All Your Base

NinjaBurgerNinjaBurger Join Date: 2002-11-25 Member: 9931Members
<div class="IPBDescription">are being moved</div> Every time I've been on a marine team that's moved their starting base (whether to another hive or to another, more secure location), that marine team has won. It seems that the starting base locations are just too darn insecure.

In Nothing, for instance, you've got two long corridors giving Fades plenty of room to duck in, acid bomb, and duck out, and easily spatter mine placements into oblivion, plus that crazy vent in the back (albeit easily welded). Tactic I've always seen work - move the base to Cargo Bay. Now you've got just the one entrance, and the vent in the back gives marines an easy shot at any aliens who try to sneak through. Much more defensible, and a siege can defend three resource points at once. Alternately, I've seen the base relocated to either Viaduct (less successfully) or Power Silo (more successfully, thanks to those high ledges to hide the CC and clever use of phase gates).

On Bast, it seems the best place to move the base ASAP is engine room. Fewer vents surrounding you, and only one easy way in for aliens. Staying in the spawn room is typically suicidal. I've never seen marines move from this base, and I've almost never seen them win this map.

On Tanith, too, the marines never relocate from their base, and yet the situation is quite similar to that on Nothing - two long corridors giving Fades an easy way to acid bomb marines into yesterday. It seems utterly stupid to remain in this room for very long. Much better to pick up and move. Unfortunately, on this map there are no real blind alleys - every room has more than one way in. Best option would seem to be Waste Hive, but even with welded vents there are still two ways in, and Fades can acid bomb through the vents regardless of weld.

Anyone have any other suggestions for places to move the marine base on these or other maps?

Comments

  • The_FinchThe_Finch Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8498Members
    Archiving in Hera and Generator in Caged are both good spots. Unless they're the alien start base, they're easy to move into and defend.

    On Tanith, I like SatCom more then Waste Handling.
  • FlatlineUTDFlatlineUTD Join Date: 2002-11-08 Member: 7695Members
    I don't move my base entirely out of the start, but I do set up a backup base in a secure, easy-to-hold hive. I'd much rather have aliens waste their time taking out a few buildings at my main, knowing that after the CC goes down, I'll respawn in a hive and keep on going. Having a relatively unsecure main base takes the aliens some time to get down, so I think that's better than having them fully concentrate on a single, secure base.
  • Error404Error404 Join Date: 2002-11-19 Member: 9353Members
    edited December 2002
    The best prevention to Onos and Lerk Spore Cloud is to move your base into one of the empty hives. From that point onwards, all you have to do is successfully defend that hive, and the longer you can do that, the more time to upgrade your marines and put them in HA and arm them with HMGs. The kharaa can have 2 hives and still lose, while the marines can have only 1 hive and still be in a winning position.
  • Pi_GiPi_Gi Join Date: 2002-03-16 Member: 324Members
    I wouldn't recommend doing this on eclipse. a)too long b) none of the locations are too secure.
  • Canadianmonk3yCanadianmonk3y Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8465Members
    Never relocate if the aliens spawned in the middle hive.
    For example, if they have Computer Core on Eclipse, do not go to eclipse hive or maintenance, as the skulks can get to the fight for the unnoccupied hive much faster than the marines.
  • GanonnGanonn Join Date: 2002-11-03 Member: 5691Members
    I'd like to see a good strat for Nancy, as it is, I almost always see the 'rines fight over messhall and still lose. Any takers?
  • coldfusecoldfuse Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 3929Members
    I'm not sure the name of the map but the viaduct hive is in it, the marines moved thier whole base into the vents near viaduct and sieged it, but they eventually lost everything else.
  • FlatlineUTDFlatlineUTD Join Date: 2002-11-08 Member: 7695Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Ganonn+Dec 24 2002, 09:38 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Ganonn @ Dec 24 2002, 09:38 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I'd like to see a good strat for Nancy, as it is, I almost always see the 'rines fight over messhall and still lose. Any takers?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I've had a few requests to write a guide for ns_nancy as a followup to my ns_caged guide. If I have the time, I may put one together within the next few weeks.
  • NinjaBurgerNinjaBurger Join Date: 2002-11-25 Member: 9931Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Ganonn+Dec 24 2002, 06:38 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Ganonn @ Dec 24 2002, 06:38 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I'd like to see a good strat for Nancy, as it is, I almost always see the 'rines fight over messhall and still lose. Any takers?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Mess Hall is chosen because it is said to "split the map in half", thus giving the marines control of the entire map. But what's typically forgotten is that Nancy has one of the most lengthy vent systems of any map, and it's possible to move between all three hives without ever leaving the vent system.

    Coupled with the fact that the Mess Hall is quite indefensible (there are 4 ways in, if you count the window), and the fact that the Bridge spawn area is a deathtrap (long narrow tunnel, perfect for splash attacks), it all just screams "take over a hive".

    Best option is probably moving towards the opposite side of the map, towards Port Engine Room hive and Auxiliary command. It's much more defensible, and more importantly, it's a hive. But it is a long, hard run, and it's iffy.

    In any case, the key here is a good solid offense. Falling back on defense will always fail because the Fades can splash the entire bridge without getting hit.
  • GanonnGanonn Join Date: 2002-11-03 Member: 5691Members
    How do you post a quote with the persons name in it?
  • HybriDHybriD Join Date: 2002-12-11 Member: 10631Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Ganonn+Dec 24 2002, 10:19 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Ganonn @ Dec 24 2002, 10:19 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How do you post a quote with the persons name in it?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Click the quote button on their post.
  • ZerglinZerglin Join Date: 2002-12-13 Member: 10754Members
    Eclipse is the easiest to defend on ns_eclipse. You just need to build along the farthest wall at the end and you can then pick off skulks at long range.
  • NickBlastaNickBlasta Join Date: 2002-11-25 Member: 9859Members
    I usually com only on the maps that fit my strategy.. usually eclipse and nothing. I haven't ever relocated my base (except one really stunning game, in which our main base was lost and I rebuilt one in the middle of the hallway by viaduct, and we won)
  • SalamanSalaman Join Date: 2002-11-23 Member: 9711Members
    A good hive to relocate to on ns_nancy is subspace array.
    If you don't weld the vent open, there is only one hallway you need to worry about, and can also deny the mother interface node through sieges. The marines kept us out of subspace hive for over an hour one game, using mass grenade launchers into the hallway, with LMG users and large numbers of turrets gunning anyone down any fade who managed to get past the spam. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
    We finally took them down in one suicidal rush aimed at their armories, we all died, but took both armories out. They hadn't recovered when we re-evolved, returned and took them out at last. <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • CyberfunkCyberfunk Join Date: 2002-11-21 Member: 9488Members
    Actually there are three ways into Subspace Array. One is the hallway. The second is the vent that has to be welded open. The third (and alot of times overlooked) is the vent in the ceiling. Granted even if an alien did evolve to a Fade up there it would be easy pickings. But that doesn't stop a lerk from sitting up there in umbra slowly picking off marines and structures(which I've done on many occasions <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> ).
  • SalamanSalaman Join Date: 2002-11-23 Member: 9711Members
    edited December 2002
    Yeah, a number of us tried lerking in that vent as well, but with little success. The entire marine team was in subspace (we killed everything else they had), so even in umbra, they couldn't stand up to much. Not to mention one of the GL chaps would occasionally get one to land up there. I did assassin skulk attacks aimed at the GL guys, killing a couple, leaving a small window for the fades to attack, but they just picked them back up and kept spamming while the fades failed to take the initiative. <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • x-treme_x-tasyx-treme_x-tasy Join Date: 2002-12-19 Member: 11122Members
    At ns_caged a lot of times I build a defence chamber in the end near the marine base and then turn into a lerk killing the marines and structures with spikes. By the time they get a siege a second hive and a gorg should be in the vent as well and then it's easy pickings.
  • Canadianmonk3yCanadianmonk3y Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8465Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--x-treme x-tasy+Dec 25 2002, 05:12 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (x-treme x-tasy @ Dec 25 2002, 05:12 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->At ns_caged a lot of times I build a defence chamber in the end near the marine base and then turn into a lerk killing the marines and structures with spikes. By the time they get a siege a second hive and a gorg should be in the vent as well and then it's easy pickings.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    And then ONE enterprising marine pops you with a pistol, ruining your day, and all the resources that went to the def chambers, which were taken away from the gorge actually doing something useful at the start goes nowhere when the marine commander just busts out one grenade launcher that he would have made anyway, and the def towers are cleared out... Then the commander is a moron in the first place if he builds far enough out of his little sheltered area that his stuff can be spiked.
  • voodoocvoodooc Join Date: 2002-12-26 Member: 11560Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Rage against the Pepsi machine+Dec 25 2002, 05:08 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Rage against the Pepsi machine @ Dec 25 2002, 05:08 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Yeah, a number of us tried lerking in that vent as well, but with little success. The entire marine team was in subspace (we killed everything else they had), so even in umbra, they couldn't stand up to much. Not to mention one of the GL chaps would occasionally get one to land up there. I did assassin skulk attacks aimed at the GL guys, killing a couple, leaving a small window for the fades to attack, but they just picked them back up and kept spamming while the fades failed to take the initiative. <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Hehehehe, I was in that game. Your name cracks me up.

    I was one of the fool grenade-spamming marines. Man, I kinda felt cheap, but the times I wasn't doing it, Fades were chewing my face off.

    gg

    vc
  • tommy14tommy14 Join Date: 2002-11-15 Member: 8839Members
    <b>best hive options for new human CC base, IMHO:</b>

    Bast : #1 Feedwater Hive, 2 openings easily defended, and the third entrance, water, drowns most. atmospheric nearby for 2 more res easy and 1 res down the ladder shaft. Port Engine Room Hive seems easy to defend, until you look at all the vents. plus little res. Refinery Hive has many attack routes, hard to defend.

    Caged: #1 Generator Hive because it is closer, and more easily defended. but Ventilation System Hive is a close second, with a built in res nozzle - very leaky defenses and further away though. Sewer is too hard to defend, and its resource next door is also hard to defend.

    Eclipse: #1 Maintenance Access Hive because it is most easliy defended and offers easy access to S loop and comp core. it does have a lot of hiding places though. #2 Computer Core Hive. #3 Eclipse Command Hive is just hard to build in or defend long. i have seen a cc base in Eclipse Command Hive go down most often of the 3, usually by getting tied up in the Triad morass. but all are weak in someway.

    Hera: #1 moving CC to Archiving Hive is easiest to defend, but least res. #2 Ventilation Hive is harder to defend, but gives easy control over 2 res - but you are futher from holoroom. #3 Data Core Delta Hive is just plain far away, and leaky, and low res nozzels.

    Nancy: #1 Subspace Array Interface Hive is easiest to defend by a hair. Unnamed (Mother) Hive is leaky (2 doors & 2 vents), but closest to start. Port Engine Room Hive is ok, but a long hike. they are really almost all equally good, and better than the original base.

    Nothing: #1 Cargo Bay Foyer Hive is VITAL to marines. it is worth 3 res nearby, and very easy to defend. usualy i have seen marines lose if this hive is not in possesion. #2 Power Silo Hive is a very distant second choice for a CC relocation.

    Tanith: i have no hive choice. all are leaky, Waste Handling Hive the least because i can in part be welded shut. but i have seen lurks, gorges & Fades shoot thru the gratings. Satellite Communucations Hive is also leaky, and even Fusion Reactor Hive has 2 vents nearby.
    actually the best CC base for this map i have had experience with is Cargo Storage, outside Fusion. while it is leaky, it has 3 doors+the weldable, the doors close on 2; and it gives easy access to Sat Com area, Fusion hive, and the Reactor room for up to 5-6 res.
  • Canadianmonk3yCanadianmonk3y Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8465Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--tommy14+Dec 28 2002, 12:53 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (tommy14 @ Dec 28 2002, 12:53 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Hera: #1 moving CC to Archiving Hive is easiest to defend, but least res. #2 Ventilation Hive is harder to defend, but gives easy control over 2 res - but you are futher from holoroom. #3 Data Core Delta Hive is just plain far away, and leaky, and low res nozzels.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    That one just amused me...
    Data Core Delta being worst for marine relocation? Rofl.
    Build in processing, and marines win the game. Simple as that. (Processing is right outside DCD)
    2 sieges, 2 hives covered.
    Even though there is one RT, you only need to hold that one position...
  • DominatoRDominatoR Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 4105Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Error404:+Dec 24 2002, 11:24 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Error404: @ Dec 24 2002, 11:24 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The best prevention to Onos and Lerk Spore Cloud is to move your base into one of the empty hives.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    How could there be an empty hive if they have Onos and spore cloud?
  • Canadianmonk3yCanadianmonk3y Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8465Members
    Notice the word: <b><i><u>PREVENTION?</u></i></b>
  • DominatoRDominatoR Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 4105Members
    oops. <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • NarfwakNarfwak Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 5258Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS1 Playtester, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica PT Lead, NS2 Community Developer
    On bast, I relocate to engine room or feedwater. Refinery is hard to hold and hard to get to compared to the other two hives. Engine room is the easiest to hold by far, and I take that hive if at all possible.
  • Canadianmonk3yCanadianmonk3y Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8465Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Narfwak+Dec 30 2002, 06:12 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Narfwak @ Dec 30 2002, 06:12 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->On bast, I relocate to engine room or feedwater. Refinery is hard to hold and hard to get to compared to the other two hives. Engine room is the easiest to hold by far, and I take that hive if at all possible.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Moving on bast is just pointless... Marines have to take one (ONE) hive to win.
    Feedwater or refinery.
    As of now, (will be fixed in patch) they can siege engine room hive FROM THE MARINE START.
    If aliens start there, gg.
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