Idea for beginner-friendly, balanced, realistic, AND ethical defense

rkalorkalo Join Date: 2016-07-20 Member: 220493Members
edited July 2016 in Ideas and Suggestions
Nets made out of creepvine samples

Gives the player 5 -- maybe less if you aim it at a stalker's face or something -- seconds to flee before the fish tears through the net, and the samples are gone

not enough time to logically depend on over the stasis rifle

if you want to add more balance to it, you could add specifics that make it more inconvenient to use
  • takes up a lot of inventory space, more than a regular creepvine samples but not the same as the cumulative of creepvine sample needed to make it
  • requires more than 2 creepvine
  • the longer it goes without being used, the weaker the time benefit is. i.e. it grows looser and looser until it has a 1 second trap effect

Comments

  • SigmalxSigmalx USA Join Date: 2016-07-12 Member: 220132Members
    titanium + battery + net: stun net
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    Everybody always goes immediately to a stun version of something. You're in a saltwater environment. Saltwater is VERY conductible. It would likely stun you just as much as whatever is attacking you.
  • SigmalxSigmalx USA Join Date: 2016-07-12 Member: 220132Members
    Everybody always goes immediately to a stun version of something. You're in a saltwater environment. Saltwater is VERY conductible. It would likely stun you just as much as whatever is attacking you.

    yet there is a shark taser in real life. wetsuits are designed to be 100% insulated. the player is in a confined and 100% sealed diving suit, so it is no issue being electrocuted.
    also, would you rather this or a spear.
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    Sigmalx wrote: »
    Everybody always goes immediately to a stun version of something. You're in a saltwater environment. Saltwater is VERY conductible. It would likely stun you just as much as whatever is attacking you.

    yet there is a shark taser in real life. wetsuits are designed to be 100% insulated. the player is in a confined and 100% sealed diving suit, so it is no issue being electrocuted.
    also, would you rather this or a spear.

    I'd like to point out that 100% usually includes your head. If you aren't wearing a helmet, you will get the shit shocked out of you. Also, I'd rather neither. How about a sonic pulse to drive them off?
  • SigmalxSigmalx USA Join Date: 2016-07-12 Member: 220132Members
    Sigmalx wrote: »
    Everybody always goes immediately to a stun version of something. You're in a saltwater environment. Saltwater is VERY conductible. It would likely stun you just as much as whatever is attacking you.

    yet there is a shark taser in real life. wetsuits are designed to be 100% insulated. the player is in a confined and 100% sealed diving suit, so it is no issue being electrocuted.
    also, would you rather this or a spear.

    I'd like to point out that 100% usually includes your head. If you aren't wearing a helmet, you will get the **** shocked out of you. Also, I'd rather neither. How about a sonic pulse to drive them off?

    it doesn't take much wattage to dissuade a predator from thinking you are tasty, maybe at most 20 watts. you are thinking kilo or megawatts.
  • SigmalxSigmalx USA Join Date: 2016-07-12 Member: 220132Members
    I would also like to say, most animals with poison or electricity in the ocean, don't have strong enough currents or toxins (save some of the particularity nasty toxins) to ever harm humans.
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    Watts don't kill you. Amps do. Between 100-200 milliamps, ventricular fibrillation of the heart occurs - an uncoordinated twitching of the walls of the heart's ventricles which results in death. Past that point, your chance of survival is actually better. However, at this point, severe burns and severe muscle contractions occur. Your heart can stop during a shock because the chest muscles put pressure on the heart. Internal organs can be damaged at this stage and if you survive, a painful recovery can be expected. A taser is 50,000 volts, but only a few milliamps. Long story short, wattage gets the pulse there. Amperage decides the pain. So a low amperage could keep a predator away, but it would have to be VERY low as to not cause serious harm. As in around 1-5 milliamps, which you will barely feel. Any more and you get severe muscular contractions and pain, which seems rather inhumane to do to a fish who just did as he had always done. As for the "Shark Taser", I've looked at a few examples, and none of them are 100% effective, as well as not shocking the shark, but creating an electromagnetic field/pulse. This is very different then having an exposed electrical current in the water. That's basically what I meant when I said "sonic pulse". Something that interferes with its senses and causes it to leave.
  • SigmalxSigmalx USA Join Date: 2016-07-12 Member: 220132Members
    to be fair, you are in an insulated suit of sorts.
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    edited July 2016
    But you don't always have a helmet or gloves, leaving a considerable amount of area to be shocked.
  • SigmalxSigmalx USA Join Date: 2016-07-12 Member: 220132Members
    edited July 2016
    But you don't always have a helmet or gloves, leaving a considerable amount of area to be shocked.
    if they game doesn't penalize you while in waters colder than 5 degrees Celsius, or waters hotter than 66.79 (hottest I've found)
    5 Celsius = 41 Fahrenheit
    66.79 is 152.2(repeating) Fahrenheit. its hard for me to sleep in temperatures less than 26 degrees Celsius which is a little less or more than 70 degree Fahrenheit

    then the game shouldn't care about the electricity of a shock net. it'd give some credence to amp eels, as their electric organs could be harvested late game for easy batteries and power cells.
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    Sigmalx wrote: »
    But you don't always have a helmet or gloves, leaving a considerable amount of area to be shocked.
    if they game doesn't penalize you while in waters colder than 5 degrees Celsius, or waters hotter than 66.79 (hottest I've found)
    5 Celsius = 41 Fahrenheit
    66.79 is 152.2(repeating) Fahrenheit. its hard for me to sleep in temperatures less than 26 degrees Celsius which is a little less or more than 70 degree Fahrenheit

    then the game shouldn't care about the electricity of a shock net. it'd give some credence to amp eels, as their electric organs could be harvested late game for easy batteries and power cells.

    Well, on the topic of temperature effects, they plan to add those at a later point. Your sleeping habits have nothing to do with what the player character can handle. I for one can sleep in some pretty cold places. Doesn't mean anything here. On the topic of the Ampeels, they use their prongs as electrodes, creating a circuit and providing no reason to harm you unless you get too close and interrupt the circuit, causing the electricity to leap into your body as a detour. This also means that if one thing can shock you, something else can. The Ampeel's prongs are clearly designed to be a better conductor than saltwater, thus keeping the electricity in the circuit. I'm fairly certain that a electrified net made of plant matter would be much worse at conducting, thereby causing the energy to find a better path, into the water, and into you if it were to get close enough.
  • SigmalxSigmalx USA Join Date: 2016-07-12 Member: 220132Members
    synthetic fibers replaced plant fibers, and it was never implied the shock net would use the vines as a conductor, organic matter is rarely a good conductor. you could fabricate some copper wire and prongs be insulated by the plant matter or synthetic rubber.
    a good recipe for this shock net would be
    3copperwire+2silliconerubber+1 battery
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    You never mentioned any synthetic fiber until now. That might work, except that part of it would need to be exposed. The Ampeels have clearly evolved the ability to create a contained circuit underwater. How? I do not necessarily know. I'm no marine biologist. But I do know that if not contained somehow, it would still likely release a burst of electricity into the open water. I refer again to an electromagnetic pulse to confuse a predators senses. They are used today on sharks, and while not 100% effective, they would certainly work better than ANYTHING with an exposed wire/electrode in the water.
  • SigmalxSigmalx USA Join Date: 2016-07-12 Member: 220132Members
    you have forgotten that a lot of fish create a decent bit of electricity, namely the electric eel (har har) who has muscles along their body that causes brief controlled bursts of electricity to stun prey or electrocute non prey

  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    I realize that exists. In the electric eel, some 5,000 to 6,000 stacked electroplaques are can make a shock up to 860 volts and 1 ampere of current (860 watts) for two milliseconds. This level of current is reportedly enough to produce a brief and painful numbing shock likened to a stun gun discharge, which due to the voltage can be felt for some distance from the fish; this is a common risk for aquarium caretakers and biologists attempting to handle or examine electric eels. However, they don't have a field of electricity around them. Do name one fish you know that can generate and sustain electricity in a field around itself.
  • SigmalxSigmalx USA Join Date: 2016-07-12 Member: 220132Members
    The only fish with a current always active, is quiet low is, if I recall correctly, is the oarfish. though the ampeel could be using those prongs to project an internal current caused by movement that would be harmful if it couldn't be released someway
  • ZionExpressZionExpress Join Date: 2012-04-09 Member: 150154Members
    Getting back to the topic at hand...

    I think a net is a good idea and could make for a good early tool for those on survival trying to catch food. Perhaps multiple nets can be combined with beacons or air bladders to create a wall that will catch fish for you or set up a basic perimeter defense. Multiple nets could be combined like pipes to create larger fields of effect.

    For balance, any creature larger than a stalker or sand shark would be only be caught in the net for a short duration before breaking it and setting themselves loose. Smaller fish, like hoop or hole or peepers, would be caught until the player collects the net and/or fish directly.

    As for deteriorating nets.. Not sure this is necessary since they take up a large portion of your inventory (3x3 perhaps) which is enough reason not to carry around a ton in the first place. It makes sense that some organic things deteriorate, like food, but gear like this, especially if it requires a significant investment in time/materials, should not.
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    Getting back to the topic at hand...
    Hey, I'm just trying to take place in a debate with a fellow forum-goer.

    Sigmalx wrote: »
    The only fish with a current always active, is quiet low is, if I recall correctly, is the oarfish. though the ampeel could be using those prongs to project an internal current caused by movement that would be harmful if it couldn't be released someway

    I've seen one sentence based on one account that the oarfish has an electric current running through it. Given it was on Wikipedia, and I've seen nothing else to back it up, I'm disinclined to believe it. I'm not arguing why or how the Ampeel does what it does, I'm arguing that it is QUITE different than an electric eel and/or oarfish.
  • SigmalxSigmalx USA Join Date: 2016-07-12 Member: 220132Members
    hmm, now what. how else could we discuss nets
  • JamezorgJamezorg United Kingdom Join Date: 2016-05-15 Member: 216788Members
    Well, we start off with a small net, and then we can upgrade it by pouring more creepvine samples into it making it bigger and bigger until it can trap bigger things or more smaller things. This would be a good way to collect food on mass, for example, a school of boomerangs or peepers, and maybe a few airsacks.
  • SigmalxSigmalx USA Join Date: 2016-07-12 Member: 220132Members
    edited July 2016
    brilliant!

    and you could make titanium wire nets later as well.
  • ChudovishChudovish Ru Join Date: 2016-07-01 Member: 219418Members
    We already have materials to such upgrase - its sinthetical fiber.

    And propulsion canon can throw such net on significant distances.
  • rkalorkalo Join Date: 2016-07-20 Member: 220493Members
    ooh a net + propulsion cannon....now that would be interesting
  • ChudovishChudovish Ru Join Date: 2016-07-01 Member: 219418Members
    rkalo wrote: »
    ooh a net + propulsion cannon....now that would be interesting

    No, it wont))) Because comments and themes drowning under copy-paste of "brand new" ideas, that simply duplicate some already existing entity on this forum.
    Sad but true...
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    Chudovish wrote: »
    rkalo wrote: »
    ooh a net + propulsion cannon....now that would be interesting

    No, it wont))) Because comments and themes drowning under copy-paste of "brand new" ideas, that simply duplicate some already existing entity on this forum.
    Sad but true...

    I think there are two main problems on this section of the forum. One, people often make a discussion about something without checking to see if its already been posted, which clogs up the forum with 20 discussions about stairs and Cyclops docks and spearguns, when there only needs to be one for each. The other issue I see is some people have some good ideas, but they try to go WAY too big with them, and come up with something that if they really want to see it, they'll have to make themselves, because the devs most likely won't take that huge of a suggestion.
  • rkalorkalo Join Date: 2016-07-20 Member: 220493Members
    edited July 2016
    Chudovish wrote: »
    rkalo wrote: »
    ooh a net + propulsion cannon....now that would be interesting

    No, it wont))) Because comments and themes drowning under copy-paste of "brand new" ideas, that simply duplicate some already existing entity on this forum.
    Sad but true...

    I think there are two main problems on this section of the forum. One, people often make a discussion about something without checking to see if its already been posted, which clogs up the forum with 20 discussions about stairs and Cyclops docks and spearguns, when there only needs to be one for each. The other issue I see is some people have some good ideas, but they try to go WAY too big with them, and come up with something that if they really want to see it, they'll have to make themselves, because the devs most likely won't take that huge of a suggestion.

    i see already in the front page here that people post new threads for their single creature idea instead of keeping it in the creature thread. and in the creature thread in seems that more than a few posts are just images of marine life for inspiration instead of actual ideas
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    edited July 2016
    rkalo wrote: »
    Chudovish wrote: »
    rkalo wrote: »
    ooh a net + propulsion cannon....now that would be interesting

    No, it wont))) Because comments and themes drowning under copy-paste of "brand new" ideas, that simply duplicate some already existing entity on this forum.
    Sad but true...

    I think there are two main problems on this section of the forum. One, people often make a discussion about something without checking to see if its already been posted, which clogs up the forum with 20 discussions about stairs and Cyclops docks and spearguns, when there only needs to be one for each. The other issue I see is some people have some good ideas, but they try to go WAY too big with them, and come up with something that if they really want to see it, they'll have to make themselves, because the devs most likely won't take that huge of a suggestion.

    i see already in the front page here that people post new threads for their single creature idea instead of keeping it in the creature thread. and in the creature thread in seems that more than a few posts are just images of marine life for inspiration instead of actual ideas

    There needs to be some better moderation of this forum. Perhaps some better guidelines for quality posts. Half of the threads here are repeats or would involve way too much work for the devs to add. There is one thread in particular I've been following that doesn't have a bad idea, but it tries to go really huge with it, adding several new game mechanics, flora, fauna, etc. It's a bit ridiculous really. And don't even get me started on the "Keep Terraforming" posts.
  • ChudovishChudovish Ru Join Date: 2016-07-01 Member: 219418Members
    There needs to be some better moderation of this forum. Perhaps some better guidelines for quality posts. Half of the threads here are repeats or would involve way too much work for the devs to add. There is one thread in particular I've been following that doesn't have a bad idea, but it tries to go really huge with it, adding several new game mechanics, flora, fauna, etc. It's a bit ridiculous really. And don't even get me started on the "Keep Terraforming" posts.

    So why we dont create our own system. There are normal people here, we can create specific markers, create a topic about them and up it for newbies dayli.
    Sample:
    [Base] *Idea* - idea about base structures
    [Tool] *Idea* - you know)))
    [Biome], [Creature], [Plant], [Transport], [Seamoth], [Animation], [Protagonist], [Sound], [Bug] etc.

    And combinations:
    [Base][Protagonist][Animation] Harry Potter & Subnautica Hatch Opening
    [Biome][Plant] More trees for ILZ

    That help in searching and may prevent duplication of themes.
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    Chudovish wrote: »
    There needs to be some better moderation of this forum. Perhaps some better guidelines for quality posts. Half of the threads here are repeats or would involve way too much work for the devs to add. There is one thread in particular I've been following that doesn't have a bad idea, but it tries to go really huge with it, adding several new game mechanics, flora, fauna, etc. It's a bit ridiculous really. And don't even get me started on the "Keep Terraforming" posts.

    So why we dont create our own system. There are normal people here, we can create specific markers, create a topic about them and up it for newbies dayli.
    Sample:
    [Base] *Idea* - idea about base structures
    [Tool] *Idea* - you know)))
    [Biome], [Creature], [Plant], [Transport], [Seamoth], [Animation], [Protagonist], [Sound], [Bug] etc.

    And combinations:
    [Base][Protagonist][Animation] Harry Potter & Subnautica Hatch Opening
    [Biome][Plant] More trees for ILZ

    That help in searching and may prevent duplication of themes.

    That would be nice, but I know a lot of people here don't even utilize the tools we have now to make things easier. Its a good idea, but if someone won't even bother to use the quote feature I doubt they'd appropriately tag things.
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