Sorry bud, I have bad news for you, the marine commander is also locked into completely predictable tech paths, perhaps even more so then the alien commander.
The only difference is the marines depend more on the commander for support and the commander has more powerful/omnipresent active support abilities allowing the marine commander to stay busier.
I think the addition of some sort of omnipresent alien support ability such as +25% movement speed buff to target player would make the kham position much more active and fun. Sure there is drifter enzyme, but its alot harder to pull off, has a higher res risk ratio and to be honest, attack speed is rarely helpful against marines unless you have godlike aim and movement skills.
A good kham stays busy by hopping out of the hive and supporting as a gorge or maybe even as a skulk. The problem is not as large as you make it out to be.
<!--quoteo(post=2041842:date=Dec 7 2012, 10:14 PM:name=bERt0r)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bERt0r @ Dec 7 2012, 10:14 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2041842"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Anyone read my <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=125442" target="_blank">suggestion </a> regarding the cyst system? It would address a lot of the issues mentionened here as in giving the khammander more to do and spend his res on.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The issue would be that the mechanics of what and why the cyst behavior is changing would be hard to communicate to players, and therefore seem pretty mysterious without a LOT of game experience. A game can get away with a few highly dense systems like this, but NS already has several, and many of them interact, I think your idea would push it past the point of "reasonably comprehensible".
<!--quoteo(post=2041842:date=Dec 7 2012, 09:14 PM:name=bERt0r)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bERt0r @ Dec 7 2012, 09:14 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2041842"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Anyone read my <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=125442" target="_blank">suggestion </a> regarding the cyst system? It would address a lot of the issues mentionened here as in giving the khammander more to do and spend his res on.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This would not work, if you want to inflate T.Res expenditure while adding nothing but a painful gimmick you do exactly what you suggested. UWE went with a similar 'inflate alien costs' route with their nerfs to all the structures to require more and more of them. Since their price-to-effectiveness ratio is already so low as to make them useless outside of their default area buff, dropping another life form egg becomes a better investment in almost any situation involving any alien structures outside of a few rare exceptions. (Quick shift to try and repel Exo's with Gorges, for instance.)
I don't know, the gardening part of alien command was fun when it felt like you contributed something other than being a dedicated upgrade button pusher than even a retarded AI could have handled.
I guess maybe the commander really should get out of the hive. I mean, even if a total noob gets into the hive is there really any damage they could do past not choosing the upgrades mid-game? Either every button on the alien interface is a win button or a lose button in the current build it would seem. When in doubt, push buttons and there's no chance your team will fail! (Unless they're terrible, I suppose.)
If you think this would make the com waste more res on cysts you got it wrong. It would just give the marines some way to keep the alien comm busy. Similar to queens with inject larva in sc2, the comm would have to periodically check if his cyst cooldowns are done in order to expand. -> More multitasking required. More "skill". -> More strategy. Right now, you only kill cysts if you want to build somewhere. This could make cyst line harass a valid strategy.
When I'm alien khammander, I like to go shift first, and then jump out and gorge up the second hive (as opposed to just sitting waiting for it to be built, which seems like the alternative most games). I'm fine using my (mostly useless) pRes on a few (mostly useless) Hydra and hopefully freeing up some time for another player to push. If a cyst chain gets broken, I can usually get someone to jump in the hive and reconnect it.
That said, I do think there's a considerable disconnect between alien com and marine com, but I think the problem has more to do with the relative worthlessness of alien structures in comparison to marine structures.
I'm seeing a lot of debate here about the simplistic tech paths and such, but I'm not seeing a lot of suggestions about how to make it better. I don't think removing the khammander role is the solution, and to say that the khammander is too passive suggests you haven't fully embraced all the things a khammander can do:
<u>On a single hive:</u> 1. Create drifters, and move them to good / better scouting locations 2. Rupture cysts to mess up marine vision 3. Drifter enzymes to speed destruction of marine structures 4. Echo whips and other structures 5. Hallucinations and phantasms (ok, this one's a bit of a lark because the AI needs so much work, but in <i>theory</i> this could be useful) 6. Activate healing wave from crags 7. Activate ink from shades (either to aid in forward combat, defense of hive or prevent marine scans)
<u>On multiple hives</u> 8. Bone wall in the middle of a fight or to delay marines 9. Drop advanced life form eggs
This is in addition to all the usual upgrade selection and development.
I think what's missing here is a bit of fine tuning of the current structures and dynamics. In previous builds it used to be carapace all the time as a mandatory first upgrade (or leap, when you could do it with one hive). Then UWE tweaked camo and now it's a viable second option. With the tweak to regen, it's a tough call between going cara first or regen first. If they buffed adrenaline and/or celerity, you would have serious consternation for the average khammander, as they would all be effective upgrades.
By contrast, what does the marine commander do?
<u>With one CC:</u> 1. Drop medpacks and ammo 2. Scan 3. Distress beacon 4. Organize ARC deployment 5. Move MACs (and use EMP blast if you don't know better) 6. Drop shotguns, grenade launchers, flamethrowers, mines and welders
<u>With two CCs:</u> 7. Nanoshield 8. Drop jetpacks and exos
Again, this is in addition to the usual placement of structures and organization of weapon, armor and tech upgrades.
<!--quoteo(post=2042022:date=Dec 8 2012, 11:10 AM:name=ninjabusdriver)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ninjabusdriver @ Dec 8 2012, 11:10 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2042022"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->When I'm alien khammander, I like to go shift first, and then jump out and gorge up the second hive (as opposed to just sitting waiting for it to be built, which seems like the alternative most games). I'm fine using my (mostly useless) pRes on a few (mostly useless) Hydra and hopefully freeing up some time for another player to push. If a cyst chain gets broken, I can usually get someone to jump in the hive and reconnect it.
That said, I do think there's a considerable disconnect between alien com and marine com, but I think the problem has more to do with the relative worthlessness of alien structures in comparison to marine structures.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's pretty much exactly what I do, only I'll usually build a clog wall in the 'main' hive around the space where I plan to put our upgrades along with three Hydra out of line of sight from possible ninja's.
The problem is partially weak structures in the sense that they don't really provide any secondary worth on their own. Crag is pretty well useless until Onos and simply does the job a gorge would normally do, a shift is only really useful for the infinite energy it gives a Gorge now that two egg's cost 5 T.Res (with a <i>global</i> cooldown no less, and the shift+gorge combo actually makes crag somewhat redundant), and the Shade was already not much more than a T.Res sink before they nerfed the range on it. Ink is gimmicky on top of that, and doesn't really do anything useful although I suppose like anything else it can be useful 1 out of 10 times. All this add's up to make shift the only structure worth building up until the end game unless your team doesn't have a gorge or two, which also means you're probably going to lose either way. (And if you do have a gorge, shift is all you really <i>need</i>, anything else is gravy but not required.)
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm seeing a lot of debate here about the simplistic tech paths and such, but I'm not seeing a lot of suggestions about how to make it better.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Suggestions have largely been ignored by the developers, and there is an entire forum devoted to specific idea's on how to improve or change the game play. I don't know what will fix NS2, I'm merely dissatisfied with the current build. My only real suggestion is to revert the shift changes but honestly I'm not sure I really want that since micromanaging egg's was never really 'fun' it was just a tactic that had a direct effect that required a marines response. There isn't much an alien commander can do to force a marine response anymore, at all, whereas there are several things the Marine commander can do <i>by himself</i> that requires a response from the Aliens.
Maybe that's a problem, but it isn't the only one. The 'feel' of Aliens is just...lack luster after you do it a dozen or so times. You start to realize that you do the exact same thing every map, and it either works with the team you've got or it doesn't. Really it's out of your control if you win or lose no matter what. I'm sure some folks will suggest that 'changing it up' would fix this, but there's only really one path to take as Alien commander. Doing gimmicky tactics like shade first only really works versus n00b teams and is only really useful as a troll dominance tactic. Any 'alternate' build order outside of Shade is the exact same build order, for all intents and purposes, given that a second hive is mandatory to even stay relevant early mid-game. If you don't have a second hive within 3-5 minutes you're probably going to lose, so the only real difference in your build order is in the first few minutes of the game. The only <i>functional</i> difference is whether you have a slight speed boost or a slight armor boost at the get-go, and the armor boost is so tiny it doesn't really help while the speed boost helps tremendously before significant weapon and armor upgrades. No brainer? You betcha.
Hey we used to be able to spam eggs at shifts but they sure took care of that, didn't they. Crags are only useful to slowass oni and shades, well, I've tried many times to get "shade networks" going but it's completely pointless when infestation instantly gives away the cloak.
Generally, and sorry to burst some people's nuts here, commanding isn't just "Oh lets get this and that and this and try to win". It's coordinating your team into preforming strategical attacks.
Both marines and aliens alike are good at mostly everything.
People need to stop comparing alien mechanics, upgrades and tactics to marine mechanics, upgrades and tactics. Getting that early game advantage may set the tone of the game, but surely doesn't define it.
You can try list every single possible thing both races can do, but comparing it is just obligatory and senseless. All i'm saying is, If you need help, something not working out for you correctly, then ask.
As for on topic: The commander is there to compliment the team, not the other way around. As a commander you need to individually guide your team, set up places where you think you can bottle neck them, Always scout, oh you have no idea how important scouting is till you get to later game. I can guarantee you 85% of the losses you've probably had in pub games come from lack of scouting.
just before anyone's silly enough to post on this saying that spreading infestation is scouting, No it's not, Not for a good marine team it isn't.
<!--quoteo(post=2042154:date=Dec 8 2012, 04:06 PM:name=PHJF)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PHJF @ Dec 8 2012, 04:06 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2042154"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Hey we used to be able to spam eggs at shifts but they sure took care of that, didn't they. Crags are only useful to slowass oni and shades, well, I've tried many times to get "shade networks" going but it's completely pointless when infestation instantly gives away the cloak.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I know, that's what I was referencing. It's been rapid-fire nerf's to the aliens team since release. I still think the Aliens were at a good place after removing the early onos issue, and Marines buff's that bring down the high base skill level for Marine commanding would have been a viable alternative. Playing as Aliens you might as well be playing Quake with all the 'complexity' it brings to the table. Is it really any wonder that the complicated nuanced team loses all the time to a team that doesn't need to worry about anything other than a high K/D/R ratio? (Hyperbole, as the 'score' column probably reflects a better winning team. Not much though, as individual aliens only need to worry about killing things. Marines have a lot more to worry about, thusly they lose far more often until you get into the realm of 45-50 minute games or a serious imbalance in team skill.)
<!--quoteo(post=2041741:date=Dec 7 2012, 11:04 PM:name=MaximumSquid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MaximumSquid @ Dec 7 2012, 11:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2041741"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You don't mention drifters, bonewall, or any of the support structures or their abilities anywhere in your post
You claim that aliens need work? I don't think you've demonstrated that you know how to play them yet. . .
-<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because none of those things are necassery to win.
Drifter enzyme is a good way to help take a phase gate out before the marines notice/have time to react. But pretty much every support ability is "just there" and rarely ever necassery to win. Unlike for marines who always need ammo, health and scans.
Marines have several strategies open to them like rushing armour/weapon upgrades, weapon loadouts, sentries, phase tech, jetpacks, but aliens don't. This is partly because the alien comm can just expand anywhere he wants when the marines are distracted, whilst the marine commander actually has to command to get crap done.
If gorges were necassery to get harvesters up there'd be a lot more to alien tactics as aliens would have to protect the gorge and the commander would have to tell the gorge where to go based on map control.
As it is the alien comm leisurely places his structures in his own time while skulks rusht he marine base. There's zero strategy.
<!--quoteo(post=2042169:date=Dec 8 2012, 04:25 PM:name=grazr)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (grazr @ Dec 8 2012, 04:25 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2042169"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Because none of those things are necassery to win.
Drifter enzyme is a good way to help take a phase gate out before the marines notice/have time to react. But pretty much every support ability is "just there" and rarely ever necassery to win. Unlike for marines who always need ammo, health and scans.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Should have read a bit further down. Drifters are one of the few good things left. They aren't necessary as such but they are immensely helpful no matter what. I definitely agree with Maximum on that at least. Drifters are a tool with many uses, that makes them valuable.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Marines have several strategies open to them like rushing armour/weapon upgrades, weapon loadouts, sentries, phase tech, jetpacks, but aliens don't. This is partly because the alien comm can just expand anywhere he wants when the marines are distracted, whilst the marine commander actually has to command to get crap done.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Marines do have much more in the way of options, but as to those options individual viability I couldn't say with absolute certainty. It's definitely not as cut-and-dried as aliens that much is for certain.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If gorges were necassery to get harvesters up there'd be a lot more to alien tactics as aliens would have to protect the gorge and the commander would have to tell the gorge where to go based on map control.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
They might not be necessary but they are, again, massively helpful. Any 'good' team of aliens should be doing this anyway. I actually like the commander/gorge dynamic, it's just that it isn't quite worth it just for harvesters. It's the 'most' helpful when speed building your second or third hive. Good gorge/commander team-work is one of the only things that makes Whips useful as well outside of massively specific circumstances and troll strategies. NOw that I think about it, in a way the Aliens are short at least two players. Commander and forward gorge. I'd say the gorge is the commanders 'sword', so to speak.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As it is the alien comm leisurely places his structures in his own time while skulks rusht he marine base. There's zero strategy.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You can micromanage, except all the things you can micromanage don't matter much towards eventual victory.
Comments
The only difference is the marines depend more on the commander for support and the commander has more powerful/omnipresent active support abilities allowing the marine commander to stay busier.
I think the addition of some sort of omnipresent alien support ability such as +25% movement speed buff to target player would make the kham position much more active and fun. Sure there is drifter enzyme, but its alot harder to pull off, has a higher res risk ratio and to be honest, attack speed is rarely helpful against marines unless you have godlike aim and movement skills.
A good kham stays busy by hopping out of the hive and supporting as a gorge or maybe even as a skulk. The problem is not as large as you make it out to be.
The issue would be that the mechanics of what and why the cyst behavior is changing would be hard to communicate to players, and therefore seem pretty mysterious without a LOT of game experience. A game can get away with a few highly dense systems like this, but NS already has several, and many of them interact, I think your idea would push it past the point of "reasonably comprehensible".
This would not work, if you want to inflate T.Res expenditure while adding nothing but a painful gimmick you do exactly what you suggested. UWE went with a similar 'inflate alien costs' route with their nerfs to all the structures to require more and more of them. Since their price-to-effectiveness ratio is already so low as to make them useless outside of their default area buff, dropping another life form egg becomes a better investment in almost any situation involving any alien structures outside of a few rare exceptions. (Quick shift to try and repel Exo's with Gorges, for instance.)
I don't know, the gardening part of alien command was fun when it felt like you contributed something other than being a dedicated upgrade button pusher than even a retarded AI could have handled.
I guess maybe the commander really should get out of the hive. I mean, even if a total noob gets into the hive is there really any damage they could do past not choosing the upgrades mid-game? Either every button on the alien interface is a win button or a lose button in the current build it would seem. When in doubt, push buttons and there's no chance your team will fail! (Unless they're terrible, I suppose.)
-> More multitasking required. More "skill".
-> More strategy. Right now, you only kill cysts if you want to build somewhere. This could make cyst line harass a valid strategy.
That said, I do think there's a considerable disconnect between alien com and marine com, but I think the problem has more to do with the relative worthlessness of alien structures in comparison to marine structures.
<u>On a single hive:</u>
1. Create drifters, and move them to good / better scouting locations
2. Rupture cysts to mess up marine vision
3. Drifter enzymes to speed destruction of marine structures
4. Echo whips and other structures
5. Hallucinations and phantasms (ok, this one's a bit of a lark because the AI needs so much work, but in <i>theory</i> this could be useful)
6. Activate healing wave from crags
7. Activate ink from shades (either to aid in forward combat, defense of hive or prevent marine scans)
<u>On multiple hives</u>
8. Bone wall in the middle of a fight or to delay marines
9. Drop advanced life form eggs
This is in addition to all the usual upgrade selection and development.
I think what's missing here is a bit of fine tuning of the current structures and dynamics. In previous builds it used to be carapace all the time as a mandatory first upgrade (or leap, when you could do it with one hive). Then UWE tweaked camo and now it's a viable second option. With the tweak to regen, it's a tough call between going cara first or regen first. If they buffed adrenaline and/or celerity, you would have serious consternation for the average khammander, as they would all be effective upgrades.
By contrast, what does the marine commander do?
<u>With one CC:</u>
1. Drop medpacks and ammo
2. Scan
3. Distress beacon
4. Organize ARC deployment
5. Move MACs (and use EMP blast if you don't know better)
6. Drop shotguns, grenade launchers, flamethrowers, mines and welders
<u>With two CCs:</u>
7. Nanoshield
8. Drop jetpacks and exos
Again, this is in addition to the usual placement of structures and organization of weapon, armor and tech upgrades.
That said, I do think there's a considerable disconnect between alien com and marine com, but I think the problem has more to do with the relative worthlessness of alien structures in comparison to marine structures.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's pretty much exactly what I do, only I'll usually build a clog wall in the 'main' hive around the space where I plan to put our upgrades along with three Hydra out of line of sight from possible ninja's.
The problem is partially weak structures in the sense that they don't really provide any secondary worth on their own. Crag is pretty well useless until Onos and simply does the job a gorge would normally do, a shift is only really useful for the infinite energy it gives a Gorge now that two egg's cost 5 T.Res (with a <i>global</i> cooldown no less, and the shift+gorge combo actually makes crag somewhat redundant), and the Shade was already not much more than a T.Res sink before they nerfed the range on it. Ink is gimmicky on top of that, and doesn't really do anything useful although I suppose like anything else it can be useful 1 out of 10 times. All this add's up to make shift the only structure worth building up until the end game unless your team doesn't have a gorge or two, which also means you're probably going to lose either way. (And if you do have a gorge, shift is all you really <i>need</i>, anything else is gravy but not required.)
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm seeing a lot of debate here about the simplistic tech paths and such, but I'm not seeing a lot of suggestions about how to make it better.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Suggestions have largely been ignored by the developers, and there is an entire forum devoted to specific idea's on how to improve or change the game play. I don't know what will fix NS2, I'm merely dissatisfied with the current build. My only real suggestion is to revert the shift changes but honestly I'm not sure I really want that since micromanaging egg's was never really 'fun' it was just a tactic that had a direct effect that required a marines response. There isn't much an alien commander can do to force a marine response anymore, at all, whereas there are several things the Marine commander can do <i>by himself</i> that requires a response from the Aliens.
Maybe that's a problem, but it isn't the only one. The 'feel' of Aliens is just...lack luster after you do it a dozen or so times. You start to realize that you do the exact same thing every map, and it either works with the team you've got or it doesn't. Really it's out of your control if you win or lose no matter what. I'm sure some folks will suggest that 'changing it up' would fix this, but there's only really one path to take as Alien commander. Doing gimmicky tactics like shade first only really works versus n00b teams and is only really useful as a troll dominance tactic. Any 'alternate' build order outside of Shade is the exact same build order, for all intents and purposes, given that a second hive is mandatory to even stay relevant early mid-game. If you don't have a second hive within 3-5 minutes you're probably going to lose, so the only real difference in your build order is in the first few minutes of the game. The only <i>functional</i> difference is whether you have a slight speed boost or a slight armor boost at the get-go, and the armor boost is so tiny it doesn't really help while the speed boost helps tremendously before significant weapon and armor upgrades. No brainer? You betcha.
It's coordinating your team into preforming strategical attacks.
Both marines and aliens alike are good at mostly everything.
People need to stop comparing alien mechanics, upgrades and tactics to marine mechanics, upgrades and tactics.
Getting that early game advantage may set the tone of the game, but surely doesn't define it.
You can try list every single possible thing both races can do, but comparing it is just obligatory and senseless.
All i'm saying is, If you need help, something not working out for you correctly, then ask.
As for on topic:
The commander is there to compliment the team, not the other way around. As a commander you need to individually guide your team, set up places where you think you can bottle neck them, Always scout, oh you have no idea how important scouting is till you get to later game.
I can guarantee you 85% of the losses you've probably had in pub games come from lack of scouting.
just before anyone's silly enough to post on this saying that spreading infestation is scouting, No it's not, Not for a good marine team it isn't.
I know, that's what I was referencing. It's been rapid-fire nerf's to the aliens team since release. I still think the Aliens were at a good place after removing the early onos issue, and Marines buff's that bring down the high base skill level for Marine commanding would have been a viable alternative. Playing as Aliens you might as well be playing Quake with all the 'complexity' it brings to the table. Is it really any wonder that the complicated nuanced team loses all the time to a team that doesn't need to worry about anything other than a high K/D/R ratio? (Hyperbole, as the 'score' column probably reflects a better winning team. Not much though, as individual aliens only need to worry about killing things. Marines have a lot more to worry about, thusly they lose far more often until you get into the realm of 45-50 minute games or a serious imbalance in team skill.)
You claim that aliens need work?
I don't think you've demonstrated that you know how to play them yet. . .
-<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because none of those things are necassery to win.
Drifter enzyme is a good way to help take a phase gate out before the marines notice/have time to react. But pretty much every support ability is "just there" and rarely ever necassery to win. Unlike for marines who always need ammo, health and scans.
Marines have several strategies open to them like rushing armour/weapon upgrades, weapon loadouts, sentries, phase tech, jetpacks, but aliens don't. This is partly because the alien comm can just expand anywhere he wants when the marines are distracted, whilst the marine commander actually has to command to get crap done.
If gorges were necassery to get harvesters up there'd be a lot more to alien tactics as aliens would have to protect the gorge and the commander would have to tell the gorge where to go based on map control.
As it is the alien comm leisurely places his structures in his own time while skulks rusht he marine base. There's zero strategy.
Drifter enzyme is a good way to help take a phase gate out before the marines notice/have time to react. But pretty much every support ability is "just there" and rarely ever necassery to win. Unlike for marines who always need ammo, health and scans.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Should have read a bit further down. Drifters are one of the few good things left. They aren't necessary as such but they are immensely helpful no matter what. I definitely agree with Maximum on that at least. Drifters are a tool with many uses, that makes them valuable.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Marines have several strategies open to them like rushing armour/weapon upgrades, weapon loadouts, sentries, phase tech, jetpacks, but aliens don't. This is partly because the alien comm can just expand anywhere he wants when the marines are distracted, whilst the marine commander actually has to command to get crap done.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Marines do have much more in the way of options, but as to those options individual viability I couldn't say with absolute certainty. It's definitely not as cut-and-dried as aliens that much is for certain.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If gorges were necassery to get harvesters up there'd be a lot more to alien tactics as aliens would have to protect the gorge and the commander would have to tell the gorge where to go based on map control.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
They might not be necessary but they are, again, massively helpful. Any 'good' team of aliens should be doing this anyway. I actually like the commander/gorge dynamic, it's just that it isn't quite worth it just for harvesters. It's the 'most' helpful when speed building your second or third hive. Good gorge/commander team-work is one of the only things that makes Whips useful as well outside of massively specific circumstances and troll strategies. NOw that I think about it, in a way the Aliens are short at least two players. Commander and forward gorge. I'd say the gorge is the commanders 'sword', so to speak.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As it is the alien comm leisurely places his structures in his own time while skulks rusht he marine base. There's zero strategy.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You can micromanage, except all the things you can micromanage don't matter much towards eventual victory.