I think its a good idea to keep them reasonably close to the gorge the spawns them. Commanding via map would be a little awkward, and annoying from the marine perspective. Imagine having a gorge just sitting in base and constantly sending babblers into enemy base.
Plus they'd have to get some sort of LoS addition that could be OP, using babblers as scouts like the old form of drifter.
Babblers spawn the same, with egg and maturation time.
Babblers controlled by babbler bait, which is now a "spit-like" aiming system; right click to target self? They travel toward the target (if not a player) for a certain distance away from the gorge, then return if no target is seen)
Babblers don't jump quite as high to attack marines and they don't jump at all to attack buildings.
Babblers now grab on to their target (if marine) and blow up after 3 seconds, dealing small aoe damage (10-20 each with small splash, no vision obscuring effects).
Babblers provide Line of Sight to aliens.
Babblers still stick to friendlies the same, but dampen explosion damage by negating half of it (at the cost of loosing all babblers in the range of the explosion).
As much as I'd love to see babblers completely redone, realistically, the "attach and explode" thing probably wont happen.
IMO Babblers would be great if:
They did their damage more consistently (less missing, lets just say no/much less jumping)
They had a better control mechanism (spit-esq babbler mode)
- control ball flies like spit
- hold down to target self
They were easier to spawn (tap to spawn 1, charge to spawn more)
- Make them free and cost energy, but can only have a max of 5, in stead of 9
- Max spawn of babblers should take 60% of energy to prevent spam.
it sounds definately better than the current ball-thingy.
one thing still to cover for that proposal though: what about the pres cost?
1. removing pres cost: i guess that makes them weaker (due to balance) as it allows them to be spammed. might still be ok due to high energy consumption.
2. scaling it with amount of babblers spawned: reaching from 1-10 means the cost has to go behind the comma, which never happens for any other ability in the game. then again, it's a very unusual way of using a pres ability plus the pres is already calculated behind comma for harvester-ticks.
3. charging up has only 3(?) discrete stages, which spawn the amount of babblers currently found in 1-3 eggs, with a pres cost of 1-3 accordingly. could be done with some charge-bar that has the transitions clearly marked.
unless there are some better ideas, i'd vote for removing the pres cost completely: the game has so many obscure mechanics already, better avoid adding another one that leaves some gorges wondering why they suddenly cannot afford their tunnel exit anymore.
it sounds definately better than the current ball-thingy.
one thing still to cover for that proposal though: what about the pres cost?
1. removing pres cost: i guess that makes them weaker (due to balance) as it allows them to be spammed. might still be ok due to high energy consumption.
2. scaling it with amount of babblers spawned: reaching from 1-10 means the cost has to go behind the comma, which never happens for any other ability in the game. then again, it's a very unusual way of using a pres ability plus the pres is already calculated behind comma for harvester-ticks.
3. charging up has only 3(?) discrete stages, which spawn the amount of babblers currently found in 1-3 eggs, with a pres cost of 1-3 accordingly. could be done with some charge-bar that has the transitions clearly marked.
unless there are some better ideas, i'd vote for removing the pres cost completely: the game has so many obscure mechanics already, better avoid adding another one that leaves some gorges wondering why they suddenly cannot afford their tunnel exit anymore.
I agree. We don't need an ability that shoots pres. Make them cost energy and balance them accordingly.
i would like to see babblers utilized differently, instead of them just hitting marines i would like them to latch onto the marines similarly to how they latch on to aliens, slowing the marine down slightly and acting similarly to a parasite, the babblers would need shooting off the marine by a team mate.
IronHorseDeveloper, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributorJoin Date: 2010-05-08Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts
But what good does shooting or spitting babblers do if they move the same speed and miss just as much?
You can avoid babblers entirely without concern - even if you got bait balled - they aren't even an annoyance, let alone a threat. All because of their poor mobility and targeting. :-\
IronHorseDeveloper, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributorJoin Date: 2010-05-08Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts
@Benson heh.. I once suggested specific values that made them very similar to those hl1 snarks in the video, but not much came from it.
Maybe I'll bring it up again internally, seeing as this CDT thing is working out pretty slick so far ;-)
@Benson heh.. I once suggested specific values that made them very similar to those hl1 snarks in the video, but not much came from it.
Maybe I'll bring it up again internally, seeing as this CDT thing is working out pretty slick so far ;-)
Yeah I like the idea that a babble can attach itself to a marine and make him parasited.
Maybe instead of dealing damage they slow the marines down or something? or eat armour... nom nom nom
Bilebomb+babblers for dps can be pretty useful when assaulting gates, especially in games where you can't get anyone to come with.
They are pretty useless when the average skill level goes up though.
I feel this is stating the obvious, but make babblers...
1. easier to create
2. never die of old age (as long as they are not stuck/etc).
3. move faster
4. do actual damage to (or somehow otherwise interfere with) marines, even if they are moving around **gasp**
Once you do all of that, then adjust for balance, without removing what was just added.
twilitebluebug stalkerJoin Date: 2003-02-04Member: 13116Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited August 2014
How about reduce Babblers' auto enemy seeking range (making aiming the babbler ball more important), but significantly increase their movement speed (to be able to catch up to a sprinting marine)?
Babblers are not necessary for a deep NS2. They were added to the game to justify a content pack to push sales. There's no reason to jump through hoops and waste valuable coding time on these critters. They don't add depth to the game and never will and that's OK. We have PLENTY of content in NS2, we don't need babblers.
but they are announced babblers as significant content update on the steam store page in a patch video. i agree that they are not that important in terms of game mechanics, but throwing away content because there are some mediocre problems with it (that can probably be fixed) doesn't sound like a good approach to me. imagine they would have done that to EXOs instead of taking some time to rebalance them. it might take some time until they are seen more often on the field (apparently coms don't trust them as much yet) but i bet a lot of people would be pissed off if they were remived for good.
Soul_RiderMod BeanJoin Date: 2004-06-19Member: 29388Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
The funny thing about Babblers, is despite playing a huge amount of time in NS2, and spending most of my alien lifetime gorging, I must admit I still haven't worked how to use the babblers....
Remember when they were so OP they could turn skulks nigh invincible early game? Babblers can have a purpose, too!
Step up for your babblers today! Only YOU can give a lone babbler a future!
Enlist as a gorge now.*
*Death by Rifles, Shotguns, Grenades or other human equipment not covered by insurance
Seriously though, babblers can work. Just gotta keep trying!
Babblers are actually pretty good shielding against shotgun blasts, and OK against rifles (blocks 2 bullets/pellets).
But if their only purpose is as a shield....the model should be flattened out to look more like plating. Currently babblers attached to anything beyond a gorge looks....odd.
I guess it's just about finding the right role for babblers. Do we want them to be offensive, defensive, or utility based skill.
As of right now their closest role is defensive..putting babblers on a lifeform for more eHP. It's just such a waste of res though. The defense isn't really worth the pay of 2 res.
MouseThe Lighter Side of PessimismJoin Date: 2002-03-02Member: 263Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
It'd be more worthwhile if a babbler egg was actually a babbler hive that regularly spawned 1-2 babblers and/or babblers could help with building things that were nearby - making them micro-drifters.
Comments
Plus they'd have to get some sort of LoS addition that could be OP, using babblers as scouts like the old form of drifter.
Babblers spawn the same, with egg and maturation time.
Babblers controlled by babbler bait, which is now a "spit-like" aiming system; right click to target self? They travel toward the target (if not a player) for a certain distance away from the gorge, then return if no target is seen)
Babblers don't jump quite as high to attack marines and they don't jump at all to attack buildings.
Babblers now grab on to their target (if marine) and blow up after 3 seconds, dealing small aoe damage (10-20 each with small splash, no vision obscuring effects).
Babblers provide Line of Sight to aliens.
Babblers still stick to friendlies the same, but dampen explosion damage by negating half of it (at the cost of loosing all babblers in the range of the explosion).
IMO Babblers would be great if:
They did their damage more consistently (less missing, lets just say no/much less jumping)
They had a better control mechanism (spit-esq babbler mode)
- control ball flies like spit
- hold down to target self
They were easier to spawn (tap to spawn 1, charge to spawn more)
- Make them free and cost energy, but can only have a max of 5, in stead of 9
- Max spawn of babblers should take 60% of energy to prevent spam.
one thing still to cover for that proposal though: what about the pres cost?
1. removing pres cost: i guess that makes them weaker (due to balance) as it allows them to be spammed. might still be ok due to high energy consumption.
2. scaling it with amount of babblers spawned: reaching from 1-10 means the cost has to go behind the comma, which never happens for any other ability in the game. then again, it's a very unusual way of using a pres ability plus the pres is already calculated behind comma for harvester-ticks.
3. charging up has only 3(?) discrete stages, which spawn the amount of babblers currently found in 1-3 eggs, with a pres cost of 1-3 accordingly. could be done with some charge-bar that has the transitions clearly marked.
unless there are some better ideas, i'd vote for removing the pres cost completely: the game has so many obscure mechanics already, better avoid adding another one that leaves some gorges wondering why they suddenly cannot afford their tunnel exit anymore.
I agree. We don't need an ability that shoots pres. Make them cost energy and balance them accordingly.
You can avoid babblers entirely without concern - even if you got bait balled - they aren't even an annoyance, let alone a threat. All because of their poor mobility and targeting. :-\
So fix it and get all the love
Maybe I'll bring it up again internally, seeing as this CDT thing is working out pretty slick so far ;-)
Plz plz plz fix babblers in some way lol
Maybe instead of dealing damage they slow the marines down or something? or eat armour... nom nom nom
They are pretty useless when the average skill level goes up though.
1. easier to create
2. never die of old age (as long as they are not stuck/etc).
3. move faster
4. do actual damage to (or somehow otherwise interfere with) marines, even if they are moving around **gasp**
Once you do all of that, then adjust for balance, without removing what was just added.
yeah its probably the babblers' fault your server can't hold 30 tick rate. :P
So let's change it...?
Remember when they were so OP they could turn skulks nigh invincible early game? Babblers can have a purpose, too!
Step up for your babblers today! Only YOU can give a lone babbler a future!
Enlist as a gorge now.*
*Death by Rifles, Shotguns, Grenades or other human equipment not covered by insurance
Seriously though, babblers can work. Just gotta keep trying!
But if their only purpose is as a shield....the model should be flattened out to look more like plating. Currently babblers attached to anything beyond a gorge looks....odd.
As of right now their closest role is defensive..putting babblers on a lifeform for more eHP. It's just such a waste of res though. The defense isn't really worth the pay of 2 res.