I want to make some video's....and....They involve YOU, the COMMUNITY as a whole :)

13

Comments

  • YojimboYojimbo England Join Date: 2009-03-19 Member: 66806Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
    Well I would love to help out but timezone difference is a factor, need to find a happy medium for when to meet up and organize this because as it stands, our play times fall on unsociable hours since we are both on the other sides of the world.
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
    edited October 2015
    And yea that tutorial Ghoul is quite outdated. Thats why I want to make a much more up to date tutorial. Had a massive chat to Rusty about all this and YouTube and also what hes been doing lately. Thats also why Verdiumm is not underway with his guides, using his experience and knowledge.
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
    Oh for crying out loud, the channel link is a video again -_-
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
    Yojimbo wrote: »
    Well I would love to help out but timezone difference is a factor, need to find a happy medium for when to meet up and organize this because as it stands, our play times fall on unsociable hours since we are both on the other sides of the world.

    Im always happy to stay up very late some nights to help with timezones :)
  • SantaClawsSantaClaws Denmark Join Date: 2012-07-31 Member: 154491Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited October 2015
    @TBD_TheBlackDog

    The comment by @amoral on page 2, is a good start for most of my concerns, and the length highlights why I did NOT post it :p (I decided to delete my draft for that reason)

    I knew it was gonna be a wall of text like that - and I didn't want to highjack the thread either to start a witchhunt on the guy.

    One request I will make - Write the tips in a list form in your video description box. That way it will be much easier to address each topic.
  • GhoulofGSG9GhoulofGSG9 Join Date: 2013-03-31 Member: 184566Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter, Pistachionauts
    edited October 2015
    Ok, let me say this. READ MY ABOVE POST. This isn't a tutorial series. How many times do I have to say this? Its NOT perfect, its NOT a complete guide and was never intended to be either. Its simply a collection of tips that people might find useful, mixed with a bit of humor for some light-hearted entertainment. This isn't meant for rookies as much as it is meant for people who have a decent grasp on the game. I will cover this EXTENSIVELY in my feedback video. Look, I am in no position to call anyone out for being 'wrong' as I only have 111 hours clocked, but you've got to understand that this is no perfected guide that will turn a rookie into a veteran. At least im trying to do something with this community, a lot of the vets couldn't really give a shit (Obviously not including you guys), and they are the ones who should be taking a stand and leading something like this. But no, its a guy who is still learning but who genuinely wants to make a difference. As I keep learning about the game myself, I will begin to work on a tutorial for NS2, starting with marines. I think thats most definitely my strong point. After a lot of COD, marines definitely suits my style.

    If you guys want to be critical about the tips, then perhaps we can organise something and you can share what you have! This isn't just from a few people, EVERYONE can and I want people to get involved! DONT JUST CRITICISE AND BE SO NEGATIVE, GET INVOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :smiley:

    I didn't intended to say you should make a tutorial!

    I posted those links in my previous post to make sure that you have a solid understanding of the core game mechanics and are actually able to filter good and not so good tips on your own.

    Sadly i even came across NS2 veterans who still lacked some of those understandings after 500+ hours of playtime just because the followed some tips they received from other players without thinking about why they should follow them. That's why i personally find it important to give context for some of them.

    An simple example is the "veil vents" one:

    Yes it is useful to know that you can get up to all the vents without a jetpack. But you should only do that if a gorge is camping in one of the vents and you don't have cluster-grenades, a grenade launcher or jetpack avaible. Any other life form can't do critical harm from the vents without exposing itself so you can easily kill it with a rifle.

    If you try to go up to the vents for a skulk, lerk or fade they will happily kill you.

    Also most posts here are not meant in a negative way , but try to be constructive. I guess everyone here really appreciates your work. We just want to make sure you get things right ;)


    Edit: BTW the guide i posted is only not up to date in matter of the fade and not mentioning biomass. Those are the two things that got changed in quiet a drastic way after 252.
  • SantaClawsSantaClaws Denmark Join Date: 2012-07-31 Member: 154491Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Again, let me just preface this: I genuinely appreciate the effort! This is meant as constructive criticism.

    Marine Tips: Criticisms

    Tip #1: Sneaky Mines on Infantry Portal
    This tip is useless and a waste of time. Leave it in if you want, it’s of no consequence - just wasting time imo.

    Tip #2: Use Pistol for Long Range Confrontations
    Good tip, but lacks much more detail. You should explain how pistols are light damage and deal less damage to carapace. Meaning you want to use your LMG to soften up aliens and then finish them with pistol for maximizing efficiency.

    Tip #4: Surround sound Headset is VERY Helpful for Hearing Aliens
    Useless tip. Instead you should be talking about other forms of awareness.

    Using the map, gamesense and having proper positioning is what gives you the best awareness and information gathering ability, in addition to the standard audio and visual aids.

    Tip #6: How to get into Cargo Vent on the Map: Veil
    Fun to do in pregames, but as the other guy in the video says, you’ll be using this exactly 0 times in a real game. It’s a waste of time.

    The only real reason to go in there, is if you have a base in cargo and a gorge is biling from up there. However a few problems with that:
      1) - Gorges can just get up on the platform on the window in the back of the room - marines cannot get up there without jetpack. 2) - 99% (this number is taken right out of my ass) of games on veil, marines do not control Cargo. At least not with anything that can be damaged by bilebomb. 3) - If you hold cargo with a full base with IP’s etc., chances are you also have jetpacks researched.

    That leaves a tiny-tiny percentage of games where it’s actually useful to jump up there.

    That said, I have used it before in games, to give myself a superior position against skulks and onos. But not to jump in the vent.. +there's a more direct route but w/e.

    Tip #9: While pressing W to go forward, Strafe Jump Right/Left or Spam A and D while Firing when in Battle

    It’s a great topic - how to dodge skulks. Very important in NS2. But what a god awful demonstration - and just extremely lacking advice.

    “Spam A and D while firing in battle”? NO! You do not spam. You have to read your opponent and move in accordance to him. It’s much more complicated than this guy lets on - in fact he seems to have pretty poor movement if you ask me.

    The guy RottenBerries seems to have it on straight. The reason you should try not to jump too much is that your movements are quite predictable in those next few frames. See how that idea ties in to “read your opponent”?

    Your movements should be controlled and reactionary and designed to throw off your opponent where ever possible while maintaining your tracking on your opponent. I think it’s a common misconception that people think that “moving randomly” is “moving unpredictably”. These two are not mutually inclusive.

    In fact, the best way to stay alive vs an alien - is to maximize your damage output. I know it sounds strange to put it like that. But if the alien is dying, he can't bite you - he must try to juke YOUR bullets. If he's juking your bullets, he's not biting you. So moving erratically, at the expense of your own accuracy, is a poor strategy for staying alive in my experience.

    Tip #11: Have a HIGH Mouse Sensitvity/DPI
    I think this is a great and important topic to bring up. But man I think you guys covered this poorly. As you can tell, this reply is already quite lengthy, but my response to this point is longer than all the other points combined. So i'm going to skip this one.

    Tip #13: NEVER use In-Game Mouse Acceleration
    I’m glad you put in the caveat “In-Game”, because a lot of quake pros actually use customizable mouse acceleration algorithms. But yes, this is a very good and general tip for the average player. The average player should probably not fool around with customizable mouse acceleration. But I think it’s worth mentioning that for the more advanced player, this is something that could be considered.
  • SantaClawsSantaClaws Denmark Join Date: 2012-07-31 Member: 154491Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    About Tip #11: Have a HIGH Mouse Sensitvity/DPI
    If they are smart enough, they won’t [have low DPI]

    First of all, he doesn’t seem to quite understand what DPI actually is (let’s not get in to that discussion though, as that is a lengthy one ime).

    Most pros, in most fast paced shooters use LOW sensitivity (perhaps we could make a poll on this if anyone would like to dispute this claim). Look at quake, dirtybomb, unreal tournament, you name it.
    It’s actually especially important in a game like NS2, where the time-to-kill is so long - you have to track the opponent for a longer period of time. Compared to CS, where people die instantly to the headshots. But even in CS, the consensus seems to be that low sensitivity is prefered.
    I have max sensitivity in-game and 1200 DPI

    The reason I think Senpai needs this high sensitivity (I'm basing these assertions on his comments in the videos and watching his vods on his twitch account) - is because he doesn’t understand how to acquire information efficiently. He mentions sound, yes. He mentions the map, yes. These, and his visual aids, are his 3 only tools for gathering information about where the aliens are. So to maximize his awareness he needs to be able to look over his shoulders over and over again (You will notice if you watch his stream).
    Another thing that helps with high DPI is peripheral [vision]

    A good player - rarely needs to do a 180 or need the extra peripheral vision. Because they position themselves in a way that they do not need to. And they know how to position themselves, because they have good gamesense. Awareness is something you can acquire with much more than those 3 basic tools.

    Senpai needs to be able to do 180 at any moment, because he lacks the gamesense and awareness that good players have.

    In addition, it is very dumb of him to say that higher sensitivity allows him to turn 180 faster. This is not true. You can turn just as fast with low sensitivity. You simply need to cover slightly more distance with your mouse.

    I will grant him, he can turn 180 more frequently than I could with his insane sensitivity. But not faster - and as I explained earlier, this is not something I very often require anyway.

    Now I don’t think high sens is all bad. There are probably some very intelligent people who think so on this forum I suspect. But I used to play with relatively high sens 2.0 and 1200 dpi iirc. And it can work - it’s really a preference thing in the end. And I think it is a matter of your style.

    If you are like me, a very methodical player. Taking rooms slowly and surely rather than rushing in without confirmation that I’m safe from behind - then you don’t need high sensitivity. But if you'd like to be able to take a lot of risk or poor positions and still be able to adapt in poor situations, then I think high sens might work for you.

    So I think Senpai is poisoning the discussion, by dismissing any type of nuance and by concluding that no smart person has low sensitivity. I’d make the same error, if I said that low sensitivity was the only way to go - it is a much more nuanced discussion imo. And it would be a very interesting one to have, if it was not dismissed so casually.
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
    Well, shit. Looks like the feedback video is coming early! Rescheduled to be the next NS2 video. I think its about time for me to address this, with the essays that have been written to me :wink:
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
    I think we are gonna start fresh with this. This feedback video is gonna be very important for the series, so Ill get it out asap. Will be worth a watch
  • YojimboYojimbo England Join Date: 2009-03-19 Member: 66806Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
    SantaClaws wrote: »
    About Tip #11: Have a HIGH Mouse Sensitvity/DPI
    If they are smart enough, they won’t [have low DPI]

    First of all, he doesn’t seem to quite understand what DPI actually is (let’s not get in to that discussion though, as that is a lengthy one ime).

    Most pros, in most fast paced shooters use LOW sensitivity (perhaps we could make a poll on this if anyone would like to dispute this claim). Look at quake, dirtybomb, unreal tournament, you name it.
    It’s actually especially important in a game like NS2, where the time-to-kill is so long - you have to track the opponent for a longer period of time. Compared to CS, where people die instantly to the headshots. But even in CS, the consensus seems to be that low sensitivity is prefered.
    I have max sensitivity in-game and 1200 DPI

    The reason I think Senpai needs this high sensitivity (I'm basing these assertions on his comments in the videos and watching his vods on his twitch account) - is because he doesn’t understand how to acquire information efficiently. He mentions sound, yes. He mentions the map, yes. These, and his visual aids, are his 3 only tools for gathering information about where the aliens are. So to maximize his awareness he needs to be able to look over his shoulders over and over again (You will notice if you watch his stream).
    Another thing that helps with high DPI is peripheral [vision]

    A good player - rarely needs to do a 180 or need the extra peripheral vision. Because they position themselves in a way that they do not need to. And they know how to position themselves, because they have good gamesense. Awareness is something you can acquire with much more than those 3 basic tools.

    Senpai needs to be able to do 180 at any moment, because he lacks the gamesense and awareness that good players have.

    In addition, it is very dumb of him to say that higher sensitivity allows him to turn 180 faster. This is not true. You can turn just as fast with low sensitivity. You simply need to cover slightly more distance with your mouse.

    I will grant him, he can turn 180 more frequently than I could with his insane sensitivity. But not faster - and as I explained earlier, this is not something I very often require anyway.

    Now I don’t think high sens is all bad. There are probably some very intelligent people who think so on this forum I suspect. But I used to play with relatively high sens 2.0 and 1200 dpi iirc. And it can work - it’s really a preference thing in the end. And I think it is a matter of your style.

    If you are like me, a very methodical player. Taking rooms slowly and surely rather than rushing in without confirmation that I’m safe from behind - then you don’t need high sensitivity. But if you'd like to be able to take a lot of risk or poor positions and still be able to adapt in poor situations, then I think high sens might work for you.

    So I think Senpai is poisoning the discussion, by dismissing any type of nuance and by concluding that no smart person has low sensitivity. I’d make the same error, if I said that low sensitivity was the only way to go - it is a much more nuanced discussion imo. And it would be a very interesting one to have, if it was not dismissed so casually.

    Whats your ingame name santa, I feel like I've never see you about?
  • amoralamoral Join Date: 2013-01-03 Member: 177250Members
    SantaClaws wrote: »
    Again, let me just preface this: I genuinely appreciate the effort! This is meant as constructive criticism.

    ...
      1) - Gorges can just get up on the platform on the window in the back of the room - marines cannot get up there without jetpack. 2) - 99% (this number is taken right out of my ass) of games on veil, marines do not control Cargo. At least not with anything that can be damaged by bilebomb. 3) - If you hold cargo with a full base with IP’s etc., chances are you also have jetpacks researched.

    That leaves a tiny-tiny percentage of games where it’s actually useful to jump up there.

    That said, I have used it before in games, to give myself a superior position against skulks and onos. But not to jump in the vent.. +there's a more direct route but w/e.

    ...

    @SantaClaws i've used that route a 1-3 times for the gorge, and been that gorge a handful of times where people have used it against me. depends on their map coverage if you even can go up top in the back.

    cargo early game is also not super rare, it's a common tactic after marines get pushed out of nano.
  • MaxAmusMaxAmus UK Join Date: 2003-12-26 Member: 24779Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited October 2015
    I have killed quite a few lerks by camping in that vent :open_mouth:
    Killed a fade once, and jumped out at dome to trap an onos, sadly he got away, only to be killed 3 mins later :smiley:
  • amoralamoral Join Date: 2013-01-03 Member: 177250Members
    MaxAmus wrote: »
    I have killed quite a few lerks by camping in that vent :open_mouth:
    Killed a fade once, and jumped out at dome to trap an onos, sadly he got away, only to be killed 3 mins later :smiley:

    yeah, that vent is a death trap, though, i'd never go in there with anything i wouldn't be willing to lose, deathtrap both ways.
  • Disco_StuDisco_Stu Join Date: 2013-09-07 Member: 187965Members, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited October 2015
    Haha christ so much salt over the vid I did with this guy. Yes "Vid": It all happened in one sitting, he's edited it into 4-5 parts.

    1) Sneaky mines on IPs and PGs are EXTREMELY useful. They are NOT a waste of time. The amount of times I've taken down 2-3 enemies with 1x5res sneaky mine is ridiculous. I forgot to cover sneaky mines in vents and other areas, but would be more than happy to cover that in another video. I didn't cover PG mines because I've already shown him. One time I killed about 5-10 enemies with 1 sneaky mine on a PG in Subsector. I lol'd so fking hard when it happened.

    2) Pistol down hallway I think was a good tip, but you're right I should have mentioned more. I probably should have mentioned if you were trying to hit an onos it wouldn't matter. Pretty sure I mentioned to him that when the enemy starts to move up on you, you should get your primary out (maybe he cut it out? Maybe I forgot?). But for the length of that particular hallway, if I'm trying to hit an enemy that's at the very end of it (near the overlook doorway) then i'll use my pistol.

    3) Never claimed that being able to get into the cargo vent was a "super special secret trick and that everybody should do it if a gorge is in that vent". I simply stated it's a useful trick to know if you wanna get in that vent to kill a gorge, period.

    4) Surround sound headset has improved my game: fact. Map awareness was covered with the C key tip. But yes, more could have been covered.

    5) You may think my movement is aweful but it helps me dodge skulks just fine. I think if you really want to see a proper demostration of this you need to watch me play. As for what Rotten said, If you weren't listening: I did agree with him. But the strafe jumping thing can be useful sometimes.

    6) High mouse sens/DPI. Again, your hearing seems to be impaired. I never claimed everyone should do this. I said: "I dunno if this will help you, or the people that watch your channel. But for me, High Sens/High DPI works, blahblah, etcetc"
    S*** even TheBlackDog edited in a little pop-up window that says "Mouse sensitivity is also a matter of personal preference, blahblah, etcetc".

    Lastly: I was trying to quickly run through some tips for both marines and aliens, a few of which I felt were useful to know for that particular map. It didn't help that I had an annoying troll Onos knocking us over several times throughout the video (you only saw it happen a few times: the rest was edited out) and then we had OTTO come on and start whining non-stop about not playing when we were doing the aliens tips.

    Finally: Get over yourself you salty c***. :)

    -Senpai
  • MaxAmusMaxAmus UK Join Date: 2003-12-26 Member: 24779Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Shadow
    I think the videos are ok, could they be better ? Off course!
    Only way to improve is by others pointing these things out, there for they can only get better, Use them as a stepping stone to what you want them to be, either just Pure tip videos Or full on Tutorial,
    So keep it going, and if you need help dont be afraid to ask.
    and dont worry about santa, hes not real after all :tongue:
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
    Ok ok, no need to start a war boys. Lets not spread the cancerous and unfriendly side of the community through this thread. Like I said, im making a video which will address all of this. Thanks @MaxAmus for putting it in a better fashion. I suppose, if I can make it work, it could turn into a tutorial of such. :smile:
  • SantaClawsSantaClaws Denmark Join Date: 2012-07-31 Member: 154491Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited October 2015
    @Yojimbo - I go by many names mate. If I'm on a french server I like to go by "Je ne parle pas fr".

    P.S. Was it necessary to quote the whole thing? :P
  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    Ok ok, no need to start a war boys.

    *drives back the flamethrower tank into the garage* o:)
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
    Kouji_San wrote: »
    Ok ok, no need to start a war boys.

    *drives back the flamethrower tank into the garage* o:)

    De-evolves from a Dangerous Onos into a Harmless and friendly Gorge o:)
  • YojimboYojimbo England Join Date: 2009-03-19 Member: 66806Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
    Kouji_San wrote: »
    Ok ok, no need to start a war boys.

    *drives back the flamethrower tank into the garage* o:)

    De-evolves from a Dangerous Onos into a Harmless and friendly Gorge o:)

    Good to see you about last night, shame about your base :smiley:
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
    Yojimbo wrote: »
    Kouji_San wrote: »
    Ok ok, no need to start a war boys.

    *drives back the flamethrower tank into the garage* o:)

    De-evolves from a Dangerous Onos into a Harmless and friendly Gorge o:)

    Good to see you about last night, shame about your base :smiley:

    Yea man! My base?
  • YojimboYojimbo England Join Date: 2009-03-19 Member: 66806Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
    Yojimbo wrote: »
    Kouji_San wrote: »
    Ok ok, no need to start a war boys.

    *drives back the flamethrower tank into the garage* o:)

    De-evolves from a Dangerous Onos into a Harmless and friendly Gorge o:)

    Good to see you about last night, shame about your base :smiley:

    Yea man! My base?

    Marine base got obliterated on ns_caged!
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
    Yojimbo wrote: »
    Yojimbo wrote: »
    Kouji_San wrote: »
    Ok ok, no need to start a war boys.

    *drives back the flamethrower tank into the garage* o:)

    De-evolves from a Dangerous Onos into a Harmless and friendly Gorge o:)

    Good to see you about last night, shame about your base :smiley:

    Yea man! My base?

    Marine base got obliterated on ns_caged!

    Haha yea
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
    Hopeully this discussion video will be up tonight
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
    Here it is guys, hope this covers everything :)
  • Saffron_bakerSaffron_baker Sweden Join Date: 2015-06-09 Member: 205352Members
    i've added you as a friend (saffron_baker)
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
  • TBD_TheBlackDogTBD_TheBlackDog Australia m8 Join Date: 2015-09-09 Member: 207842Members
    If anyone is looking to get involved, this weekend I want to do a heap of recording and what not, so let me know if your up for it!
  • YojimboYojimbo England Join Date: 2009-03-19 Member: 66806Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
    If anyone is looking to get involved, this weekend I want to do a heap of recording and what not, so let me know if your up for it!

    Stop by a euro server and I will haha
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