Hit registration and interp

Marshall_DrumminMarshall_Drummin Join Date: 2012-12-04 Member: 174115Members
in Ideas and Suggestions
In my mind hit reg and game balance are the two most important fundamentals of any FPS game. Game balance is being tweaked constantly, so I'm not really going to delve into that in this thread.
I wish I could be less blunt, but hit registration needs some tweaking and some more attention from the dev team. There are situations where hit reg server and client side do not match up very well. The most noticeable situations are when fades blink/shadowstep and when marines use jetpacks. I'm sure we have all experienced being melee'd by an alien when we see that we are not in range, or we have been shot when we have blinked out of a room. Interp can't really be avoided when the ping disparity is rather high, but there is still a problem with hit reg/interp when both players have 50-60 ping.

I noticed that server side interp value is set to .08 on a server I played on. If it correlates to interp in HL1 that is a decent number but kinda high. With under 100 ping HL1 mod league games were played almost universally with ex_interp at .01 (.011). This is just a hunch as I'm sure the issue is a bit more complex than what the values are set to.
Hit registration and interp need some more love, it is after all the most important aspect of FPS games. Anything else is just icing on the cake.
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Comments

  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    edited April 2013
    What you're describing is not hitreg. As a matter of fact of many test I've and some other have done, the hitreg is close to pixel perfect (if not perfect) right now, when using hitscan weapons. Especially in the 24x builds.

    Being shot around corners or when not in range on your screen, is lag compensation at work. I'm not sure what the internal engine latency is, but with fast moving players (aliens mostly), it becomes very obvious compared to other games where players tend to be slower.
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  • ScardyBobScardyBob ScardyBob Join Date: 2009-11-25 Member: 69528Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    Also, a video of the issue will important info on the screen (like r_stats and net_stats) would help.
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  • elmo9000elmo9000 Join Date: 2012-03-24 Member: 149324Members
    Even simply looking at player quickly rotating 180 degrees and pressing mouse1 will show you the problem instantly. You dont really need a video for that. It has nothing to do with player moving speeds making it more noticeable.
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  • Marshall_DrumminMarshall_Drummin Join Date: 2012-12-04 Member: 174115Members
    OK I'll be streaming on twitch.tv/marshalldrum
    Its probably the interp being set very high to be honest.
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  • shonanshonan Join Date: 2013-01-28 Member: 182562Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Kouji_San wrote: »
    What you're describing is not hitreg. As a matter of fact of many test I've and some other have done, the hitreg is close to pixel perfect (if not perfect) right now, when using hitscan weapons. Especially in the 24x builds.

    Being shot around corners or when not in range on your screen, is lag compensation at work. I'm not sure what the internal engine latency is, but with fast moving players (aliens mostly), it becomes very obvious compared to other games where players tend to be slower.

    Though its extremely frustrating when you play on aliens as lerk etc and get killed even though it shouldnt be possible and loose a shitton of res.
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  • ScardyBobScardyBob ScardyBob Join Date: 2009-11-25 Member: 69528Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    elmo9000 wrote: »
    Even simply looking at player quickly rotating 180 degrees and pressing mouse1 will show you the problem instantly. You dont really need a video for that. It has nothing to do with player moving speeds making it more noticeable.
    Then a video of the problem should be easy to capture.

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  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    shonan wrote: »
    Kouji_San wrote: »
    What you're describing is not hitreg. As a matter of fact of many test I've and some other have done, the hitreg is close to pixel perfect (if not perfect) right now, when using hitscan weapons. Especially in the 24x builds.

    Being shot around corners or when not in range on your screen, is lag compensation at work. I'm not sure what the internal engine latency is, but with fast moving players (aliens mostly), it becomes very obvious compared to other games where players tend to be slower.

    Though its extremely frustrating when you play on aliens as lerk etc and get killed even though it shouldnt be possible and loose a shitton of res.

    Our best researchers in the field have not yet found a way to get our internet running beyond the speed of light or optimize our router hops
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  • KamamuraKamamura Join Date: 2013-03-06 Member: 183736Members, Reinforced - Gold
    Kouji_San wrote: »
    shonan wrote: »
    Kouji_San wrote: »
    What you're describing is not hitreg. As a matter of fact of many test I've and some other have done, the hitreg is close to pixel perfect (if not perfect) right now, when using hitscan weapons. Especially in the 24x builds.

    Being shot around corners or when not in range on your screen, is lag compensation at work. I'm not sure what the internal engine latency is, but with fast moving players (aliens mostly), it becomes very obvious compared to other games where players tend to be slower.

    Though its extremely frustrating when you play on aliens as lerk etc and get killed even though it shouldnt be possible and loose a shitton of res.

    Our best researchers in the field have not yet found a way to get our internet running beyond the speed of light or optimize our router hops

    This. The clients and the server are all basically running private universes, shifted in time. Client-side hits are not preferred, because it feels more natural (you don't often know how you were hit, but around corners it becomes obvious). If the server reality was strictly enforced, you would be complaining that your bullets are flying through the enemies. There has to be some sort of compromise, some "consensus" reality.

    Plus, network lag is only part of the problem, your gfx card, your memory, your peripheries, every component contributes to the overall latency that is much greater than just the network latency.

    Please read this comprehensive analysis of the lag problem:

    Exploring input lag inside out
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  • elmo9000elmo9000 Join Date: 2012-03-24 Member: 149324Members
    ScardyBob wrote: »
    Then a video of the problem should be easy to capture.

    Yes, yet useless waste of time to capture something that is present 100% of time on ns2 regardless of the performance of the client and server. The amount of delay between what happens on different clients is simply too large, and definitely larger than on other fps multiplayer games.


    Dont need internet running on lightspeed, i would be happy having similiar networking performance that is seen in games made more than a decade ago where players also move much faster than in ns2.
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