Let's fix the power node 'warning' once and for all...
Savant
Join Date: 2002-11-30 Member: 10289Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
Join Date: 2002-11-30 Member: 10289Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
If we have to have these alien "I win" buttons in the game, can we not have a better means to warn marines about power node attacks?
At present we have the nice girl who may (or may not) tell us that "Our base is under attack." There are many problems with this warning. First, it goes off ALL the time. Literally all the time since the aliens spend all game attacking marine structures. So problem one is that marines have no way to know if it was a skulk shooting a parasite at a remote extractor, or a gorge and an Onos hammering at the main base power node. Secondly, the warning gets drowned out when in combat, and again, combat tends to happen all the time. Thirdly, there are no specific visual warnings.
So, with these issues in mind, how can we address this problem using current game elements? My thought is this...
The klaxon. (It's the sound you hear when the distress beacon goes off) Have the klaxon sound three times (like the beacon) and display an on-screen message (like the beacon) that warns nearby marines of the power node attack. (The commander would only need to hear the warning, since he would know that he didn't trigger a distress beacon.)
Honestly, it is perfect thing to be using to warn marines about power node attacks. Frankly, I don't see why it is used for the distress beacon, since marines really don't need to hear it. (they're getting teleported whether they like it or not) Leave it on the distress beacon if you must, but let's use it for power node attacks.
Pre-requsite:
For power node alarm to be active at a tech point, the marines must have a command chair OR an observatory built there. Phase gate, armory or extractor is not enough.
For each X% of its health that the power node loses, the klaxon goes off. This assures that the alarm won't be going off with a few spikes. We can find a number that works well. What about first alarm at 80%, then next at 65%, followed by another at 50%. When the power node reaches 35% (the point when the alarm on the node and the light turn on) then the klaxon will sound continually. (up to a maximum of say 10-30 seconds so it's not annoying) This alarm cannot be circumvented by any means. It will always sound if the per-requisites are met. Since this is an existing sound, no fancy re-recording of a voice alert needs to be done.
As for where the alarm sounds, this I'm flexible on. The commander should hear it no matter what, and it should also always play at the tech point where the power is being attacked. As for individual marines hearing it when they are NOT at the tech point... It's a tough call since a marine may not be able to do anything about the alarm if they are too far away and/or not near a phase gate. Perhaps expand the tech point warning so it stretches to roughly where the first extractor outside the point would be. That way it's within sprint distance. It probably is not worthwhile to have the alarm trigger for all marines since it will impede communication. It's enough that others will hear it (or the commander at a minimum) and they can inform others.
Now when the power node is attacked, marines WILL KNOW about it. No excuses. No missed warnings or warnings that can't be heard over all the gunfire and voice communication. There will be no excuse not to hear this warning.
Let's fix this once and for all.
At present we have the nice girl who may (or may not) tell us that "Our base is under attack." There are many problems with this warning. First, it goes off ALL the time. Literally all the time since the aliens spend all game attacking marine structures. So problem one is that marines have no way to know if it was a skulk shooting a parasite at a remote extractor, or a gorge and an Onos hammering at the main base power node. Secondly, the warning gets drowned out when in combat, and again, combat tends to happen all the time. Thirdly, there are no specific visual warnings.
So, with these issues in mind, how can we address this problem using current game elements? My thought is this...
The klaxon. (It's the sound you hear when the distress beacon goes off) Have the klaxon sound three times (like the beacon) and display an on-screen message (like the beacon) that warns nearby marines of the power node attack. (The commander would only need to hear the warning, since he would know that he didn't trigger a distress beacon.)
Honestly, it is perfect thing to be using to warn marines about power node attacks. Frankly, I don't see why it is used for the distress beacon, since marines really don't need to hear it. (they're getting teleported whether they like it or not) Leave it on the distress beacon if you must, but let's use it for power node attacks.
Pre-requsite:
For power node alarm to be active at a tech point, the marines must have a command chair OR an observatory built there. Phase gate, armory or extractor is not enough.
For each X% of its health that the power node loses, the klaxon goes off. This assures that the alarm won't be going off with a few spikes. We can find a number that works well. What about first alarm at 80%, then next at 65%, followed by another at 50%. When the power node reaches 35% (the point when the alarm on the node and the light turn on) then the klaxon will sound continually. (up to a maximum of say 10-30 seconds so it's not annoying) This alarm cannot be circumvented by any means. It will always sound if the per-requisites are met. Since this is an existing sound, no fancy re-recording of a voice alert needs to be done.
As for where the alarm sounds, this I'm flexible on. The commander should hear it no matter what, and it should also always play at the tech point where the power is being attacked. As for individual marines hearing it when they are NOT at the tech point... It's a tough call since a marine may not be able to do anything about the alarm if they are too far away and/or not near a phase gate. Perhaps expand the tech point warning so it stretches to roughly where the first extractor outside the point would be. That way it's within sprint distance. It probably is not worthwhile to have the alarm trigger for all marines since it will impede communication. It's enough that others will hear it (or the commander at a minimum) and they can inform others.
Now when the power node is attacked, marines WILL KNOW about it. No excuses. No missed warnings or warnings that can't be heard over all the gunfire and voice communication. There will be no excuse not to hear this warning.
Let's fix this once and for all.
Comments
First issue yes, there is a standard blaring all the time that every marine should quickly press the map key and assess whether they can assist or not, second issue maybe, third issue no, you're wrong, there is a separate sound file for "Power node is under attack" and a warning on screen as above.
It doesn't matter if you believe it or not, I've seen it happens and it CONTINUES to happen. If we can't yank these stupid things from the game, at least give marines a proper warning.
I do not think that having the same sound as the beacon is a good idea though. Just think of sentry batterys. It can be rather confusing as aliens (rookies) when you hear that joyful noise of the power going down only to run into a room full of marines with power very much in tact, but with sentries down. One sound for one event IMO. That's just good design. You associate one sound with one thing at a time, more than that and things just get confusing. Imagine if exos made the same walking sound as regular marines, or if gorges made the same sound as skulks. That whole aspect of the game becomes more foggy.
Removing it from the beacon could work, forcing a small recalibration period, but I'd rather see a whole different sound. Just make the pitch of the power node alert different from the beacon, that's would be more than sufficient.
Savant, you serious? After 2 patches specifically to fix the powernode it still happens? (Haven't had time to go on a GORGEOUS marathon, been busy) I would have figured it'd be fixed by now at least. Are you sure the commander didn't just miss it?
Wait... Just hold up right there, Xao. Marines now get a "powernode is under attack" message? Are you certain? How big and where does it show up on screen? The last time a power node was under attack I didn't see anything like that.
I was the commander.
Is it possible the marines didn't hear it? Maybe. I know I was getting 'command station under attack' (it was being lightly attacked, nothing game-ending, as well as soldier under attack, soldier taking damage. I was getting base under attack before those warnings, but at that point they hadn't attacked the power node yet.
Either way, if aliens are attacking ANY marine building (aside from comm chair or IP) you get the same generic "base under attack" message anyway. How does that help when aliens are attacking stuff all the time?
Just give marines ONE unique means to know the power node is under attack. No gimmicks. The klaxon is ideal imho, but I'm happy to listen to other suggestions. This isn't the first time it's happened since the patch. I had one other game on Descent that had the same issue. All of a sudden the arms lab is down and we ask why only to find out that power is out in main. I wasn't commanding, but I still never got a warning.
Wow I finally got something wrong, Savant 1 Xao 50 at this point, I meant to write visual.
Marine view: http://i.imgur.com/3Dhw1b1.jpg + "Base is under attack".
The box on mini map is on the map key screen as well.
Comm view: http://i.imgur.com/wReOgdm.jpg + "Base is under attack".
The box on the left is control grouping a power node to a number using ctrl + #, 1-9, in todays day and age nearly every other game is cara/silence, you're either arrogant, an idiot or both if you're not control grouping your power nodes to instantly see they're under attack, they do not stop flashing red. The box on the right has a picture of a power node and it scrolls continually, it would be a picture of an RT if it was an RT under attack, it can't get much more visual for either marine or commander at this point.
So, comm view: http://i.imgur.com/uCaNEqQ.jpg
1) If you click either line of "Structure under attack" it will center your screen there, have to be fast.
2) The control group power nodes are both flashing red because they're under attack.
3) Both are pinged on the map to all marine players including the comm, I took 3 SS and couldn't get 1 without a minimap being pinged at least once, this had both.
Marine view: http://i.imgur.com/41S5kQd.jpg , http://i.imgur.com/FRspinG.jpg , self explanatory.
edit: punctuation and highlight you can also see in the last marine views the mini map is pinged for both SS in both locations.
The only way to make people notice is to disrupt heavily, in an unpleasant way, what they are doing, but then maybe the reason why you would need to do that in the first place should be looked at instead.
I need to start frapsing more of my games, since there was definitely no power node message. I got a base under attack display, along with repeated "Base under attack" verbal warnings. THE WHOLE TEAM should have received a message and NONE of them did. Not one.
The bottom line is that the warning system is insufficient. You're free to disagree, but you're also in the minority.
Spoilered in case anyone wants to actually view that video for the first time.
About the topic here, the Beacon warning is very useful to marines. Even though there is nothing you can do to stop it, it helps to prepare you for the sudden shift so you aren't left disoriented for several seconds. It also gives you a chance to reload your gun and disengage.
Visual warning are also not ideal since so much is going on onscreen that such warnings are lost amidst the fracas. (When you're being attacked by a skulk, on-screen warnings are a pretty low priority)
If this game breaking mechanic needs to stay in the game, let people know about it in a manner that can NOT be missed.
Let's put it this way, when alien structures are attacked there is one style warning. What happens when the hive is attacked? There is a loud SCREAM. It's a scream that is saying "Hey, you're about to lose the game here, perhaps you better look into it."
The power node is the closest thing the marines have to a hive. (the command chair is rarely attacked before the power node) So give the marines their version of a 'scream'. Give them an audio warning that can't be missed.
I sense a soul in search of answers...
"We then need to find the russian lady from 10years ago" (he edited...)
UWE did get Lani Minella for fresh recordings in ns2 too.
The reason I mentioned the klaxon is since it is the one warning that a player will rarely ever miss.
However, with this you have to assume a skulk parasiting the node would simply harass the commander with alarms, so I'd suggest an X dmg in Y time threshold, such as the DMG taken from two skulk bites within 2 seconds of time to set off the notice/alarm on the comm HUD, with guaranteed alarm is power node HP is less than 50% full.
I think this is better now, and I know I keep obs within sight of any power node I wish to keep, so it doesn't happen that often, but no alarm with counter an organized onos/gorge rush on a power node. you just have to be proactive.
It should be used in conjunction with the "your base is under attack" vocalization and the "powernode under attack" text message. The commander visual notification could probably be tweaked as well given that base powernodes are as vital as command chairs and infantry portals. Right now they're being treated as essentially the same as extractors and amories.
The sound could be the same klaxon-and-electrical-fitzy-sparking sound you get currently when a room's power node is low on health. Just play it for one second each time a base powernode's health crosses certain thresholds, and have it audible across the entire map and not just in the same room.
In other words, what Savant said.
I do agree with Savant that it could still be better.
A kham gets a big fat red icon for anything on the map when it gets attacked, and its there for a long long long long long long long lone time.
Compared a comm has almost nothing. Yes I know they do, but compared.
I agree with Savants view.
hell, the marines outside waiting on the dropship can hear that thing screaming and dying. (Love it though)