<!--quoteo(post=2052934:date=Dec 29 2012, 01:29 PM:name=Davil)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Davil @ Dec 29 2012, 01:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2052934"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Wow... Just stop with the advice please it's all terrible.
2) You don't need a fancy keyboard, I've played with $10 keyboards compared to my $200 G19, not much difference.
3) No don't buy a after market fan for your CPU, it's a waste of money. You will get probably about 5c less compared to the stock cooler but that's negated by the fact that the huge fan and heatsink will be blocking 90% of the airflow in your case. Stick with the stock fan, or spend $15 more and get a cheap liquid cooler that will keep your CPU under 30c.
5) Buy an SSD for your system files and drivers, about 120gb will do then get a nice big 1 or 2 tb drive, 2 if you want. The difference in loading times for games is about 1 second. Any fool who says otherwise just needs to go do some research or test it for themselves.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--coloro:orange--><span style="color:orange"><!--/coloro-->I think mechanical keyboards are great.
You can't overclock on a stock HSF.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
I've got a OCZ Vertex 3 SSD and it no longer precaches for me, just goes straight to connecting to server and then connects. Be sure to turn AHCI mode on.
You don't need a good GPU for NS2, my GTX460 is almost twice more power than you need.
You can get a good CPU, but that won't stop net lag. You'll just have to wait until the game is optimized enough for servers to actually be able to run it. I get like 100fps outside of fights now and the lag is so noticeable it's unbearable. Just hope for optimization and a Linux server capability. All we can do is pray.
<!--quoteo(post=2052977:date=Dec 29 2012, 02:32 PM:name=gnoarch)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gnoarch @ Dec 29 2012, 02:32 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2052977"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->well... I tested it myself and loading times improved by ALOT. Can't imagine how your difference can be only 1sec. But then I dont think there are many people who have 10 sec loading time from a normal HDD...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm using Caviar blacks and load between 10-20 seconds depending on the map. Admittedly I'm running 3xRaid0....
imo: ssd for boot, raid for gaming. Best of both worlds. Low access time for boot, high throughput for textures
<!--quoteo(post=2053008:date=Dec 29 2012, 12:48 PM:name=SixtyWattMan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SixtyWattMan @ Dec 29 2012, 12:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053008"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->lol "Mr. I have no money" has never tried a mechanical keyboard. Perhaps you should stick to talking of things you know which appears to be nothing.
<!--coloro:orange--><span style="color:orange"><!--/coloro-->I think mechanical keyboards are great.
You can't overclock on a stock HSF.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It never stops, you just can't be wrong enough my god...
1. OMG individual channels for each key that takes more force to press down and makes more noise, woo gotta love that! It's a matter of preference clearly.
2. The stock fan will support up to 4ghz of overclocking on that processor, feel free to look that up to your hearts content. The only people that buy giant after market fans are misguided people who have money to burn. Again if he wants to overclock past 4ghz, spend $15 more on a liquid cooler that doesn't make noise and cools about 10x better.
Not sure what better drive response does for textures, I don't see a difference. I'm not sure about raid, seems expensive and you really only need one drive for storage. My Vertex 3 only cost me $100, and the 120GB of space is more than enough for boot + games. There is a tool called Steam Mover <a href="http://www.traynier.com/software/steammover" target="_blank">http://www.traynier.com/software/steammover</a> it lets you move games from one drive to another fast and with little effort, so you can essentially have all of your games on a SSD even though it can't hold them all. This seems a lot more efficient than HDDs in RAID for price to speed ratio. Of course you could be more interested in capacity, but capacity is cheap and easy to get (comparatively).
<!--quoteo(post=2053049:date=Dec 29 2012, 01:46 PM:name=NeoRussia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NeoRussia @ Dec 29 2012, 01:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053049"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Not sure what better drive response does for textures, I don't see a difference. I'm not sure about raid, seems expensive and you really only need one drive for storage. My Vertex 3 only cost me $100, and the 120GB of space is more than enough for boot + games. There is a tool called Steam Mover <a href="http://www.traynier.com/software/steammover" target="_blank">http://www.traynier.com/software/steammover</a> it lets you move games from one drive to another fast and with little effort, so you can essentially have all of your games on a SSD even though it can't hold them all. This seems a lot more efficient than HDDs in RAID for price to speed ratio. Of course you could be more interested in capacity, but capacity is cheap and easy to get.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It depends on your situation, since I have over 100 games on my steam list aside from all the other software I have it's easier for me to do 2, 2tb drives in raid 0. Basically just reads off 2 drives at the same time. Cost me $200 for those and the OCZ Agility 4 I bought recently was 200 and only has 250gb. I've tried running games off of an SSD and off my raid setup and it really isn't noticeable. Rarely if ever does anyone get into a map faster than I do.
<!--quoteo(post=2053049:date=Dec 29 2012, 05:46 PM:name=NeoRussia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NeoRussia @ Dec 29 2012, 05:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053049"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Not sure what better drive response does for textures, I don't see a difference. I'm not sure about raid, seems expensive and you really only need one drive for storage. My Vertex 3 only cost me $100, and the 120GB of space is more than enough for boot + games. There is a tool called Steam Mover <a href="http://www.traynier.com/software/steammover" target="_blank">http://www.traynier.com/software/steammover</a> it lets you move games from one drive to another fast and with little effort, so you can essentially have all of your games on a SSD even though it can't hold them all. This seems a lot more efficient than HDDs in RAID for price to speed ratio. Of course you could be more interested in capacity, but capacity is cheap and easy to get (comparatively).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <a href="http://schinagl.priv.at/nt/hardlinkshellext/hardlinkshellext.html" target="_blank">http://schinagl.priv.at/nt/hardlinkshellex...nkshellext.html</a>
I use that instead of Steam mover. Lets you make symbolic links, etc., by right clicking on stuff in Windows.
As for textures, you won't see a difference in those in FPS games. In MMOs like WoW, where it has to load 100+ different armor sets, an SSD will eliminate any kind of pop-in you get there.
It takes me about 45 seconds for precaching with a regular HDD. Take that time and compare to actual play time, and that means I am spending 2.5% time loading a game for a 30 minute match.
SSDs are great for doing OS related tasks- it speeds up a lot of things. But on a purely game-related basis, I'm personally not really concerned about that 2.5% downtime. If it is an issue, then by all means the extra money you spend will definitely reduce those loading times to a more bearable level.
'course over time my HDD will need defragmentation to keep it's current speed. That's always annoying.
<!--quoteo(post=2053048:date=Dec 29 2012, 05:45 PM:name=Davil)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Davil @ Dec 29 2012, 05:45 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053048"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It never stops, you just can't be wrong enough my god...
1. OMG individual channels for each key that takes more force to press down and makes more noise, woo gotta love that! It's a matter of preference clearly.
2. The stock fan will support up to 4ghz of overclocking on that processor, feel free to look that up to your hearts content. The only people that buy giant after market fans are misguided people who have money to burn. Again if he wants to overclock past 4ghz, spend $15 more on a liquid cooler that doesn't make noise and cools about 10x better.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
1. You only think it's a matter of preference because you have never used one.
2. OVERCLOCK TO 4GHZ? NO WAY. INCREDIBLE. Except that the stock processor Turbos to 3.8ghz. If you're going to overclock an Sandy/Ivy Bridge you're going to 4.5ghz+. There are also no $45 liquid cooling kits, and if there are they are garbage. The cheapest liquid cooling kits probably won't even cool better than the 212+. The pumps also make noise and can wear out/leak. Good air cooling > cheap water cooling any day of the week.
<!--quoteo(post=2052809:date=Dec 29 2012, 04:55 AM:name=SixtyWattMan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SixtyWattMan @ Dec 29 2012, 04:55 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2052809"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->1) <!--coloro:#FF8C00--><span style="color:#FF8C00"><!--/coloro--><!--coloro:#FFFFFF--><span style="color:#FFFFFF"><!--/coloro-->No.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> it's 2012. you don't need a DVD drive. OS installs are easily done from USB. Unless there is something very specific you need this for don't waste the money. <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> 2) Keyboard is either go big or go home. Spend $10 or $90+.<!--coloro:#FF8C00--><span style="color:#FF8C00"><!--/coloro--> Mechanicals are nice (see specs) but if you can't afford it I would say the next best runner up is an Apple Keyboard, best non mechanical I have ever used and they're only about $50. <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> 3) No. Get the 212+. <!--coloro:#FF8C00--><span style="color:#FF8C00"><!--/coloro-->No. Get a H100 or something similar. In the enthusiast market liquid is the only way to go here and because they can be had for so cheap ($120 for the H100) you should just pull the trigger. I'm running at 4.5Ghz and hit 55C max, idle at about 30C. On air even with a Artic cooler 7 I was hitting ~75C under load and idling around 45. This was back at 4.2GHz. Liquid CPU cooling will be a decision you don't regret. <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
4) No. <!--coloro:#FF8C00--><span style="color:#FF8C00"><!--/coloro-->GPU is nothing to mess with, get the best you can.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
5) No. Buy an SSD and HDD. Anyone who tells you SSDs don't make a difference don't have one. They don't increase FPS in most games but they dramatically speed up every task you do outside of the game.<!--coloro:#FF8C00--><span style="color:#FF8C00"><!--/coloro--> Agree SSD's are something that once you get used to you can't get get rid of. However for less you can get HDD's in RAID 0 with more storage and quick performance. Or get both. <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
6) Ugly cases rule. <!--coloro:#FF8C00--><span style="color:#FF8C00"><!--/coloro-->On a budget build who gives a ###### what case you have. <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=2053049:date=Dec 29 2012, 04:46 PM:name=NeoRussia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NeoRussia @ Dec 29 2012, 04:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053049"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Not sure what better drive response does for textures, I don't see a difference. I'm not sure about raid, seems expensive and you really only need one drive for storage. My Vertex 3 only cost me $100, and the 120GB of space is more than enough for boot + games. There is a tool called Steam Mover <a href="http://www.traynier.com/software/steammover" target="_blank">http://www.traynier.com/software/steammover</a> it lets you move games from one drive to another fast and with little effort, so you can essentially have all of your games on a SSD even though it can't hold them all. This seems a lot more efficient than HDDs in RAID for price to speed ratio. Of course you could be more interested in capacity, but capacity is cheap and easy to get (comparatively).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
A raid0 setup improves throughput at the cost of access time. You are probably thinking of the typical mirror raid for redundancy. For $100 I can have 2TB of space at SSD throughput. If I had to do it over again, I'd probably have a single 60/64gb ssd for boot, 2/3 1tb drives in raid0, and externals for storage purpose.
<!--quoteo(post=2053065:date=Dec 29 2012, 02:25 PM:name=SixtyWattMan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SixtyWattMan @ Dec 29 2012, 02:25 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053065"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->1) It's $20 and provide a lot of utility. It's worth it. Also retail Windows doesn't come on a USB.
2) He should spring for the Quickfire Rapid. It's the only Costar board on newegg.
3) The H100 is a complete waste of money and complete overkill for his build. If you can't hit 4.5+ on a 212+ then chalk it up to user error.
6) $1300 is not a "budget build"<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
-- A lot of utility for what. What are you doing at home that you actually need this drive. I have been without one for about 4 years now and have not missed it once. I don't know anyone around me that uses the one they have. You don't need it. If you know what you're doing it's easiest to get a legit clean ISO and use Microsoft's USB mounting tool to do the install.
-- The H100 is a good decision on any OC build. You can take your OC up to levels you could only dream of on Air. I'm just sitting at 4.5 because it's a conservative OC. Air coolers do more than make your CPU run hot because they vent hot air around your case raising the ambient temps. Since getting this H100 I've seen my average GPU temp drop 5C as well. Liquid is just a smart decision.
Liquid cooling seems to have gotten much cheaper and more reliable in the past few years. It came standard (no extra cost) on the configure-your-own PC I got from cyberpower 2 years ago and I like how quiet and cool it has kept my cpu. This time they have a one with a double-sized radiator that gets decent reviews (a CoolIT ECO II-240) on sale for only $20 more than the stock Intel cooler, so I'm planning to go with that for my new rig.
Here's the saved configuration I'm planning to buy in case anyone's interested: <a href="http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/saved/1EQWVW" target="_blank">http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/saved/1EQWVW</a>.
The extra temperature monitor/fan control is kind of an unnecessary luxury but I like knowing the temperature is not getting out of control since that was what killed systems I had in the past (back in the red-hot pentium 4 days, especially). It surprised me just how much the case fans affect temperature. If I turn off the case fan on the side blowing onto the motherboard, the CPU gets over 10 degrees F hotter.
Thanks again for all the replies and discussion. Realizing that NS2 can be CPU bound made me switch from an AMD platform to Intel for the sake of better CPU performance.
<!--quoteo(post=2052934:date=Dec 29 2012, 01:29 PM:name=Davil)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Davil @ Dec 29 2012, 01:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2052934"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->3) No don't buy a after market fan for your CPU, it's a waste of money. You will get probably about 5c less compared to the stock cooler but that's negated by the fact that the huge fan and heatsink will be blocking 90% of the airflow in your case. Stick with the stock fan, or spend $15 more and get a cheap liquid cooler that will keep your CPU under 30c.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I use a corsair H100i, massive difference over the retail fan that came with the CPU, I dropped 20C.
<!--quoteo(post=2052934:date=Dec 29 2012, 01:29 PM:name=Davil)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Davil @ Dec 29 2012, 01:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2052934"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->5) Buy an SSD for your system files and drivers, about 120gb will do then get a nice big 1 or 2 tb drive, 2 if you want. The difference in loading times for games is about 1 second. Any fool who says otherwise just needs to go do some research or test it for themselves.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I haven't checked NS2 (I haven't run any games off of an HDD for ages) but my older games saw a massive improvement in load times, to the tune of about a quarter of what they were in Crysis. I imagine NS2 being a newer game, there is probably an appreciable difference there as well, certainly higher than a second. Not only are the IOPs much faster, but the overall latency is much lower and the bandwidth is on the order of 5 fold.
If you have $200 to spend on a keyboard, a larger SSD wouldn't set you back that much further. I got a samsung 840 pro, literally the fastest consumer grade SSD you can get. The 256GB version will set you back about $230 if you get it on sale, $250 otherwise.
For a keyboard, personally I use a k800. I game on a movable hospital style table in front of a 48" monitor, so wireless is essential, and the k800 has the lowest delay and highest polling rate of any wireless keyboard, even beating out many of the more expensive wired keyboards. That and no observable ghosting.
<!--quoteo(post=2053058:date=Dec 29 2012, 06:02 PM:name=SixtyWattMan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SixtyWattMan @ Dec 29 2012, 06:02 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053058"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->1. You only think it's a matter of preference because you have never used one.
2. OVERCLOCK TO 4GHZ? NO WAY. INCREDIBLE. Except that the stock processor Turbos to 3.8ghz. If you're going to overclock an Sandy/Ivy Bridge you're going to 4.5ghz+. There are also no $45 liquid cooling kits, and if there are they are garbage. The cheapest liquid cooling kits probably won't even cool better than the 212+. The pumps also make noise and can wear out/leak. Good air cooling > cheap water cooling any day of the week.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Unless you did what I did and get a cheesy motherboard without realizing it. I didn't read up about MSI overclocks with the sandy bridge generation, (they used to be good) and I can only adjust VCC, and none of the other power options. I have to drive the vcc to 1.4 just to hit 4.4Ghz on my 2600k as a result, but that's all I'm willing to do. Heat isn't the issue in my case, rather the lifespan of the CPU really takes a nosedive past 1.4v.
<!--quoteo(post=2053058:date=Dec 29 2012, 02:02 PM:name=SixtyWattMan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SixtyWattMan @ Dec 29 2012, 02:02 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053058"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->1. You only think it's a matter of preference because you have never used one.
2. OVERCLOCK TO 4GHZ? NO WAY. INCREDIBLE. Except that the stock processor Turbos to 3.8ghz. If you're going to overclock an Sandy/Ivy Bridge you're going to 4.5ghz+. There are also no $45 liquid cooling kits, and if there are they are garbage. The cheapest liquid cooling kits probably won't even cool better than the 212+. The pumps also make noise and can wear out/leak. Good air cooling > cheap water cooling any day of the week.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wow I guess I just blew your mind, $39.99 for a closed circuit liquid cooler that most people say keeps their cpu at 26c. And again you're just so very wrong, they make 0 noise aside from the fan which really doesn't make that much noise to begin with. Sorry but I've had about 6 liquid coolers like this one and they don't wear out/leak/break or anything like you've said. The worst thing that happens is the fan can go bad but you just put on any matching fan size and you're good.
And no, I KNOW it's a matter of preference because I have. I much prefer my G19 over any mechanical keyboard simply because I prefer the way the membrane feels.
I love my H70. at stock clocks it barely goes up to 30c on max load. Overclocked to 4.2ghz without even raising VCore. I got it at boxing day for $19.99 with the mail-in rebate, much love to Tiger Direct .ca
<!--quoteo(post=2053170:date=Dec 29 2012, 07:18 PM:name=WhiteWeasel)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (WhiteWeasel @ Dec 29 2012, 07:18 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053170"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You want<a href="http://www.engadget.com/2007/05/12/puget-custom-computers-mineral-oil-cooled-pc/" target="_blank"> liquid cooling</a>?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> This is some ######ing witchcraft. I'm angry and pleased at the same time.
<!--quoteo(post=2053258:date=Dec 30 2012, 04:31 AM:name=NeoRussia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NeoRussia @ Dec 30 2012, 04:31 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2053258"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That is older than reddit memes. I wonder if he gave up on replacing parts because it would be almost impossible to upgrade this safely.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yea it is old and extremely hard to change but it is pretty cool.
here is my rig. i can ultra every game including crysis.
i7-3770k 12GB dominator 1600 RAM Nvidea gtx 680 (EVGA) Solid state drive 512 gb 1tb seagate 7200 RPM i should not have to upgrade for 4 years... then ill just buy another 680 for 200$
<!--quoteo(post=2052934:date=Dec 29 2012, 06:29 PM:name=Davil)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Davil @ Dec 29 2012, 06:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2052934"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->3) No don't buy a after market fan for your CPU, it's a waste of money. You will get probably about 5c less compared to the stock cooler<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yea I was exaggerating the difference is more like 15 degrees. But the bigger point was that all that hot air is just getting blown around inside the case so it's not really doing that much good compared to a liquid cooler of the same price.
I just recently bought a new case along with some other things, and part of what the case includes is a big grille on the top with holes for mounting 120mm or 140mm fans. I put the radiator on that and had the fans blowing inward rather than outward, and put some painters tape (so no gunk stays on) around the rims of the fans to make sure the air only comes through the radiator itself.
The idea is that the radiator gets cool air from the outside, rather than receive hot air from the inside, which you would get from outward blowing. The radiator is cool to the touch, and the CPU has yet to exceed 64C.
Buy a small SSD (128GB will do) and buy regular HDD as big as you like. Make the SSD your system drive, with OS on it and office and everything you use every day. Store big stuff (movies, pictures, music) on the other drive(s).
This way you have: an OS that boots in 8 seconds, instantly starting programs like Word or Chrome, and still all the space you need on the HDD's.
For games: The games you play everyday can still be stored on the SSD. This dramatically reduces loading times for new maps, helping you to be in the ready room early. Performance on FPS or something is not influenced indeed.
How do I do this? Download a steam-app mover. This way you can move your games to another drive, and only store those you play often on your SSD.
Comments
2) You don't need a fancy keyboard, I've played with $10 keyboards compared to my $200 G19, not much difference.
3) No don't buy a after market fan for your CPU, it's a waste of money. You will get probably about 5c less compared to the stock cooler but that's negated by the fact that the huge fan and heatsink will be blocking 90% of the airflow in your case. Stick with the stock fan, or spend $15 more and get a cheap liquid cooler that will keep your CPU under 30c.
5) Buy an SSD for your system files and drivers, about 120gb will do then get a nice big 1 or 2 tb drive, 2 if you want. The difference in loading times for games is about 1 second. Any fool who says otherwise just needs to go do some research or test it for themselves.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--coloro:orange--><span style="color:orange"><!--/coloro-->I think mechanical keyboards are great.
You can't overclock on a stock HSF.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
You don't need a good GPU for NS2, my GTX460 is almost twice more power than you need.
You can get a good CPU, but that won't stop net lag. You'll just have to wait until the game is optimized enough for servers to actually be able to run it. I get like 100fps outside of fights now and the lag is so noticeable it's unbearable. Just hope for optimization and a Linux server capability. All we can do is pray.
I'm using Caviar blacks and load between 10-20 seconds depending on the map. Admittedly I'm running 3xRaid0....
imo: ssd for boot, raid for gaming. Best of both worlds. Low access time for boot, high throughput for textures
imo: ssd for boot, raid for gaming. Best of both worlds. Low access time for boot, high throughput for textures<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This
<!--coloro:orange--><span style="color:orange"><!--/coloro-->I think mechanical keyboards are great.
You can't overclock on a stock HSF.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It never stops, you just can't be wrong enough my god...
1. OMG individual channels for each key that takes more force to press down and makes more noise, woo gotta love that! It's a matter of preference clearly.
2. The stock fan will support up to 4ghz of overclocking on that processor, feel free to look that up to your hearts content. The only people that buy giant after market fans are misguided people who have money to burn. Again if he wants to overclock past 4ghz, spend $15 more on a liquid cooler that doesn't make noise and cools about 10x better.
It depends on your situation, since I have over 100 games on my steam list aside from all the other software I have it's easier for me to do 2, 2tb drives in raid 0. Basically just reads off 2 drives at the same time. Cost me $200 for those and the OCZ Agility 4 I bought recently was 200 and only has 250gb. I've tried running games off of an SSD and off my raid setup and it really isn't noticeable. Rarely if ever does anyone get into a map faster than I do.
<a href="http://schinagl.priv.at/nt/hardlinkshellext/hardlinkshellext.html" target="_blank">http://schinagl.priv.at/nt/hardlinkshellex...nkshellext.html</a>
I use that instead of Steam mover. Lets you make symbolic links, etc., by right clicking on stuff in Windows.
As for textures, you won't see a difference in those in FPS games. In MMOs like WoW, where it has to load 100+ different armor sets, an SSD will eliminate any kind of pop-in you get there.
SSDs are great for doing OS related tasks- it speeds up a lot of things. But on a purely game-related basis, I'm personally not really concerned about that 2.5% downtime. If it is an issue, then by all means the extra money you spend will definitely reduce those loading times to a more bearable level.
'course over time my HDD will need defragmentation to keep it's current speed. That's always annoying.
1. OMG individual channels for each key that takes more force to press down and makes more noise, woo gotta love that! It's a matter of preference clearly.
2. The stock fan will support up to 4ghz of overclocking on that processor, feel free to look that up to your hearts content. The only people that buy giant after market fans are misguided people who have money to burn. Again if he wants to overclock past 4ghz, spend $15 more on a liquid cooler that doesn't make noise and cools about 10x better.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
1. You only think it's a matter of preference because you have never used one.
2. OVERCLOCK TO 4GHZ? NO WAY. INCREDIBLE. Except that the stock processor Turbos to 3.8ghz. If you're going to overclock an Sandy/Ivy Bridge you're going to 4.5ghz+. There are also no $45 liquid cooling kits, and if there are they are garbage. The cheapest liquid cooling kits probably won't even cool better than the 212+. The pumps also make noise and can wear out/leak. Good air cooling > cheap water cooling any day of the week.
<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
2) Keyboard is either go big or go home. Spend $10 or $90+.<!--coloro:#FF8C00--><span style="color:#FF8C00"><!--/coloro--> Mechanicals are nice (see specs) but if you can't afford it I would say the next best runner up is an Apple Keyboard, best non mechanical I have ever used and they're only about $50.
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3) No. Get the 212+. <!--coloro:#FF8C00--><span style="color:#FF8C00"><!--/coloro-->No. Get a H100 or something similar. In the enthusiast market liquid is the only way to go here and because they can be had for so cheap ($120 for the H100) you should just pull the trigger. I'm running at 4.5Ghz and hit 55C max, idle at about 30C. On air even with a Artic cooler 7 I was hitting ~75C under load and idling around 45. This was back at 4.2GHz. Liquid CPU cooling will be a decision you don't regret. <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
4) No. <!--coloro:#FF8C00--><span style="color:#FF8C00"><!--/coloro-->GPU is nothing to mess with, get the best you can.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
5) No. Buy an SSD and HDD. Anyone who tells you SSDs don't make a difference don't have one. They don't increase FPS in most games but they dramatically speed up every task you do outside of the game.<!--coloro:#FF8C00--><span style="color:#FF8C00"><!--/coloro--> Agree SSD's are something that once you get used to you can't get get rid of. However for less you can get HDD's in RAID 0 with more storage and quick performance. Or get both. <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
6) Ugly cases rule. <!--coloro:#FF8C00--><span style="color:#FF8C00"><!--/coloro-->On a budget build who gives a ###### what case you have. <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
A raid0 setup improves throughput at the cost of access time. You are probably thinking of the typical mirror raid for redundancy.
For $100 I can have 2TB of space at SSD throughput. If I had to do it over again, I'd probably have a single 60/64gb ssd for boot, 2/3 1tb drives in raid0, and externals for storage purpose.
1) It's $20 and provide a lot of utility. It's worth it. Also retail Windows doesn't come on a USB.
2) He should spring for the Quickfire Rapid. It's the only Costar board on newegg.
3) The H100 is a complete waste of money and complete overkill for his build. If you can't hit 4.5+ on a 212+ then chalk it up to user error.
6) $1300 is not a "budget build"
2) He should spring for the Quickfire Rapid. It's the only Costar board on newegg.
3) The H100 is a complete waste of money and complete overkill for his build. If you can't hit 4.5+ on a 212+ then chalk it up to user error.
6) $1300 is not a "budget build"<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
-- A lot of utility for what. What are you doing at home that you actually need this drive. I have been without one for about 4 years now and have not missed it once. I don't know anyone around me that uses the one they have. You don't need it. If you know what you're doing it's easiest to get a legit clean ISO and use Microsoft's USB mounting tool to do the install.
<a href="http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msstore/html/pbPage.Help_Win7_usbdvd_dwnTool" target="_blank">http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msstor..._usbdvd_dwnTool</a>
-- Sure
-- The H100 is a good decision on any OC build. You can take your OC up to levels you could only dream of on Air. I'm just sitting at 4.5 because it's a conservative OC. Air coolers do more than make your CPU run hot because they vent hot air around your case raising the ambient temps. Since getting this H100 I've seen my average GPU temp drop 5C as well. Liquid is just a smart decision.
-- I guess it depends who you're asking.
oh yea, pic: <a href="http://puu.sh/1GQhO" target="_blank">http://puu.sh/1GQhO</a>
Thermaltake Element T FTW.
Really cheap case, like $60 but has slots for 3 200mm+ fans. All you need in a case really.
Here's the saved configuration I'm planning to buy in case anyone's interested: <a href="http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/saved/1EQWVW" target="_blank">http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/saved/1EQWVW</a>.
The extra temperature monitor/fan control is kind of an unnecessary luxury but I like knowing the temperature is not getting out of control since that was what killed systems I had in the past (back in the red-hot pentium 4 days, especially). It surprised me just how much the case fans affect temperature. If I turn off the case fan on the side blowing onto the motherboard, the CPU gets over 10 degrees F hotter.
Thanks again for all the replies and discussion. Realizing that NS2 can be CPU bound made me switch from an AMD platform to Intel for the sake of better CPU performance.
I use a corsair H100i, massive difference over the retail fan that came with the CPU, I dropped 20C.
<!--quoteo(post=2052934:date=Dec 29 2012, 01:29 PM:name=Davil)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Davil @ Dec 29 2012, 01:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2052934"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->5) Buy an SSD for your system files and drivers, about 120gb will do then get a nice big 1 or 2 tb drive, 2 if you want. The difference in loading times for games is about 1 second. Any fool who says otherwise just needs to go do some research or test it for themselves.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I haven't checked NS2 (I haven't run any games off of an HDD for ages) but my older games saw a massive improvement in load times, to the tune of about a quarter of what they were in Crysis. I imagine NS2 being a newer game, there is probably an appreciable difference there as well, certainly higher than a second. Not only are the IOPs much faster, but the overall latency is much lower and the bandwidth is on the order of 5 fold.
If you have $200 to spend on a keyboard, a larger SSD wouldn't set you back that much further. I got a samsung 840 pro, literally the fastest consumer grade SSD you can get. The 256GB version will set you back about $230 if you get it on sale, $250 otherwise.
For a keyboard, personally I use a k800. I game on a movable hospital style table in front of a 48" monitor, so wireless is essential, and the k800 has the lowest delay and highest polling rate of any wireless keyboard, even beating out many of the more expensive wired keyboards. That and no observable ghosting.
2. OVERCLOCK TO 4GHZ? NO WAY. INCREDIBLE. Except that the stock processor Turbos to 3.8ghz. If you're going to overclock an Sandy/Ivy Bridge you're going to 4.5ghz+. There are also no $45 liquid cooling kits, and if there are they are garbage. The cheapest liquid cooling kits probably won't even cool better than the 212+. The pumps also make noise and can wear out/leak. Good air cooling > cheap water cooling any day of the week.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Unless you did what I did and get a cheesy motherboard without realizing it. I didn't read up about MSI overclocks with the sandy bridge generation, (they used to be good) and I can only adjust VCC, and none of the other power options. I have to drive the vcc to 1.4 just to hit 4.4Ghz on my 2600k as a result, but that's all I'm willing to do. Heat isn't the issue in my case, rather the lifespan of the CPU really takes a nosedive past 1.4v.
2. OVERCLOCK TO 4GHZ? NO WAY. INCREDIBLE. Except that the stock processor Turbos to 3.8ghz. If you're going to overclock an Sandy/Ivy Bridge you're going to 4.5ghz+. There are also no $45 liquid cooling kits, and if there are they are garbage. The cheapest liquid cooling kits probably won't even cool better than the 212+. The pumps also make noise and can wear out/leak. Good air cooling > cheap water cooling any day of the week.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<a href="http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1241962&CatId=499" target="_blank">http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/Se...2&CatId=499</a>
Wow I guess I just blew your mind, $39.99 for a closed circuit liquid cooler that most people say keeps their cpu at 26c. And again you're just so very wrong, they make 0 noise aside from the fan which really doesn't make that much noise to begin with. Sorry but I've had about 6 liquid coolers like this one and they don't wear out/leak/break or anything like you've said. The worst thing that happens is the fan can go bad but you just put on any matching fan size and you're good.
And no, I KNOW it's a matter of preference because I have. I much prefer my G19 over any mechanical keyboard simply because I prefer the way the membrane feels.
This is some ######ing witchcraft. I'm angry and pleased at the same time.
That is older than reddit memes. I wonder if he gave up on replacing parts because it would be almost impossible to upgrade this safely.
Yea it is old and extremely hard to change but it is pretty cool.
i7-3770k
12GB dominator 1600 RAM
Nvidea gtx 680 (EVGA)
Solid state drive 512 gb
1tb seagate 7200 RPM
i should not have to upgrade for 4 years... then ill just buy another 680 for 200$
<img src="http://memecrunch.com/image/4f31c5801861336235004c58.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Yea I was exaggerating the difference is more like 15 degrees. But the bigger point was that all that hot air is just getting blown around inside the case so it's not really doing that much good compared to a liquid cooler of the same price.
The idea is that the radiator gets cool air from the outside, rather than receive hot air from the inside, which you would get from outward blowing. The radiator is cool to the touch, and the CPU has yet to exceed 64C.
Buy a small SSD (128GB will do) and buy regular HDD as big as you like.
Make the SSD your system drive, with OS on it and office and everything you use every day. Store big stuff (movies, pictures, music) on the other drive(s).
This way you have: an OS that boots in 8 seconds, instantly starting programs like Word or Chrome, and still all the space you need on the HDD's.
For games:
The games you play everyday can still be stored on the SSD. This dramatically reduces loading times for new maps, helping you to be in the ready room early. Performance on FPS or something is not influenced indeed.
How do I do this?
Download a steam-app mover. This way you can move your games to another drive, and only store those you play often on your SSD.