lack of servers using custom maps
Rellik_pt
Join Date: 2013-01-22 Member: 181205Members
Join Date: 2013-01-22 Member: 181205Members
why the servers not using more custom maps? me and my friend we are getting a bit sick of the same official maps every time we play, there is barely any server using custom maps...
the amount of european servers with custom maps is barely none and the ones that have custom maps just vanish form the server list in the next day or always full.
cant the devs open a couple of servers using some custom maps? there is already a couple of decent maps made by players and barely no love by the server owners.
the amount of european servers with custom maps is barely none and the ones that have custom maps just vanish form the server list in the next day or always full.
cant the devs open a couple of servers using some custom maps? there is already a couple of decent maps made by players and barely no love by the server owners.
Comments
In the forum nearly everyone say: Hey this looks great i want to test and play this.
But these people are not on the servers runnung custom stuff.
On the servers the most people complain about custom-stuff.
After 2 min on a custommap they KNOW that his map is alienfrinedly and a ###### map.
They still know this after an marinewin.
And there only a handfull finished custommaps out there.
Most maps are still in an greybox-state for example.
also just because they are grey dont mean they dont play well, most of the maps i saw already works fine, like jambi map for example. or even the new honourguard
For custom maps by people not paid to do this... really you just have to be patient and give it time. Check the mapping forum to see what is being worked on.
It's not so much that people are unwilling to run custom maps, it's that there only a handful of complete products out there that the creators are happy with and pushing forward.
Heck, I don't care at all whether the maps are unbalanced or whatsoever, but having a bit more variety would do some good for sure. I'm always glad when I come across a server who runs custom maps but sadly, it's mere luck to find one of those. Whether unfinished, unbalanced, aliens-friendly or whatever, I'd really love to see and play something else like 4 (<i>or 5?</i>) maps all over again. Please admins, give custom maps some love!
True, but after a few months I can deal better with an unbalanced map as long as it offers a new experience than playing the very same rotation again and again.
Itll happen. Thats one thing I get nostalgic about in old ns. I miss the craziness and sheer size of bast, it felt like you were on the nostromo from Alien.
The age old problem of "<i>don't wannah learn new maps, go play the default ones</i>", which has plagued the NS mapping community for so long and it will probably never change. Their best bet is to get in touch with the clans and have them help...
And there are some maps which fail even harder, by having campable teleports built into the map (the CO stargate map is really bad.)
Good maps are starting to take shape though and I've seen youtube videos of people who seemed to understand what they were doing and the way the shape of their map would impact gameplay, so I do expect some fantastic stuff to come out eventually.
I'm still looking forward to play some more NS1 maps in NS2 though.
This.
Not only is that argument silly, but a mapper is a player too - he/she might have certain proficiencies in the game, and so will overlook the parts that he/she is weak at performing (just for sake of an example, someone who is terrible at aiming, so long distances don't seem as big of a deal). You want the perspective of all the major skill aspects to affect the map, not just your own.
There's also the problem of boycotting maps that attempt something a bit different, and that saddens me greatly.
As for those who profess that their servers die if 3rd party maps are run on their server: it does not have to be a 24/7 deal. Pro Teams could so easily raise their profile in hosting events that can be publicized here, or through NS2HD or any of the team steam-groups. People without teams and no servers could seek those with servers, especially teams, and ask if they could host 3rd party map sessions with minor admin privileges on that server - team gets good publicity and don't have to do any work. Server admins can put the word out that they are willing to host such events. We could even get some kind of refereed list of server admins to message if a new build of a map has been released, and they can get the ball rolling. I am sure there are many more other things that can be done, that won't end up killing a server's popularity.
(Just as a note, I had a lot of success with the kingkahunagames community, I asked if they would be so kind as to test my map, and within 24 hours the map was being tested with a load of feedback being given, so if any other mappers see this and are trying to get their map played for feedback, I hope that helps.)
It's a simple case of shooting yourself in the foot, if the few 3rd party maps that are played are deemed bad, that one would boycott the rest. It's a simple case of shooting yourself in the foot, if you don't run a map and give it feedback, whether it's on your own or a populated server. NS2 has made mapping feedback a little easier with annotations, so even a quick phrase here or there is a lot of help, and it's incredibly helpful if you spend 30 minutes and give us some thought-out feedback on the forum or in person.
If you think a map is awful, tell us why, and better still, let us know how you would improve it, if you're so sure that it's as bad as you claim. The likelihood is that a mapper's been working on it for over a year before you even see it, and that is mentally taxing.
It is nice to see threads like this pop up once in a while though, as it's nice to know there are some that want to see 3rd party maps thrive. Just like the devs, 3rd party mappers put their work out there and really hope to get feedback (in a nice and constructive manner!), and the more there is of it, the sooner everyone gets out of the rut of "only bad 3rd party maps exist in a world where the same old maps are boring".
Honestly, we just want you to have fun on our maps at the end of the day.
I said, I had already played that (jokingly avoiding his ignorance), and then just joined up onto a team.. No use in furthering a discussion with someone who was clearly in a foul mood.
I still haven't played this map and it still needs feedback. <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=125749&hl=agora" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...49&hl=agora</a>
Yeah, sure maybe it's not balanced.... but I know if I created a map and it wasn't used - like Smaug said - that's got to be a little frustrating. I also started mapping but by the time I had the map half-finished, everyone started making much larger maps (mine was closer to the size of the early version of mineshaft). So I scrapped it. While it could be resurrected and potentially used as a co_ map, I just wouldn't want it to be finished and then never played.. I've already mapped for a server and then not had my map played, and to me I just wonder; Why <i>not</i> play it? Is it kainotophobia (fear of change) from these people? Autism? Meh.
I want to add that I'm not opposed to running custom maps on the Team156 servers (or else I wouldn't have included ns2_jambi in our server rotations). Wasabi and I even included a custom map in one of our Friday Night Show Matches (ns2_icarus at 1:31:00 <a href="http://twitch.tv/naturalselection2/b/342494804)" target="_blank">http://twitch.tv/naturalselection2/b/342494804)</a>, which had some technical problems that gave us a bit of a headache.
However, I'd rank custom maps second to stacking with regards to clearing out server population. At the end of the day, I'm a server hoster first and custom map support second so I need to limit the things that kill server population.
I dunno why you're defending yourself. Thank you, I guess, on behalf of the creators of jambi, I'm sure they're very happy, but that response has nothing to do with anything, really.
I assume, seeing as you've mentioned the Friday Night show Match thing, that after the technical problems that gave you a headache, you do not intend to do it again? Otherwise mentioning having an isolated issue with regards to casting a 3rd party map was a pointless mention. That kind of refers back to the whole things I said about boycotting 3rd party maps based on a bad experience, it's just not good.
I dunno what mentioning stacking has to do with anything either, other than presenting an example as to what clears servers. Yes, you are a host first, but if you would read the part where I mention that you can use third party maps to boost your server's popularity, aren't I just helping?
Maybe you felt you needed to defend yourself where I wasn't attacking, and I apologize for the "wall o' text", but do read it, I sometimes say something interesting once in a while!
Let's be friends, Frothybevarage! :D
Not only is that argument silly, but a mapper is a player too - he/she might have certain proficiencies in the game, and so will overlook the parts that he/she is weak at performing (just for sake of an example, someone who is terrible at aiming, so long distances don't seem as big of a deal). You want the perspective of all the major skill aspects to affect the map, not just your own.
There's also the problem of boycotting maps that attempt something a bit different, and that saddens me greatly.
As for those who profess that their servers die if 3rd party maps are run on their server: it does not have to be a 24/7 deal. Pro Teams could so easily raise their profile in hosting events that can be publicized here, or through NS2HD or any of the team steam-groups. People without teams and no servers could seek those with servers, especially teams, and ask if they could host 3rd party map sessions with minor admin privileges on that server - team gets good publicity and don't have to do any work. Server admins can put the word out that they are willing to host such events. We could even get some kind of refereed list of server admins to message if a new build of a map has been released, and they can get the ball rolling. I am sure there are many more other things that can be done, that won't end up killing a server's popularity.
(Just as a note, I had a lot of success with the kingkahunagames community, I asked if they would be so kind as to test my map, and within 24 hours the map was being tested with a load of feedback being given, so if any other mappers see this and are trying to get their map played for feedback, I hope that helps.)
It's a simple case of shooting yourself in the foot, if the few 3rd party maps that are played are deemed bad, that one would boycott the rest. It's a simple case of shooting yourself in the foot, if you don't run a map and give it feedback, whether it's on your own or a populated server. NS2 has made mapping feedback a little easier with annotations, so even a quick phrase here or there is a lot of help, and it's incredibly helpful if you spend 30 minutes and give us some thought-out feedback on the forum or in person.
If you think a map is awful, tell us why, and better still, let us know how you would improve it, if you're so sure that it's as bad as you claim. The likelihood is that a mapper's been working on it for over a year before you even see it, and that is mentally taxing.
It is nice to see threads like this pop up once in a while though, as it's nice to know there are some that want to see 3rd party maps thrive. Just like the devs, 3rd party mappers put their work out there and really hope to get feedback (in a nice and constructive manner!), and the more there is of it, the sooner everyone gets out of the rut of "only bad 3rd party maps exist in a world where the same old maps are boring".
Honestly, we just want you to have fun on our maps at the end of the day.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Of course maps are balance by the mapper's understanding of balance. Do you think testing <i>isn't</i> part of that understanding?
We're not talking about custom maps being ready for testing though. Out of all the custom maps I've tried only one CO map was remotely at playtesting state (and given how little I've played CO so far, I'm not really sure which maps <i>are</i> official.)
The rest failed to comprehend basic map fundamentals. Major imbalances in cover, and the distances between nodes and tech points. Perhaps it's a simple matter of making the <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/wiki/index.php/Basic_Mapping_Guidelines" target="_blank">NS2 mapping guide</a> as helpful as the <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns/static/Mapping_Guidelines.html#Layout" target="_blank">NS1 mapping guide</a>, which helpfully points out things like the time it takes to travel between hive locations (and time between tech points and resource nodes is the most major failing of map makers, with the size of corridors and amount of cover being the other big one.)
As for feedback, it's not exactly convenient to provide it to map makers when a server you're on randomly switches to a custom map. I'd probably provide some if it was (I've provided feedback through my entire career in the games industry, and just sort of reflexively provide it for the games I play for fun too.)
NS1 didn't have (many?) custom maps the first 1,5 year if I remember correctly (or I just didn't notice them)
and even if there is barely any maps "balanced" jambi is already well done and barely any server uses...
Aliendomination NEVER happen on an balanced map like summit for sure.
btw.
Wasnt summit an community map in the beginning too?
hmm
Wasnt summit an community map in the beginning too?
hmm<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It was, but its gone through a huge number of revisions since then (I still remember heliport and before maintenance access existed). Turtle is probably the only custom map that is the closest in number of revisions to adjust balance/gameplay to the official maps.