Hull upgrade for vehicles (Late game design)
DragonNoir0
Québec Join Date: 2016-11-27 Member: 224302Members
Québec Join Date: 2016-11-27 Member: 224302Members
Hey guys, I got an idea, it may seem a little big, and maybe it is, but we'll never know if I say nothing, so here: Maybe we could upgrade vehicles hull into different unique variant.
What I mean by that, is the possibility to do an ''upgrade'' upon the hull to improve a unique feature of the vehicle, wich would be permanent.
It's similar to the different arms fonction of the PRAWN, but like I said, much more permanent and specific to felt gameplay.
Remember that only ONE hull upgrade would be available PER vehicle.
Examples for the PRAWN would be :
1. An additionnal exchangeable arm (Gives multiversatility without needing to get outside for modifications).
2. Two additionnal legs for more speed and jump power.
3. An upgraded thruster module (more power and/or capacity).
4. An activable floater, everyone knows WHY.
5. Additionnal floodlights (adapted from the idea of @04Leonhardt )
Examples for the Seamoth
1. A prawn arm module. (Similar to @TheLordEternal idea)
2. Two permanent storage module (rather than a limit of 4 module, a limit of 2 effective module + the possibility of the storage hull upgrade).
3. A Constructor module (that way, the player could construct a base without needing to get out his vehicle, wich further mean you can fully implement the presure system (I remember dying at a depth of 300m once)).
4. A mini-scanner room module (One drone attached with possibility to control it from within the Seamoth. Maybe also allow use of the Seamoth sonar (if equiped) through the drone maybe?). Usefull to scout ahead for threats.
Examples for the Cyclops :
1. Solar hull (Would recharge energy with sunlight, just like solar panel)
2. Thruster module (When activated, double up the speed for a short duration).
3. Vehicles upgrade console module (Would make players go wild thinking ''OMG this can finally be a fully fonctionnal mobile base!!'').
4. Scanner room? (Would use up energy upon use, and could be inside another room, they all have enough space I think).
5. Torpedo bay. (Rather than just adding them straight for no reason. That way, players would have to say ''Yes this is the gameplay I want for myself'')
This is all the module idea I came about for now, I'll edit as more are found, by me or others as well.
I know this can represent a whole new asset of the game, and therefore lot of work, and possibly an equal amount of problems. I would not be surprised if this idea will never be more than an idea, but something in it make me say it is viable.
Such technology would only be to make the player experience more profitable in a way he want. It adds versatility and uttility to every vehicle, as well as more personnality and uniqueness. This would be meant for the later game, and would stay in line with the player evolution over the world.
Such technologie would be found in the deeper zone (where there is actually nothing new to gather/find), wich mean a whole bunch of new fragments.
Also new techlogies mean new ressources, along with the new ''Hull upgrades'', maybe a new tool would be needed, along with new materials too. Those materials could be found in the different biomes of the depth.
I hope this idea inspire you
Edit : I noticed a similar subject from @Lazulazu , here's the link : http://forums.unknownworlds.com/discussion/146218/substitute-for-more-subs-idea#latest
I also disagree with that, those upgrade would indeed change the esthetical view of the vehicle, but I don't see why it should change the interaction with the moonpool. In fact, only an additionnal kind of modification bay console would be needed for both PRAWN and Seamoth. As for the Cyclops, an Upgrade Hull Module could be created via that additionnal bay, then you'd simply need to go inside the Cyclop and place it inside a purpose made "extension hull module device" wich would opperate the upgrade modification (that would be THE extra amount of work...).
Like Lazulazu said, the art team can use the already done models, and just add one new thing per new model. Lot of work all put together, wich mean it would be meant for AFTER 1.0, no stress here, but also lot of new stuff too. And as ever in programmation, same amount of problem. Like I said, the clear advantage over this is the fact it reuse already implemented features and models, limiting to a maximum the effort needed. And for the final point, it wouldn't be "just upgrade modules", it would be "permanent model changing Hull Upgrade Modules"
I'm skipping a bit of the conversation to come to the conclusion point of it.
I totally agree on that point, and like I said, this is just an idea on HOW to implement such things, and therefore, I wouldn't be surprised if this stays nothing more than an idea.
But therefore, this can be, involved the fact that this variant would indeed bring gameplay-wise improving, player-chosen new vehicle variety (while still matching gameplay). It also regroup DrownedOut idea of camera drone, wich is my point number four over the Seamoth.
The upgrades I proposed aren't affecting gameplay too much, they're meant to feel like a specific role buff for vehicles toward player dedicated roleplay, and shouldn't affect the overall gameplay experience. They should ONLY give the player a little feeling of comfort over a specific sphere of his gameplay that he worked on evolving to match his playstyle.
The only fact that really matters me therefore is indeed (back to point number one) the amount of work involved. For that kind of change to happen, the idea must not only be good, it must be possible to do it without struggling over. And there, only the devs themselves can say if wheter or not they can, wish or will do it. Watch my introduction again if you need to recall my position over that. Yup, DrownedOut is right.
What I mean by that, is the possibility to do an ''upgrade'' upon the hull to improve a unique feature of the vehicle, wich would be permanent.
It's similar to the different arms fonction of the PRAWN, but like I said, much more permanent and specific to felt gameplay.
Remember that only ONE hull upgrade would be available PER vehicle.
Examples for the PRAWN would be :
1. An additionnal exchangeable arm (Gives multiversatility without needing to get outside for modifications).
2. Two additionnal legs for more speed and jump power.
3. An upgraded thruster module (more power and/or capacity).
4. An activable floater, everyone knows WHY.
5. Additionnal floodlights (adapted from the idea of @04Leonhardt )
Examples for the Seamoth
1. A prawn arm module. (Similar to @TheLordEternal idea)
2. Two permanent storage module (rather than a limit of 4 module, a limit of 2 effective module + the possibility of the storage hull upgrade).
3. A Constructor module (that way, the player could construct a base without needing to get out his vehicle, wich further mean you can fully implement the presure system (I remember dying at a depth of 300m once)).
4. A mini-scanner room module (One drone attached with possibility to control it from within the Seamoth. Maybe also allow use of the Seamoth sonar (if equiped) through the drone maybe?). Usefull to scout ahead for threats.
Examples for the Cyclops :
1. Solar hull (Would recharge energy with sunlight, just like solar panel)
2. Thruster module (When activated, double up the speed for a short duration).
3. Vehicles upgrade console module (Would make players go wild thinking ''OMG this can finally be a fully fonctionnal mobile base!!'').
4. Scanner room? (Would use up energy upon use, and could be inside another room, they all have enough space I think).
5. Torpedo bay. (Rather than just adding them straight for no reason. That way, players would have to say ''Yes this is the gameplay I want for myself'')
This is all the module idea I came about for now, I'll edit as more are found, by me or others as well.
I know this can represent a whole new asset of the game, and therefore lot of work, and possibly an equal amount of problems. I would not be surprised if this idea will never be more than an idea, but something in it make me say it is viable.
Such technology would only be to make the player experience more profitable in a way he want. It adds versatility and uttility to every vehicle, as well as more personnality and uniqueness. This would be meant for the later game, and would stay in line with the player evolution over the world.
Such technologie would be found in the deeper zone (where there is actually nothing new to gather/find), wich mean a whole bunch of new fragments.
Also new techlogies mean new ressources, along with the new ''Hull upgrades'', maybe a new tool would be needed, along with new materials too. Those materials could be found in the different biomes of the depth.
I hope this idea inspire you
Edit : I noticed a similar subject from @Lazulazu , here's the link : http://forums.unknownworlds.com/discussion/146218/substitute-for-more-subs-idea#latest
DrownedOut wrote: »No need and it would be a truckload of work spent (imo, wasted) on aesthetics. Keep in mind, it's not just the vehicle that'd need to change, but also its interactions with the moon pool (the grabbers), the Cyclops, and the physical upgrades.
I also disagree with that, those upgrade would indeed change the esthetical view of the vehicle, but I don't see why it should change the interaction with the moonpool. In fact, only an additionnal kind of modification bay console would be needed for both PRAWN and Seamoth. As for the Cyclops, an Upgrade Hull Module could be created via that additionnal bay, then you'd simply need to go inside the Cyclop and place it inside a purpose made "extension hull module device" wich would opperate the upgrade modification (that would be THE extra amount of work...).
(Responding to same quote as me) I can see your point, on how this would take a long time. But there are ways around this. One, Keep the models similar, so you don't need different grabber animations, and two, this could be post 1.0 when the devs don't have much more to work on. I still think it would be a nice feature to create the illusion of there being many different subs when no more are really necessary. But if somebody wants a faster seamoth then they can with this feature. The reason i dont think this should just be upgrade modules is because that wouldn't change the model of the sub.
Like Lazulazu said, the art team can use the already done models, and just add one new thing per new model. Lot of work all put together, wich mean it would be meant for AFTER 1.0, no stress here, but also lot of new stuff too. And as ever in programmation, same amount of problem. Like I said, the clear advantage over this is the fact it reuse already implemented features and models, limiting to a maximum the effort needed. And for the final point, it wouldn't be "just upgrade modules", it would be "permanent model changing Hull Upgrade Modules"
I'm skipping a bit of the conversation to come to the conclusion point of it.
DrownedOut wrote: »
To be clear, I'm not against the idea of visual variety itself. It's just that I foresee a whole lot of work to make it work because it's a little more complex than a reskin.
If there's to be more (to) vehicles, my interests lie in gameplay-wise improving what we have and looking into new types of vehicles (and matching gameplay). From the roadmap, I am very interested in silent running and a dock for the Cyclops as well as the addition of a jetpack. I'm on board with scanner abilities for the Cyclops, but I'll already be happy with camera drones to check for resources more elegantly and get a better understanding of where I'm going (tried the Crash Zone entrance to the LZ recently; I had absolutely no view of my route and eventually got stuck). I'd also love to see a lifepod-size boat for surface travel be implemented.
Speed upgrade for any vehicle (horizontal boost for PRAWN) also sounds lovely.
I totally agree on that point, and like I said, this is just an idea on HOW to implement such things, and therefore, I wouldn't be surprised if this stays nothing more than an idea.
But therefore, this can be, involved the fact that this variant would indeed bring gameplay-wise improving, player-chosen new vehicle variety (while still matching gameplay). It also regroup DrownedOut idea of camera drone, wich is my point number four over the Seamoth.
The upgrades I proposed aren't affecting gameplay too much, they're meant to feel like a specific role buff for vehicles toward player dedicated roleplay, and shouldn't affect the overall gameplay experience. They should ONLY give the player a little feeling of comfort over a specific sphere of his gameplay that he worked on evolving to match his playstyle.
The only fact that really matters me therefore is indeed (back to point number one) the amount of work involved. For that kind of change to happen, the idea must not only be good, it must be possible to do it without struggling over. And there, only the devs themselves can say if wheter or not they can, wish or will do it. Watch my introduction again if you need to recall my position over that. Yup, DrownedOut is right.
Comments
If you are going to introduce new shapes of vehicles within the "moonpool" category, the movement of the grabbers and possibly their design needs to be redone to fit the new shape if you care to make it look good. The fact that the PRAWN copies the Seamoth suggests that this is extra work the devs would prefer not to be burdened with.
Just in general, keep in mind that any (significant) physical change of a model extends into a need to also update anything it has physical interaction with. It's not just the vessel that is changed (already a lot of work), but also everything it attaches to.
But I read alot on the Trello page and inside the forum, and it seem they are indeed digging up ideas about how to extend the end game experience and new stuff and objectives to add to the depths, in order to make it both appeiling, and progressive.
I also found out they also are working upon a similir system for the whole base... (Upgrading already built section with deep sea materials to aquire new depth capacity and survivability), so my system also have some constructive points upon that :
- It follows the same "upgrade system" pattern.
- It gives them the asked new materials and later game objectives
- It give them more depth and variant for the player gameplay the further he get into the game
- And it limits the need for new mechanic implementation to a minimum, reusing old ones
They also thik of a new vehicle with a claw, but my idea also cover that point without the need of a WHOLE new model started from scratch (wich also mean new mechanics, bugs, etc).
I like your realism and the fact you force people to invest into "what makes my idea special/worth?" and there you help me define everything around it. Even if this idea isn't chosen, it can be a source of inspiratio for future stuff, so nothing is lost here.
The final question I have upon that subject is wether or not the constructive points are worth the negative ones, or if it would only be a mess, and why. Thanks to everyoe who took time to read everything, and also a great thanks to DrownedOut and Lazulazu for giving their personnal thought on the subject!