). But if there are skulks, hydras suddenly become a pretty big problem.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hydras can simply be ignored. I've had a gorge build up clogs and hydras around a similar scenario as you posted. I just ran past the hydras and pretended they didn't exist. They maybe did 20 damage to me? They are easy to dodge. I just ran past them and continued to destroy skulks coming my way, after I killed the Gorge, of course. People keep saying that they keep people at bay, even if temporarily. Those are players who doesn't realize how little threat hydras actually are. Ones you get marines who know better, they'll just run right past them. Even if you do take damage, all you have to do is ask for a medpack and you continue on your merry way. The hydras aren't even worth killing. They are that laughable. Long story short, they are only good at delaying marines who don't realize how little of a threat they are.
I prefer to play Gorge because I cling on the nostalgia of the Gorge from NS1. I just love being a support unit. One viable use I've seen for Hydras are to put them out of sight and mind well above corridors and doors. I create clogs sporadically as "fallback" points as the marine comes in to kill the hellpess Gorge. As I'm retreating I dodge in and out of clog spots as I randomly spit at the marine. They often just think it's just me hitting them and not realize they are being tickled to death from hydras which are now behind them striking them in the back.
The problem is that this is very much a one trick pony. Once the marine dies, he knows what's there and either kills them or runs past them out of range then tries to chase me out of my area.
Other viable uses is for the alien commander to go gorge once he has some res, place hydras at the upgrade buildings, go back to skulk again and then hop back in the hive. The hydras act as a decoy while the commander can hop out and bite the marine the moment he has to reload. Additionally, gorges can drop hydras at resource towers to help persuade marines from just letting the RT live. The problem with that is that viable option isn't fun or engaging. It's drop and forget.
>Only lowest will grow.
Siriuosly, wtf is that. You know that alien start at ref? So I place hydras In a straight vertical line on a door way right next to the hive. Height is about marine height, the are like in front of the hive, facing towards it. And they won't even grow by themselves. Wtf.
Yes but clogs are free. A full hydra drop costs 9 res for very little in return. In fact, it's only situationally useful. Imagine if clogs costed 2 res each.
Once.
In a video.
What are the odds of a WHOLE pub team going gorge?
Probably close to 0, hence pointless statement.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<a href="http://www.twitch.tv/naturalselection2/b/344293814" target="_blank">http://www.twitch.tv/naturalselection2/b/344293814</a>
Go to the 49 min mark. This happened last Friday, in a competitive match, and was actually quite refreshing to watch.
Once.
In a video.
What are the odds of a WHOLE pub team going gorge?
Probably close to 0, hence pointless statement.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Happened 6 times in a row on the KKG servers. It's all fun and games until the GLs research (I suppose the alien comm SHOULD have been expanding while the gorges rush, and getting whips to support the gorges).
The main idea is that non-players should not affect game very much when unsupported by players?Add ability for gorge to manually target hydras,increasing their HP and damage output.Think wrangler from TF2.
The main idea is that non-players should not affect game very much when unsupported by players?Add ability for gorge to manually target hydras,increasing their HP and damage output.Think wrangler from TF2.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There was an idea a while ago that the gorges spit (or another ability) could be used to pick a priority target for hydras, giving them increased accuracy and firing rate against the painted enemy.
Think Pheremones acting as a catalyst for hydras. Give spit more utility!
I also think most people get butthurt about hydra's due to their cost, and because they don't immediately don't see them racking up kills after they place them down. They also get upset because it delays them towards the higher tier lifeforms (something they probably depend on to do well). I think people undervalue the psychology it puts on most average players in games, and that when they actually hit something they make it significantly easier for the other team to do their job well, they are support structures, just like crags or shifts or whatever else have you, except they debuff and deter the enemies that enter the area that they encompass, with the potiential to kill, a very large impact indeed.
I also think most people get butthurt about hydra's due to their cost, and because they don't immediately don't see them racking up kills after they place them down. They also get upset because it delays them towards the higher tier lifeforms (something they probably depend on to do well). I think people undervalue the psychology it puts on most average players in games, and that when they actually hit something they make it significantly easier for the other team to do their job well, they are support structures, just like crags or shifts or whatever else have you, except they debuff and deter the enemies that enter the area that they encompass, with the potiential to kill, a very large impact indeed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I couldn't describe it better, very very much what are my thoughts about this topic. It is mostly the same with the Flamethrower that <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=125452&hl=" target="_blank">people just don't get it</a> that it is a supportive tool and not a killing machine.
Last night solo held Locker rooms from three marines rushing, perhaps people arnt playing the class right in the games you've played.
Last night solo held Locker rooms from three marines rushing, perhaps people arnt playing the class right in the games you've played.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Thats one of my most fav gorge spots because its guaranteed to get some intense action and often times you can hold it as gorge. And due to the door that shuts and door frame so many diff ways you can clog/hydra it up to keep things interesting. + as a bonus it's so easy to do hit and run bile bomb attacks on caf....
I just wish there was a way to shut off the music. I may try to find that file and delete it if possible :).
I just wish there was a way to shut off the music. I may try to find that file and delete it if possible :).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hmm...consistency check?
Did i contradict myself some where else?
Oh nvm I understand now..
I've always put them on the inside wall of a room. Player sees me, thinks i'm an easy kill, or a harvester is an easy kill, walks into a room into 3 hydra's, gets hit a couple times before he knows what's hit him.
Does it kill him? Probably not. Does it make him think twice or run out of range and away from what i'm protecting? Yes.
Though i have to admit, i'd rather save 9 res to go lerk early these days than place an item that can be killed in a single LMG clip. As a marine i tend to just outright ignore hydra's and run past them to the juicy goods like the fleeing gorge. Where i place hydra's is very specific, small rooms where they can't be seen from outside. If i can't do that i don't place them and save for something else.