Ha And Hmgs Get Protected Hive?

masterswordman · December 2002

<div class="IPBDescription">joe.to ns server #3</div> Yep, we had 2 hives and one gorg (me). Then al of a sudden came in like 5 HA and HMG marines and distryed fortified viaduct? Well its true. Pic shows a it, and It's very low quality. Forums say no more then tinny winny. Where u see those marines there were 6 off and 2 def.

masterswordman · December 2002

Yes I do, the whole area was also secured, and we also had w3 skulks at cargo. The area was very hard to get through. There was no seige, just they came in and wreaked havoc. You should've seen my score as gorge. Just take a took at all those marines that died when I went gorge, put webs, and then went skulk. Behind ur view were As stated 6 off and 2 def, which I call more then porper def.

MY CONCERN IS THAT THEY DID IT WITHOUT A SEIGE ANYWHERE. They after 3 fades came on the spot, but I could'nt get enough res to build another hive quickly. We ended up losing the game.

AcKz · December 2002

God forbid someone take out a hive without the dreaded siege. Jesus christ man, you just realized how much a group of marines are super strong, congratulations, you're not a virgin anymore. Semi-decent marines with teamwork and grouping can kick anythings **obscenity**, that is all.

Trikk · December 2002

Think of a HA w/ HMG-marine as an unupgraded Onos.

This is how I see it:

Vanilla marine = Gorge
2 vanilla marines = Skulk (when the skulk is in ambush)
3 vanilla marines/Marine with weapon, armor or jet pack = Fade
4 or 5 vanilla marines _can_ kill an Onos
2 HMG/HA or JP marines _can_ kill an Onos

Thus, 6 HMG/HA marines would be like 3 Onos or something. Does a turretfarm have anything to say against 3 Onos? Maybe, if a couple of marines with HMG defends 'em (think of a marine with a good weap as the equal of a fade defending a OC).

Offence chambers are good for tower building, nothing more, when unbackuped. You have bigger chance to kill someone with parasite. OC's are just distraction/delayers.

Catgirl · December 2002

So guys with HA/HMG killed SKULKS and CHAMBERS, and you're complaining?

Uhh...yeah.

El_Diablos · December 2002

a group of that many un-upgraded marines could kill 6 off and 2 def, a bit slower granted but they could still beat it quite easily...

Trikk · December 2002

A lone marine can take out 6 OC's with 2 DC's, it just takes time.

Vash · December 2002

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (El Diablos @ Dec 25 2002, 10:44 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>a group of that many un-upgraded marines could kill 6 off and 2 def, a bit slower granted but they could still beat it quite easily...</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
Yeah, they really shouldnt be able to, but the OC's fire so slow and are completely inaccurate so they are pretty much just big walls to stop them for a few seconds while your buddies come to the rescue. It's pretty sad, as a marine you can stand directly in the path of 6 OC's and crouch and they will all fly right above your head.

Evil_Timmy · December 2002

Ehh, usually 2:1 OC:DC is recommended...but what do you expect? The same thing would happen if you sent five fades into a marine base. With a mass of coordinated attackers, you can expect every defense to fall eventually.

I've found that the best way to build defenses is beyond the corner just a bit; the best way to estimate is to imagine a rectangle stretching from the opposing corners of the turn, then move the defenses that far away. Here's an image to help illustrate:
<img src='http://210.0.163.146/images/ns_cornerbuild.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
The grey boxes are the rectangles, and the Xes are where the defenses should be, assuming the enemies are coming from the opposite side of the corner. The best defense is 5 OCs and 3 DCs, with the OCs in a 3-2 stack, and the 3 DCs back behind. More than that and you're just asking for your resources to be wasted by a siege, less and you won't hold up against more than two LMGers. (This is for a hive defense, not just an outpost; I prefer 3OC/2DC for a resource.)

porp · December 2002

This is really a dumb dumb complaint.

6 OCs is NOTHING to 5 HMGs, never mind the HAs. A single HMG can take out an OC in about 5-10 seconds. You're one of those gorges who goes around spamming OCs thinking it's 'strong defense' with no rhyme or reason, and no awareness of siege locations or the geometry of the level.

Glad you learned your lesson.

Minstrel_Knight · December 2002

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (masterswordman @ Dec 25 2002, 10:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Yes I do, the whole area was also secured, and we also had w3 skulks at cargo. The area was very hard to get through. There was no seige, just they came in and wreaked havoc. You should've seen my score as gorge. Just take a took at all those marines that died when I went gorge, put webs, and then went skulk. Behind ur view were As stated 6 off and 2 def, which I call more then porper def.

MY CONCERN IS THAT THEY DID IT WITHOUT A SEIGE ANYWHERE. They after 3 fades came on the spot, but I could'nt get enough res to build another hive quickly. We ended up losing the game.</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
What the hell? Weren't you banned? And you play in the game with the name of your spyware site?

Defcon · December 2002

Treat OC's as 'early' warning systems and about 10-15 seconds of marine prevention to get your team there to defend them, taking both aliens and OC's out aint so easy.

Building multiple layered defence sure helps, especially against sieges.

Basically, every route in

3 offy towers 2 def / big gap / 3 offy towers 2 def / HIVE
on every route, by the time they've killing the first set of towers, your whole team would have been there to cut them down to the size, they can't take the next layer on there own, making your team lose not a fat lot.

RazorClaw · December 2002

...besides 2 DCs is way too little, you can't really expect a "wall of lame" to even withstand more than 1 or maybe 2 HA/HMG marines if really lucky.

I have to agree this is the silliest complaint I've read in a looong time, 5 HA/HMG marines ought to have killed those defences in less than 30 seconds which they probably did.

GWAR · December 2002

Dont think of Alien offense chambers as defence... more like speedbumps.

UhOh · December 2002

Ronin here and i was in this game and heres my take on it also from the alien viewpoint. We did lose fair and square, the comm was on the ball and strangely his soldiers were following his orders and grouping well. Considering the speed with which the HMG's tore appart our structers and critters i believe they had a couple upgrades in em, that and 3 HMG's firing in unison at the same hallways = lots of dead <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='skulk.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='sad.gif'>

In the 3 games of that time frame (about 2 hours) aliens won one and lost 2, we had a couple good gorges and unfortunately twice as many newbs who were giving gorging a whirl and not listening to the screaming teammates begging them to switch back. Fades are even with Heavies near as i can tell even in the beta 1.04 patch The things not addressed are too many newb gorges and there not being anything for skulks to do after they lose 2 hives and are left with 1 cept hit F4 (same could be said about the marines when they are facing 6 <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tiny.gif'> )

All in all was still a fun game until the marines came to collect our dues with heavy ordinance and that guy from blacklist.net was one of our better gorges it was a pitty he got mad and left after the rush of newb gorges. -Ronin *Skulk Mastah...sometimes*

Teufel_Eldritch · December 2002

HA and HMG's have always been the most powerful personal human element in the game its just that ppl were lazy with the siege before. Why go in with ha and hmg's when the siege would do all the work? Now that the siege requires actual brain power(not much I know but more than b4) ppl are less inclined to use it as often.

Ha And Hmgs Get Protected Hive?

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