<!--QuoteBegin--tlarmon+Jan 6 2003, 03:04 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (tlarmon @ Jan 6 2003, 03:04 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--Hukka+Jan 6 2003, 02:41 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Hukka @ Jan 6 2003, 02:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I tested ns_tanith, ns_bast and ns_hera and pings are pretty good. 30-50 for everyone. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I have 18 player server. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Wait until later in the round. That's when you can really judge a map.
I play NS almost non-stop. It's all I've done for the past couple of months, along with eat, sleep, and work <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> We have played many grounds on those maps.. about 3 hour.. pings stay still 20-25.. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
IMO, this is the most horrible thing a server op can do.
Do you also rip the antenna off your car to make it more aerodynamic?
If you were a pilot, would you peel off the coloring of your Boeing to make it weigh less?
*insert extra metaphores here*
The NS team worked hard on these... Flayra isn't offended because you guys are hacking the official maps, He's offended cause he worked his caboose off on the particle system, and the mappers smashed a handful of monitors with a sledgehammer, because it's so hard making those particles come out right.
Who gave you the right to mess with the way the game runs on your server?
The game is the game... once you start ripping things out, it's no longer NS.
obviously you aren't running a linux server, because pings are horidus.
i would rip the antenna off my car to make it more aerodynamic (because we are going to speed here)
how many funnycars do you see with antenna's? none.
its all about performance tuning and nothing more. Radios, seats, carpet, extra lights, alternators and such make your car look good, but aren't needed when trying to get 7second 1/4 mile runs. now, a 68 cougar w/o a radio, carpet and extralights isn't a 68 cougar anymore?
alot of ppl would disagree and call it a modded cougar, but its still a cougar.
I would love to run the maps unedited on my server, BUT ALOT OF US CAN'T BECAUSE OF USELESS PARTICLES AND AMBIENCE!
fact is, theya re kinda useless, i don't even notice them gone on my server, and neither do the players. so i don't see a big lose.
Not to get into a flame war here... but think of it this way... you're speeding on the highway, but your passengers don't have the radio, they don't sit comftorably, sure the road is less jittery, but all they hear is the roar of the engine, instead of some fine tunes, some of them brought cd's for the ride, but they can't listen to it... that ain't no BMW no more, cause you ripped out the good stuff, now its just another car, me? i'd take the cab.
(Translation: sure, pings are good, but the ambience... ooh the ambience...)
ambience isn't what makes NS, its the teams and the rules of NS.
maps are maps. If i ran only the 11th hour or ns_europa on my server i wouldn't be running NS on my server (according to your statements)
i took out the things i felt to be worthless.
wether it took flayra and the mappers 20 monitors and 400 hrs or 1hr to put in ambient lights, it doesn't matter to me at all. When ppl say "handcrafted" i say, whoop-tee-do.
i'm not going to go so far as to say they're useless. i definitely miss the ambience of bast and especially hera.
the issue is, the maps simply won't run on the server unless i lower the max players. it's not a matter of a 1% improvement, it's a matter of playing the map or not.
to antenna comparison is not accurate. how about, what if the car was fast and powerful, but it only ran on 92 octane gas which you couldn't get. wouldn't you rather have a crappy slow car that at least you could drive?
[WHO]ThemYou can call me DaveJoin Date: 2002-12-11Member: 10593Members, Constellation
edited January 2003
the radio in the car analogy isnt right at all, I don't know any players that join a server to listen to the music.
A better analogy is trying to take people on a road trip in a volkswagon bus(this only applies to linux servers running ns) with all sorts of additions to the vw.
Additions such as gold armor(thick plating that weighs a lot), aerodynamic foils, and a snow plow (just in case). Now, you already know 8 ppl are going on the trip, that much is predefined. But the farking bus wont accelerate at all.
So you take off the snow plow (ambient music).
It'll accelerate, but it maxes out at 10 mph. FOOOOOOKKKK!!!!!
So you take off the aerodynamic foils(ambient lighting).
Up to 20, ****!
So you take off the gold armor(particle systems), and the bus can now get all the way up to 70mph, the caveat is that it is now just a plain vanilla vw bus. (but at least you make it to the concert or whatever)
and as far as flaming goes, DON'T EVEN try to flame until you've tried playing on a 20 person linux server without the mods then playing on the same server with the mods. Windows servers do not apply to this discussion in any way at all.
Well the bottum line here as I see it. AND NO THIS ISN'T A BASH AGAINST FLAYA OR NS!! Is that they left the linux server optimizations till the have more time or whatever to fix the problems. So the linux community must take it apon themselves todo whatever small changes and fixxes we can to make the game playable on linux servers UNTIL such time as they fix the linux server.
It has been stated many times these are temp changes to allow linux admins to run these maps. Not any type of a perm. change. IF the server imbalance issues where addressed right away, these changes by the linux community wouldent be needed.
But until Flaya has the time to fix the linux servers, I will do everything I can to improve the proformance of my servers. And the loss of eye and sound candy on maps, is to me a small price to pay tobe able to run said maps without a 200-400+ ping increase.
I have yet to see anyone complain about ppl making plugins to temporarly patch, say a bug fix until Flay has time to release the fix in another patch. And to my mind anyways, these changes fall into the same catagory.
I also do this on my server.. and you know what.. no has even noticed.. if anything.. I've gotten more compliments about how the pings on my server rock. So if you miss the stuff that I ripped out, find a server that hasn't ripped it out and play on that one. I have more than enough ppl waiting in line to get on my server.
I for one am a big big fan of the ambience in the game.
However... I also like to play my favorite maps, (Bast, Hera, Tanith, and Nancy, in that order.)
As you can see, my options are very limited, and the chances to play ALL DAY on a server running ns_eclipse and nothing else gets... tired.
I have played on Crackerjack Mack's server, and I'm happy to say that I finally get to enjoy the tactical challenge of the maps I like best, with the pings that I also like best. (low ones)
I guess this might be a 'me too' post, but I am more concerned with playing the maps, then being able to do a solo walkthrough on my own server and listen to everything.
Plus, his server's in the same city where I live, so my pings are <30 constantly. Yay! Yay for covert oral!
Comments
I have 18 player server. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wait until later in the round. That's when you can really judge a map.
I play NS almost non-stop. It's all I've done for the past couple of months, along with eat, sleep, and work <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
We have played many grounds on those maps.. about 3 hour.. pings stay still 20-25.. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Do you also rip the antenna off your car to make it more aerodynamic?
If you were a pilot, would you peel off the coloring of your Boeing to make it weigh less?
*insert extra metaphores here*
The NS team worked hard on these... Flayra isn't offended because you guys are hacking the official maps, He's offended cause he worked his caboose off on the particle system, and the mappers smashed a handful of monitors with a sledgehammer, because it's so hard making those particles come out right.
Who gave you the right to mess with the way the game runs on your server?
The game is the game... once you start ripping things out, it's no longer NS.
And pings aren't that much in NS :>
i would rip the antenna off my car to make it more aerodynamic (because we are going to speed here)
how many funnycars do you see with antenna's? none.
its all about performance tuning and nothing more. Radios, seats, carpet, extra lights, alternators and such make your car look good, but aren't needed when trying to get 7second 1/4 mile runs. now, a 68 cougar w/o a radio, carpet and extralights isn't a 68 cougar anymore?
alot of ppl would disagree and call it a modded cougar, but its still a cougar.
I would love to run the maps unedited on my server, BUT ALOT OF US CAN'T BECAUSE OF USELESS PARTICLES AND AMBIENCE!
fact is, theya re kinda useless, i don't even notice them gone on my server, and neither do the players. so i don't see a big lose.
*insert more stupid comments below*
(Translation: sure, pings are good, but the ambience... ooh the ambience...)
And linux servers are useless till 1.04 :>
maps are maps. If i ran only the 11th hour or ns_europa on my server i wouldn't be running NS on my server (according to your statements)
i took out the things i felt to be worthless.
wether it took flayra and the mappers 20 monitors and 400 hrs or 1hr to put in ambient lights, it doesn't matter to me at all. When ppl say "handcrafted" i say, whoop-tee-do.
Ppl wanted better pings, so we gave it to them.
the issue is, the maps simply won't run on the server unless i lower the max players. it's not a matter of a 1% improvement, it's a matter of playing the map or not.
to antenna comparison is not accurate. how about, what if the car was fast and powerful, but it only ran on 92 octane gas which you couldn't get. wouldn't you rather have a crappy slow car that at least you could drive?
A better analogy is trying to take people on a road trip in a volkswagon bus(this only applies to linux servers running ns) with all sorts of additions to the vw.
Additions such as gold armor(thick plating that weighs a lot), aerodynamic foils, and a snow plow (just in case). Now, you already know 8 ppl are going on the trip, that much is predefined. But the farking bus wont accelerate at all.
So you take off the snow plow (ambient music).
It'll accelerate, but it maxes out at 10 mph. FOOOOOOKKKK!!!!!
So you take off the aerodynamic foils(ambient lighting).
Up to 20, ****!
So you take off the gold armor(particle systems), and the bus can now get all the way up to 70mph, the caveat is that it is now just a plain vanilla vw bus. (but at least you make it to the concert or whatever)
and as far as flaming goes, DON'T EVEN try to flame until you've tried playing on a 20 person linux server without the mods then playing on the same server with the mods. Windows servers do not apply to this discussion in any way at all.
It has been stated many times these are temp changes to allow linux admins to run these maps. Not any type of a perm. change. IF the server imbalance issues where addressed right away, these changes by the linux community wouldent be needed.
But until Flaya has the time to fix the linux servers, I will do everything I can to improve the proformance of my servers. And the loss of eye and sound candy on maps, is to me a small price to pay tobe able to run said maps without a 200-400+ ping increase.
I have yet to see anyone complain about ppl making plugins to temporarly patch, say a bug fix until Flay has time to release the fix in another patch. And to my mind anyways, these changes fall into the same catagory.
However... I also like to play my favorite maps, (Bast, Hera, Tanith, and Nancy, in that order.)
As you can see, my options are very limited, and the chances to play ALL DAY on a server running ns_eclipse and nothing else gets... tired.
I have played on Crackerjack Mack's server, and I'm happy to say that I finally get to enjoy the tactical challenge of the maps I like best, with the pings that I also like best. (low ones)
I guess this might be a 'me too' post, but I am more concerned with playing the maps, then being able to do a solo walkthrough on my own server and listen to everything.
Plus, his server's in the same city where I live, so my pings are <30 constantly.
Yay! Yay for covert oral!