Ns_assault
DjArcas
Join Date: 2002-11-11 Member: 8187Members
Join Date: 2002-11-11 Member: 8187Members
<div class="IPBDescription">First pics...</div> Taken using the patented SuperSkulkCam™*
*This means I ran into the JoinTeam2 brush during taking pics... doh
Basic layout - 80% complete
Detail work - 30% complete
Texturing - 40% complete
Lighting - 75% complete
Roughly...
<img src='http://www.sawkins.com/ns_assault/Cafeteria.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
<img src='http://www.sawkins.com/ns_assault/Dropship%20and%20guide%20lights.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
I think I over JPG'd it a bit.. sowwwy. They are gamma-fixed already. About another 20 pics in the same folder at sawkins.com - but I'm only allowed 2 pics per post??? how stupid is that... bah!
*This means I ran into the JoinTeam2 brush during taking pics... doh
Basic layout - 80% complete
Detail work - 30% complete
Texturing - 40% complete
Lighting - 75% complete
Roughly...
<img src='http://www.sawkins.com/ns_assault/Cafeteria.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
<img src='http://www.sawkins.com/ns_assault/Dropship%20and%20guide%20lights.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
I think I over JPG'd it a bit.. sowwwy. They are gamma-fixed already. About another 20 pics in the same folder at sawkins.com - but I'm only allowed 2 pics per post??? how stupid is that... bah!
Comments
otherwise, it looks very nice. You might want to add some drastic shadowing in the cafeteria to cover up the bland HL textures, though.
Picture 2 doesn't look too great i'm afraid. Do you really need that many red lights? I suggest making them func_walls so they won't split up the floor like that, and 4 sided, 1 unit high pyramids work well for those lights. You seem to have some texture alignment problems on the sides of the (steep looking) ramp. What is the bumpy L shaped wall in the middle of the picture supposed to be? hmm?
Nice spacehsip.
It has potential, but really has some problems, I'm too lazy to point them all out though.
Now, I've read what you have to say about the map looking Black Mesa-ish, and I respect that. But I agree with chubbysteve that so far it hasn't been pulled off too well. Although a space station (or whatever) can perhaps be a little less 'industrial', it should at least look derelict... messier. Less 50's-diner-ish. Make some of the lights burnt out... remove a cieling tile. And this <i>is</i> a futuristic mod... where's some tech? A few monitors?
And the HL textures you are using? There's <i>no way</i> you can use them to create an acceptable NS map. Especially HL-specific logos, like the crest and the LAMBDA SIGN!!! If you think using those icky textures is a good idea... well, oh well, I tried. Personally, after years of playing HL and HL mods, if I see another old, overused HL texture, I'm gonna puke.
Also, this forum is used to seeing maps that are based on the NS theme... not to sound dismissive, but what's stopping you from making this an HLDM map? Or perhaps this is just a 'personal' map? Well, you posted the screenies and asked for input. Be prepared to be juxtaposed with ns_bast and ns_eclipse and ns_hera...
You're not a bad mapper... frankly, you could stand some more experience, although I've seen far worse. But your goal with this map needs some clarification... NS? or HL? or something else?
I believe I already offered to make you some new textures... ones that don't scream HALFLIFE! Don't be afraid to take me up on the offer.
Peace.
Now I'm gonna take a page outta BiTMAP's book... firstly, GOD, this isn't HL. Just don't even go there. I see a map like this, my stomach hurts, my eyes burn. Harsh, but true. That black and white tile texture? Just don't go there. Just <b>don't</b>.
You're a n00b, yes, but you can learn. I hope. For the sake of all those who behold your screenies.
The map I see... is 90% crap.
Harsh, but true. Sorry dude.
Confusing, similar looking? <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
*sighs*
Those are just the first two pics in the directory, I tried to post 'em all . The outdoor area is barely finished either... and that l-shaped metal wall is 'something that will be made for skulks to hide behind'
Taken on the red lights tho, I'm not happy with 'em yet. Ditto on the cafeteria - not saying this is finished, more first-pass. Not the two best examples in my map, just the first two I left in <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Let me post some more.
"Now I'm gonna take a page outta BiTMAP's book... firstly, GOD, this isn't HL. Just don't even go there. I see a map like this, my stomach hurts, my eyes burn. Harsh, but true. "
Oh please.
"That black and white tile texture?"
Do you go into many cafeterias? It's black and white tiling or polished wood floor. <i>Sorry</i>, this is the future, I guess the future only has metal floors... <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
3 more.
(you'll notice I'm going down the directory listing rather than in any sensible order... gues you didn't bother <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
<img src='http://www.sawkins.com/ns_assault/Hive%20_1%20-%20Reactor%20Room%20A.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
<img src='http://www.sawkins.com/ns_assault/Hive_2%20-%20Reactor%20B.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
<img src='http://www.sawkins.com/ns_assault/Hive_3%20access%20corridor.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
What I *am* aiming for is a blend of styles in the main building - low security/public area = halflifey, black mesa-y, nice and friendly, open and inviting. Past the high security blocks, you've got dark mettalic corridors, restricted areas, banks of computer.
Fair enough - personally, I don't like all maps to look the same all the way through <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
<img src='http://www.sawkins.com/ns_assault/Hive_3.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
<img src='http://www.sawkins.com/ns_assault/Res_1.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
<img src='http://www.sawkins.com/ns_assault/Prototype%20Lab%201.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
Now thats a cool idea! I have often thought to myself that if people where to live on these spacestations for possibly thier whole life - they would not want large metal pipes and slender, metal hallways everywhere. My only problem with this very good idea is how you pull it off. Your cafeteria looks much too close to a half-life map. Also, most maps dont have any outside area that is accessible to the players. With this in mind, I think you could really save yourself the time, headachs, and pain of trying to do one - just scrap the current outside area you have. If you can make the public area look like NS, then this should be quite a cool map.
Perhaps after the brushwork is done, and I have the time/patience, I'll sort out my own textures.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Also, most maps dont have any outside area that is accessible to the players. With this in mind, I think you could really save yourself the time, headachs, and pain of trying to do one - just scrap the current outside area you have. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, intial playtesting has the outside stuff balanced reasonably well, assuming the aliens manage to twig they can't use their normal tactics outside.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->If you can make the public area look like NS, then this should be quite a cool map.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Most NS maps look like the inside of the working part of an oil refinery - not all of anywhere looks like that.
Aliens *also* wandered around the crew areas, that weren't hi tech - just simple bunks and tables. I'm assuming they also had boring cafeterias, shops, etc...
However, you haven't pulled it off well. I hate to say that as it's verging near being horribly nasty, but it needs some thought of how to manage to a good effect.
As for that first metallic area shot; FAR too much of the same texture.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->However, you haven't pulled it off well. I hate to say that as it's verging near being horribly nasty, but it needs some thought of how to manage to a good effect.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Meh, the cafeteria has only really been touched upon... I'm much more worried about getting the flow of the map correct, then going back and tidying up and polishing once that's done. Whether a room is the most amazing detailed, shadowed and lit room in the world or a simple box with 8 cut and pasted 2-block tables *cough* in it doesn't affect the gameplay, and I've still got another half-dozen rooms to do yet, plus miles more ventwork <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->As for that first metallic area shot; FAR too much of the same texture.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
*glances back*
Hmm, totally agreed. Oddly enough, you never notice it *in* game - I think I might have brought up my gamma too far... but I'll fix that up tonight I think. TBH, I haven't touched that room since I did it first time round.
Picture 1. Looks like a huge empty space for gunning down skulks from a mile off. Using the same texture on walls, floor ceiling AND columns! You're changing that texture right? Looking really rather blocky, could use soem trim brushes around the columns, the edges of the pit and ramps.
Picture 2. Basically the same room busted up and covered in alien textures. Better than the previous one but could use some piles of goop.
Picture 3. Long, long, long corridor with nothing to hide behind. Please don't use the same texture on the floors and ceilings it confuses the Skulks.
Picture 4. Too compressed to tell.
Picture 5. Box with a resource node and some lights. What were they doing with this resource node do you think? Nasty streached texture on the floor.
Picture 6. Makes a good impression. Not sure about the texture on the front of the steps. Is see you've made some effort to put trim around the edges of the pit, but it would be better with trim on the inside edges of the pit too.
I brought the gamma up WAY too much on these pics, they look very washed out and far too bright.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Picture 1. Looks like a huge empty space for gunning down skulks from a mile off. Using the same texture on walls, floor ceiling AND columns! You're changing that texture right? Looking really rather blocky, could use soem trim brushes around the columns, the edges of the pit and ramps.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ah yes... I went back to this tonight, tidied it up, retextured it.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Picture 2. Basically the same room busted up and covered in alien textures. Better than the previous one but could use some piles of goop.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually there are a few, but, yes, agreed.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Picture 3. Long, long, long corridor with nothing to hide behind. Please don't use the same texture on the floors and ceilings it confuses the Skulks.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It does? *frowns* It doesn't rotate the view... <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
It's not actually that long - there's a crossroads half way down that didn't come out at that angle. Tidied it up a touch, added some brighter lights at the cross roads, and a couple of recesses.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Picture 5. Box with a resource node and some lights. What were they doing with this resource node do you think? Nasty streached texture on the floor.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ah yes, the first res node I did, and haven't touched since. Put some work into this, tidied up that stretched texture (HOW THE HELL DID I NEVER NOTICED THIS?), put some trim around the entrance, put some pipes and a junction box in, fix the bad texturing on the light holders.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Picture 6. Makes a good impression. Not sure about the texture on the front of the steps. Is see you've made some effort to put trim around the edges of the pit, but it would be better with trim on the inside edges of the pit too.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You think? *looks*
Hmm, agreed, but oh, those extra polys... <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
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Hey, I asked for everyone's opinions - but they are just that, *your* opinions. I can ignore or agree with them as I wish <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
*pause*
*runs off crying* YOU ALL HATE ME!
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->where's some tech? A few monitors?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You've got one pic of the 'low tech' area - most of the rest of the rooms are functional - no random computers scattered around <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And the HL textures you are using? There's <i>no way</i> you can use them to create an acceptable NS map.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Perhaps... It's a hell of a lot quicker than going *sigh*, loading up PSP, bringing up google image search, and going in search of my own textures. Tho I've got a huge backlog of textures from places I've worked at... maybe I should stop hitting 'browse' and start hitting 'add' <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Especially HL-specific logos, like the crest and the LAMBDA SIGN!!! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If, when I've finished, I decided that I hate them, I'll go and sart creating my own textures to replace them.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Also, this forum is used to seeing maps that are based on the NS theme... not to sound dismissive, but what's stopping you from making this an HLDM map?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
LOL! Nothing. Nothing stops De_dust or ns_hera being an HLDM map.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->You're not a bad mapper... frankly, you could stand some more experience, <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Experience I've got, I'm just a year out of practise mapping at all - and about 2,3 years out of practise HL mapping... damned RL.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->although I've seen far worse. But your goal with this map needs some clarification... NS? or HL? or something else?
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Perhaps not NS per se - some of NS does annoy me - most of the levels have a similar feel - perhaps too similar. I've lost count of the time I've gotten lost going from A to B because the corridors are so similar, or *this* red-lit vent leads to *that* red-lit vent. <b>My</b> main problem is that I can't just have a room for the sake of having a room, and a fitting for it's own sake. I have to rationalise why they're there. Too many things in too many maps exist purely to break up vis - and THAT I am sick of. I think I got off the point there.
What my map is is not 'ns', it's not 'hl' - it's a map designed to be played using the NS strategy system. The map falls into three distinct areas (and I agree that I haven't hit that magic polish level yet) - the outside, and initial assault of the complex - the low security/low tech bright and shiny, polished welcoming areas for visitors, and the guts of the complex, dark and hitech. (with some bits all kharaa-y)
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I believe I already offered to make you some new textures... ones that don't scream HALFLIFE! Don't be afraid to take me up on the offer.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Uh, you did? *scratches head* where?
Adam
Er - where did I say I wouldn't take suggestions? If you'd read what I've written, you'll see that I've followed quite a NUMBER of the suggestions I've been given!
Maybe I didn't say I'd make you some textures... but I'm saying that now <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Question though, how long have you been mapping?
Well.... 10 years on the PC... since the Wolf3d days... started on Doom proper.
I used to put together KickStart levels, so, what, 18 years? <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->