Lerk spikes vs exo .. damage per spike is way too high!
joederp
Join Date: 2012-11-02 Member: 165992Members
Join Date: 2012-11-02 Member: 165992Members
Not sure how many times this has been covered, but good lord its insane how fast a couple lerks can safely take out an exo from a distance. The Lerk spikes should quite obviously be considered a "light" damage and therefore should do significantly reduced damage against marines armor and exos since they are entirely armor.
I can see why people might get all hot in the pants if the spike damage was heavily reduced against marine armor.. because right now the marine vs lerk fight is fairly balanced.. but seriously, go try this out - get in a dual exo and have a skilled lerk spike you, and watch as your armor goes down almost as fast as if a skulk were biting at your feet! Not to mention, the exo is so huge that the lerk can easily hide around corners and graded environments and pick off the exos feet / hands / top of head and the exo literally can do nothing about it, aside from hoping his team mates are welding the crap out of him or jetpacking after the lerk. A skilled lerk with regen can EASILY take down a skilled dual exo from a safe distance 100% of the time. Does that really sound right to anyone? And since I am familiar with the crowd on here, let me point out that usually I am the Lerk killing the exos - so no, I am not a noob who is umadbro because my exo got broked. . but for the few times I do try to go exo, I immediately see how impossible it is to defeat a good lerk given the slow speed, huge size and poor ranged accuracy of the exo, combined with the insane amount of damage spikes cause to the exo.
I'm not sure why the devs decided to up the damage in one of the recent patches but its ridiculous. Please fix this.
I can see why people might get all hot in the pants if the spike damage was heavily reduced against marine armor.. because right now the marine vs lerk fight is fairly balanced.. but seriously, go try this out - get in a dual exo and have a skilled lerk spike you, and watch as your armor goes down almost as fast as if a skulk were biting at your feet! Not to mention, the exo is so huge that the lerk can easily hide around corners and graded environments and pick off the exos feet / hands / top of head and the exo literally can do nothing about it, aside from hoping his team mates are welding the crap out of him or jetpacking after the lerk. A skilled lerk with regen can EASILY take down a skilled dual exo from a safe distance 100% of the time. Does that really sound right to anyone? And since I am familiar with the crowd on here, let me point out that usually I am the Lerk killing the exos - so no, I am not a noob who is umadbro because my exo got broked. . but for the few times I do try to go exo, I immediately see how impossible it is to defeat a good lerk given the slow speed, huge size and poor ranged accuracy of the exo, combined with the insane amount of damage spikes cause to the exo.
I'm not sure why the devs decided to up the damage in one of the recent patches but its ridiculous. Please fix this.
Comments
As what mostly happens, I'd rather have the lerk spore out around the exo instead so his welder teammates don't keep him healed up while the other players take out the Exos.
Its not a problem IMO.
Posts rage thread in forums.
Working as intended?
(Sorry I don't normally post like this, but the last time I took down an exo single-handedly as lerk was back in the release week. Fun times.)
I can't tell you how much I would enjoy the combat mod if they removed exos and onos from it
I once soloed 3 Dual minigun exos as a Lerk just spiking them. Fun times.
He said he was Lerk shooting the exos.
EDIT: also faster than two minigun...
Personally I love it when a lerk thinks they are out of range.... wrrrllwrrrlllwrrrrllwrrllwrrlwrlwrlwrl......PEW! .........splat.
Exo poor ranged accuracy....nope.
Yeah... Combat is a joke once the exos and onos start rolling. It really takes most of the "skill" out of the equation that combat is supposed to be focusing on. I'm pretty sure I would enjoy NS2 a lot more in general if both exos and onos were removed. Specially in public games.
Totally agreed about Combat. RIP short period where they were gone
So really maybe relook into the situation you were in at the time when you died to a lerk...
were there multiple lerks shooting at you?
Were you trying to take him down from a super long distance?
Did you utilize proper cover to avoid lerk spikes?
Were you supported by your teammates?
Did you back out of a situation that put you at a disadvantage?
There are a huge number of factors to why you or anyone may die to a lerk, it's extreme difficult to die to a lerk when you're playing an exo as long as you maintain awareness.
If the bonus applies for exos, it should be removed.
The other thing to consider is that exos do not have life points, only armor, and puncture attacks do only half damage against armor (again, according to that wiki).
Puncture damage type is used to balance player damage vs structure damage. Arguably, it is better seen as a way to nerf damage vs structures rather than being seen as a boost vs players - how much damage you do against players is the most important thing, so it's balanced from there.
Both the Fade and the Lerk uses this to penalize their structure DPS.
That Onos Gore uses puncture damage is probably a historical artefact from way back when Gore and Smash was two different attacks - well, they still are, its just that Gore is never used against structures (it automatically translates to Smash instead), so it could just raise the base damage and do normal damage instead - if less confusion is desired.
Lerk is my favorite class and I play it a lot. Yes, I sometimes manage to take down an exo with spikes, but almost always as part of a team effort with several other lifeforms involved. In fact I think that exos of all kinds is a pretty hard counter against lerks. When exos are on the field, my lerk play has to change significantly. I either have to keep distance AND stay close to cover, or go in only when there is a fair amount of team mates attacking at the same time. My view is that lerk play goes through three pretty distinct phases:
Before shotguns - Lerk is the king of the map. You can usually take down 2 marines with no backup, I think I've lost (as in had to retreat, not die) once or twice against solo marines since I started playing lerk a lot. Unless a room has 4 or more marines you can pretty comfortably go in, knowing you'll be able to get away if you take too much damage. Bite is my primary attack in this period. (Here I like regen/cele for upgrades)
After shotguns - Now I have to turn down the aggression and keep the distance. Solo marines or groups with no shotguns will still get bitten, but more time will be spent softening up or finishing marines from a distance. Spike is now my most used weapon. (Now I prefer cara/cele)
After exos - Now I'm relegated to more of a support role, or taking down solo marines who are attacking res nodes or trying to ninja hives/upgrades/phasegates. I'm either staying at a distance softening up exos while other players attack, or going in to spore welders/bases and obscure the marines vision/distract. Spores will be the most common method of attack at this point. (Here I'd go cara/adren)
I think I've taken down a solo exo by myself two or maybe three times, and that is exclusively when he's wandered off alone. And it's never been one of the good players on the servers. Partly because they usually don't wander off with an exo, and partly because if you have good aim, a lerk won't be able to take you down. And if the exo starts getting low, he can usually manage to retreat around a corner and back to a base, since it's close to suicide to try and chase him into an enclosed area.
In theory I think a regen lerk can take down a bad or average exo assuming there is no intervention. Because yes, you can pop out and deal some damage then retreat and heal up. If the exo has no backup, he will eventually go down assuming he doesn't retreat or get lucky. But in a scenario where he won't retreat or get welded, you can do the same with a gorge spitting or even a skulk parasiting, given enough time. If those situations occur often to you as a lerk, it seems like you're playing against some weird marines. If you're the one in the exo suit, I suggest you change your tactics.
Seriously though, I think its fine how it is at the moment.
I don't know when the damage was boosted, I rarely go Exo so I didn't notice the damage increase until I was being hit by a lerk. Usually I am the lerk so when I take down an exo, I just chalked it up to 'oh that exo must have been almost dead' nope he was doing fine until I came along and spiked him to death.
I think a lot of the people posting replies really don't play with skilled players enough. I regularly play in servers with highly skilled players from well known groups .. so maybe if you play pubs with a bunch of greens you don't notice the problem as much, but trust me when I say the lerk spike is entirely more effective vs exo than it should be. I urge you all to go try this - save up for Exo in a server where there are skilled lerks around, then try to engage that lerk and let me know how that works out. You will not even be able to retreat to get help unless you have teammates very near by who can waste their time welding you to save your giant turd suit which at that point you will consider a complete waste of res.
So in summary, 2-3 months ago as an Exo a Lerk spiking you was a minor annoyance that could easily be scared off with a few minigun bullets before he did any real damage. Now I regard a Lerk spiking my exo as a higher danger than a gorge bile bombing me. By the time you spray some bullets his way to scare him off, hes already done 100-150 dmg in that short time. It never used to be like that.
I can't believe nobody else sees this is as problem.. a low level unit of melee class that can out-gun the most powerful unit of the ranged class from long distances! LOL .. but yeah you guys are right, I'm just MAD cause my exo broked. . ffs..
Exactly - the damage of the spikes should be halved against an exo since it is entirely armor. Is this currently what happens?
Just popping in to say that.
What was different in NS1?