<!--quoteo(post=2046460:date=Dec 16 2012, 01:25 PM:name=Kallistrate)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kallistrate @ Dec 16 2012, 01:25 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2046460"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--coloro:#FFC0CB--><span style="color:#FFC0CB"><!--/coloro-->I don't know how you came to this ridiculous conclusion, but it is <b>not</b> intended. It has already been fixed for the next build. Please do not make up crap or spread misinformation.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I did NOT say it wasn't, I think it should go, intended or not, I simply said I found out it MAY not be, it PROBABLY is, and it SHOULD be removed regardless, please don't stick words in my mouth.
<!--quoteo(post=2046098:date=Dec 15 2012, 08:51 AM:name=Dwavenhobble)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dwavenhobble @ Dec 15 2012, 08:51 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2046098"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Arcs - its one thing that needs two bits done to it.
1) Fix its path finding as they sometimes derp out but more importantly 2) Fix it so the Arc must have a line of sight on the target itself because at present you can wheel them into a place considered the same room by the game and then fire through the walls at the target as long as you mark them / acquire line of sight by scanning or having someone stand in line.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
ARCs being able to shoot through walls is an intended feature of the game. It's supposed to be counterable by using Ink on Shades, but that feature still bugs out from time to time and ARCs just keep shooting. And Ink stays completely useless in any situation (even for normal cloaking) when an Observatory is in range, which does not seem all that intended.
<!--quoteo(post=2046098:date=Dec 14 2012, 11:51 PM:name=Dwavenhobble)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dwavenhobble @ Dec 14 2012, 11:51 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2046098"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->2) Fix it so the Arc must have a line of sight on the target itself because at present you can wheel them into a place considered the same room by the game and then fire through the walls at the target as long as you mark them / acquire line of sight by scanning or having someone stand in line.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=2046487:date=Dec 16 2012, 04:01 AM:name=CrushaK)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CrushaK @ Dec 16 2012, 04:01 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2046487"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->ARCs being able to shoot through walls is an intended feature of the game. It's supposed to be counterable by using Ink on Shades, but that feature still bugs out from time to time and ARCs just keep shooting. And Ink stays completely useless in any situation (even for normal cloaking) when an Observatory is in range, which does not seem all that intended.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> True but when you have the enemy with Arcs in Cafeteria and they're shooting a hive in locker rooms you have to say there's definitely an issue with it
That is a map design problem then, not a problem with the ARCs themselves.
But there is also a problem with the lack of a limit for the maximum amount of ARCs that the commander can build, IIRC. Marine commanders can build an entire train of like 8 ARCs and almost instantly tear an alien Hive down. And that train can't really be stopped in time except with Bile Bombs. I would like to see ARCs count into the "population limit" of MACs with 2 population costs per ARC on the field. You get 5 population points for each CC that the marines control, so having more chairs allows for bigger and more effective ARC armies.
<!--quoteo(post=2046528:date=Dec 16 2012, 12:37 AM:name=Dwavenhobble)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dwavenhobble @ Dec 16 2012, 12:37 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2046528"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->True but when you have the enemy with Arcs in Cafeteria and they're shooting a hive in locker rooms you have to say there's definitely an issue with it<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I really doubt that ARCs can shoot Locker Rooms from Cafeteria. I could be wrong though. If they can, it is a map design problem as previously stated - much like ARCs being able to shoot Deposit hive from Central Drilling in ns2_mineshaft. ARCs are supposed to shoot through walls by design, and mapping has to be done with this in mind.
<!--quoteo(post=2046564:date=Dec 16 2012, 07:50 AM:name=d0ped0g)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (d0ped0g @ Dec 16 2012, 07:50 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2046564"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I really doubt that ARCs can shoot Locker Rooms from Cafeteria. I could be wrong though. If they can, it is a map design problem as previously stated - much like ARCs being able to shoot Deposit hive from Central Drilling in ns2_mineshaft. ARCs are supposed to shoot through walls by design, and mapping has to be done with this in mind.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Well I just had proved to me in game you can set up arcs in Bar (this is actually Onos bar not back alley) and shoot locker rooms hives down and I did have a match with cafeteria being the Arc base.
<!--quoteo(post=2046606:date=Dec 16 2012, 05:35 AM:name=Dwavenhobble)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dwavenhobble @ Dec 16 2012, 05:35 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2046606"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Well I just had proved to me in game you can set up arcs in Bar (this is actually Onos bar not back alley) and shoot locker rooms hives down and I did have a match with cafeteria being the Arc base.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Yeah... that's expected.
That's how ARCs work, it's how they worked when they were sieges in NS1. That's the mechanic.
<!--quoteo(post=2046606:date=Dec 16 2012, 06:35 AM:name=Dwavenhobble)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dwavenhobble @ Dec 16 2012, 06:35 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2046606"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Well I just had proved to me in game you can set up arcs in Bar (this is actually Onos bar not back alley) and shoot locker rooms hives down and I did have a match with cafeteria being the Arc base.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You can't actually hit the hive from onos bar, the range is just short of it. But it will kill any structures on the bar side of the hive.
<!--quoteo(post=2046927:date=Dec 17 2012, 05:52 AM:name=Mavick)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mavick @ Dec 17 2012, 05:52 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2046927"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You can't actually hit the hive from onos bar, the range is just short of it. But it will kill any structures on the bar side of the hive.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> What? Since when? I'm pretty sure you've been able to happily blast away the hive from bar.
Hasn't worked ever that I know of. Even with arc's packed into the corner closest to the Locker Hive, the range is *just* short of hitting the hive itself. They might splash damage the hive (not sure on the mechanics of these exactly) if there's a crag or something on that side of it, but once the structures are down they won't hit the hive directly. I've seen at least 3 marine comms try that, but they ended up having to move the arcs up to actually hit the hive.
<!--quoteo(post=2046932:date=Dec 17 2012, 06:01 AM:name=Mavick)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mavick @ Dec 17 2012, 06:01 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2046932"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Hasn't worked ever that I know of. Even with arc's packed into the corner closest to the Locker Hive, the range is *just* short of hitting the hive itself. They might splash damage the hive (not sure on the mechanics of these exactly) if there's a crag or something on that side of it, but once the structures are down they won't hit the hive directly. I've seen at least 3 marine comms try that, but they ended up having to move the arcs up to actually hit the hive.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's funny, I've actually killed a hive from bar with arcs. But now that I think about it, there was a lot of other buildings to clear. Maybe it just died out of splash damage lol.
Speaking of ARCs, I wish they'd revert the firing speed change. Sure, for gameplay more shots / less damage is better, but man when the old arcs fired YOU KNEW they fired, BOOM BABY!
<!--quoteo(post=2046528:date=Dec 15 2012, 10:37 PM:name=Dwavenhobble)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dwavenhobble @ Dec 15 2012, 10:37 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2046528"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->True but when you have the enemy with Arcs in Cafeteria and they're shooting a hive in locker rooms you have to say there's definitely an issue with it<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Locker rooms can only be shot from the corner of bar and the corner of courtyard. It can't be shot from cafeteria.
Another "ridiculous sieging" map is the hive in deposit(or was it sorting?) which can be sieged from central drilling on mineshaft.
However, that is a MAP PROBLEM, not an ARC problem. Locker rooms is notoriously a horrible hive, and if marines can hold bar (which isn't hard) they can take it down easily.
<!--quoteo(post=2047089:date=Dec 17 2012, 05:53 AM:name=HeatSurge)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (HeatSurge @ Dec 17 2012, 05:53 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047089"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Locker rooms can only be shot from the corner of bar and the corner of courtyard. It can't be shot from cafeteria.
Another "ridiculous sieging" map is the hive in deposit(or was it sorting?) which can be sieged from central drilling on mineshaft.
However, that is a MAP PROBLEM, not an ARC problem. Locker rooms is notoriously a horrible hive, and if marines can hold bar (which isn't hard) they can take it down easily.
That should be fixed by changing the map.
ARCs are perfectly fine.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And again: False. Tho you can siege Deposit from Central. I actually don't have a problem with that tho because Central isn't the easiest room for marine to hold. Lerks can kill the power node there and be in an almost impossible to kill spot.
Implement a better system for Commander/Game Start.. it's really outdated and just kind've.. stupid.
Not to mention, several Commander UI features I've been crying about since Alpha :] Every RTS ever made has a better Commander UI with basic features such as shift queuing, hotkeys that actually snap to where they are on the map.. and correctly prioritized selection.
<!--quoteo(post=2047130:date=Dec 17 2012, 07:02 AM:name=lwf)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lwf @ Dec 17 2012, 07:02 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047130"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The cloak speed exploit is already fixed in this mod, though I have still not seen a single player abusing it myself! :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Issues that prevent people from playing at all. Namely black screens/crashes/<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=125888" target="_blank">very low FPS, something with sound</a>
Vote and suggest here: <a href="http://www.google.com/moderator/#15/e=2055e8&t=2055e8.40" target="_blank">http://www.google.com/moderator/#15/e=2055e8&t=2055e8.40</a>
Comments
I did NOT say it wasn't, I think it should go, intended or not, I simply said I found out it MAY not be, it PROBABLY is, and it SHOULD be removed regardless, please don't stick words in my mouth.
1) Fix its path finding as they sometimes derp out
but more importantly
2) Fix it so the Arc must have a line of sight on the target itself because at present you can wheel them into a place considered the same room by the game and then fire through the walls at the target as long as you mark them / acquire line of sight by scanning or having someone stand in line.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
ARCs being able to shoot through walls is an intended feature of the game.
It's supposed to be counterable by using Ink on Shades, but that feature still bugs out from time to time and ARCs just keep shooting. And Ink stays completely useless in any situation (even for normal cloaking) when an Observatory is in range, which does not seem all that intended.
That can't be serious.
It's supposed to be counterable by using Ink on Shades, but that feature still bugs out from time to time and ARCs just keep shooting. And Ink stays completely useless in any situation (even for normal cloaking) when an Observatory is in range, which does not seem all that intended.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
True but when you have the enemy with Arcs in Cafeteria and they're shooting a hive in locker rooms you have to say there's definitely an issue with it
But there is also a problem with the lack of a limit for the maximum amount of ARCs that the commander can build, IIRC.
Marine commanders can build an entire train of like 8 ARCs and almost instantly tear an alien Hive down. And that train can't really be stopped in time except with Bile Bombs.
I would like to see ARCs count into the "population limit" of MACs with 2 population costs per ARC on the field. You get 5 population points for each CC that the marines control, so having more chairs allows for bigger and more effective ARC armies.
I really doubt that ARCs can shoot Locker Rooms from Cafeteria. I could be wrong though. If they can, it is a map design problem as previously stated - much like ARCs being able to shoot Deposit hive from Central Drilling in ns2_mineshaft. ARCs are supposed to shoot through walls by design, and mapping has to be done with this in mind.
Well I just had proved to me in game you can set up arcs in Bar (this is actually Onos bar not back alley) and shoot locker rooms hives down and I did have a match with cafeteria being the Arc base.
Yeah... that's expected.
That's how ARCs work, it's how they worked when they were sieges in NS1. That's the mechanic.
You can't actually hit the hive from onos bar, the range is just short of it. But it will kill any structures on the bar side of the hive.
What? Since when? I'm pretty sure you've been able to happily blast away the hive from bar.
That's funny, I've actually killed a hive from bar with arcs. But now that I think about it, there was a lot of other buildings to clear. Maybe it just died out of splash damage lol.
Speaking of ARCs, I wish they'd revert the firing speed change. Sure, for gameplay more shots / less damage is better, but man when the old arcs fired YOU KNEW they fired, BOOM BABY!
Locker rooms can only be shot from the corner of bar and the corner of courtyard. It can't be shot from cafeteria.
Another "ridiculous sieging" map is the hive in deposit(or was it sorting?) which can be sieged from central drilling on mineshaft.
However, that is a MAP PROBLEM, not an ARC problem. Locker rooms is notoriously a horrible hive, and if marines can hold bar (which isn't hard) they can take it down easily.
That should be fixed by changing the map.
ARCs are perfectly fine.
Another "ridiculous sieging" map is the hive in deposit(or was it sorting?) which can be sieged from central drilling on mineshaft.
However, that is a MAP PROBLEM, not an ARC problem. Locker rooms is notoriously a horrible hive, and if marines can hold bar (which isn't hard) they can take it down easily.
That should be fixed by changing the map.
ARCs are perfectly fine.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And again: False. Tho you can siege Deposit from Central. I actually don't have a problem with that tho because Central isn't the easiest room for marine to hold. Lerks can kill the power node there and be in an almost impossible to kill spot.
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=125969" target="_blank">Better NS2</a>
Not to mention, several Commander UI features I've been crying about since Alpha :]
Every RTS ever made has a better Commander UI with basic features such as shift queuing, hotkeys that actually snap to where they are on the map.. and correctly prioritized selection.
That's because they're cloaked.
Namely black screens/crashes/<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=125888" target="_blank">very low FPS, something with sound</a>
Vote and suggest here: <a href="http://www.google.com/moderator/#15/e=2055e8&t=2055e8.40" target="_blank">http://www.google.com/moderator/#15/e=2055e8&t=2055e8.40</a>