Old School Commander

hoju2 · February 2003

<div class="IPBDescription">Old School Tactics</div> I had this great game the other day, where we had a very Old School commander. Instead of rushing for a Hive immediately, we went for a RT, and instead of rushing after that we built a Turret Farm, something I haven't really seen since the first release. We got 2-3 RT's well covered with Turrets and then took a hive and covered that with Turrets too. There was nothing the Aliens could do and we won with little problem. On the servers I play, usually if a RT is capped, the Comm either forgets about it, or has 1 Marine stay and guard it. Either way Skulks will usually tear it apart. With the nerfing of the Phase Gate, you can see other tactics entering the playing field, and its very interesting to watch.

FireStorm · February 2003

old school? hmm.. I'd say strat 0001. But if it works, then it's playable.

MMZ_Torak · February 2003

Yea, last night I was in a game where we had taken Cargo Bay on ns_nothing right away. We then tried to take Viaduct but the aliens were really organised and kept pushing us out everytime. Eventually we got to HA/HMG, but could not get a second hive because they had taken over the rest of the map, but try as they might they couldn't take cargo from us. We had a large amount of res and pretty much could "re kit" all 8 players everytime they died. Eventually the aliens got disheartened and quit. No phase rushes, no turret farming, just plain and simple **** kicking. Lotsa fun.

Zerglin · February 2003

This kind of strategy is more viable in the newest patch for some reason. By the end of the game, marines ALWAYS have made some kind of tech either they have more armor, HA, HMG or most likely JPs!

Redford · February 2003

When I command, I generally use the old school defense and tech approach. I generally try to take 1 hive, and at least 2-4 other RTs, then tech up to HA. Make sure the TFs are well defended, and watch the rescources roll in. I generally go:

Infportal -> Armory -> obs (if my team is smart) else TF (if they are not.) -> Base Phase (if obs) -> Arms Lab -> L1 armor -> L1 weapons -> obs (if not before) else, TF -> Base Phase (if not before) -> Protolab and adv armory -> HA -> L2 armor -> L2 weapons -> L3 armor -> L3 weapons.

At sometime around TF/obs, I will attack the 2nd hive (when building) if possible. at HA, I will activly seek and kill enemy hives until the enemy dies. If I can attack the 2nd hive and take it, the game is won. My marines should be teching up to HA near to that point, and there is little the 1 hive aliens can do aginst HA/HMG combos. If the aliens take the 2nd hive, I turtle, and tech up to HA ASAP. I then outfit a pack of marines and go at it.

Pege · February 2003

I've noticed that teching is really a viable tactic in 1.04. Theres no real point in trying to do a 2 hive lockdown at the start unless your sure your team outskills the aliens 100-0. 1 hive PGed first, a couple of RTs then, motion tracking, arms lab and usually some defense to the central parts of the map (so you don't have to turtle every RT there is). After that, send your team near the enemy hive, set up a PG, a TF, some sentries (because of RTs, you actually get some ress to build stuff...) and then put a siege and use scan to take the hive and its defenses out. You should really place 2 sieges, if your taking a well defended hive down, so they will actually destroy it in a reasonable time. Thanks to the 54 RP fade cost, you don't have to be so uberly fast at attacking the enemy hive, but can put some defense to main base, lose some RTs you capped and still handle the fades with upgraded marines. Sometimes the second hive attack fails, but thanks to the more humane system, that doesn't necessarily mean you've lost (anymore anyway). You can still get well up by giving your marines HMGs, JPs and HAs. One thing that has "died out" of use and should now be taken back is the "Comm, free ress here"-sentence, that people just don't use anymore since they are so busy at getting 2 hives. The game has really shifted from "Get 2 hives as fast as possible!" into "Get as much ress as fast as possible", because with lots of ress, you can give your marines good equipment and defeat fades. Really good direction in my opinion. Now only if people would whine about free ress like they used to... <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'>

saint0z · February 2003

i love the fact that there are different school of comming now (and there all viable), makes the game feel more established ;p

Niteowl · February 2003

yes, the moving of the game into more tech and higher level abilities for the kharaa makes the game FAAR more interesting.

Brett_Erilane · February 2003

The problem with this strategey is that is takes too much time and resources, allowing the aliens to expand. By the time you lock down your first hive, they'll be fades. Maybe it works in the pubs, but the stategey is anything but effective.

Onuma · February 2003

I agree with Erilane (<b><3</b>!! <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'> )

It takes a lot of time and cash to do this - and if you've got the manpower you might as well use it. For a clan match I would honestly not see this as being a great strategy, but on the same note for a pub -- unless you have plenty of clan players who know what they're doing -- the teching thing doesn't work as well. Almost every single time I've commanded in a pub and tried to tech up high, the marines have lost. Sure we may have gotten very close to winning, but just didn't cut it :-( One of the problems is that I don't know who to give a "kit" to unless they have sYn, TAU, or another clan tag on their name that I am familiar with, especially if resources are tight, which is usually the case.

MasterEvilAce · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Onuma @ Feb 1 2003, 09:22 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> I agree with Erilane (<b><3</b>!! <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'> )

It takes a lot of time and cash to do this - and if you've got the manpower you might as well use it. For a clan match I would honestly not see this as being a great strategy, but on the same note for a pub -- unless you have plenty of clan players who know what they're doing -- the teching thing doesn't work as well. Almost every single time I've commanded in a pub and tried to tech up high, the marines have lost. Sure we may have gotten very close to winning, but just didn't cut it :-( One of the problems is that I don't know who to give a "kit" to unless they have sYn, TAU, or another clan tag on their name that I am familiar with, especially if resources are tight, which is usually the case.

you should focus on
- Getting resources
- Getting hives
- Getting upgrades

usually in that order, is a good order to follow  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
Don't focus on one thing as a commander.

Resources is what you need as marines.
Get as many as you can, and get a hive

SOMEPEOPLE like to get a hive *FIRST*
let me say this is a bad idea, in some respects

As to get to a hive, you usually pass 2-3 resource towers to get there. And because of the walking time, you could have made a res tower, and gotten res while you walked to the hive... and when that hive gets attacked, you will be RUSHING to the hive, and completely forgetting about the resource towers, as you walk by them. this is time they could be using to get resources.

DON'T build every building just because you can build it.
1 IP, armory
go for some resource nodes, and have somebody guard the base (make sure they are good, preferrable one of the best on the team)

when you get enough resource towers up, go get the closest hive, plop up phase gate at the hive, plop one in base (ah, those defenders are useful, eh?) build a TF, and turrets so the guys at the hive have "something to do" and don't wander off

drop an OBs (you'll be getting like 5res/tick *atleast*.. as the aliens don't focus on (usually) destroying resource towers at the beginning), and have the defenders build it

at this point you can tell the marines to get some more resource towers, and possible another hive, or atleast guard it to keep the aliens at bay while you upgrade motion tracking, and get an arms lab

whenever you have a little extra resources, go for the upgrades in the arms lab! (BUT DO NOT FOCUS 100% on them. if you upgrade once you get enough resources, then be sure you're getting a lot of resources, because if you lose a TF or something at a hive.. you're in deep if you can't rebuild it fast.

just keep pushing, and if the aliens get a second hive, upgrade the armory, if you get the second hive, then fortify it.

You should be getting a lot of resources.. you can setup turret farms around certain areas to hold off the aliens.. or even a turret farm in the marine base (good idea if you have 2 hives)

just keep in mind that you SHOULD upgrade whenever possible... if you have 100 resources, use them (but not all, as medpacks and ammo spam can be good)

Usually, whenever i play with my clan in a pub, (especially true for NS_NOTHING).. i'm usually the base defender (it IS a good job, and very important) once we get a hive, a few upgrades, and a TF and turrets in base to guard everything and i'm not really needed, i'll go around (sometimes with shotty, jetpack, whatever) and run to resource spots, and just tell the commander to cap the resource node. whenever one dies, i rebuild it. I'll weld anything i run into, and even ask for a siege if the aliens have a WoL blocking off a certain spot

at the end of the game, we usually have a ton of resources, and we just all go to main base, equip up, and kill the remaining hives / aliens

it's a good strategy because the aliens usually never suspect somebody else is creeping around, they're usually busy attacking certain key points that the OTHER group of marines is trying to hold.. and you're free to cap res points

NS_Nothing is the best map for this, because of all of the resource points that the aliens run into (that you'll usually have)

Generator, Docking wing (and res node out side of docking wing) are run into a lot by aliens, and will usually need rebuilt. cargo bay's 3 nodes will get attacked, but usually not killed in time

NeoMatrixj2 · February 2003

When i'm an alien i tend to run around looking for ppl that may be wandering or if i can i take out a hive while the marines are busy. The 54 cost on fades now sucks most of the time if the marines have a good comm. cause usually by the time a couple of ppl go fade we lose one of the hives.

Zerglin · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Brett Erilane @ Feb 1 2003, 09:09 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> The problem with this strategey is that is takes too much time and resources, allowing the aliens to expand. By the time you lock down your first hive, they'll be fades. Maybe it works in the pubs, but the stategey is anything but effective.  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
What? Too much time and RESOURCES? The point of teching is to get mucho dinero, homie. Your estimates are off by a mile, by the time you have one hive the aliens have fades? Riiight.

Talesin · February 2003

Besideswhich, most semi-intelligent Alien teams play the resource game. Yes, a good chunk of their people are attacking/annoying the Marines while the Gorge builds up.. but on a 16-player server, two of the seven Skulks are assigned to RT-chomping detail. Marines have it pretty easy on the resource game.. with a communal pool, they can afford to only keep two or three RTs and still tech up to a reasonable level early in the game. Keeping those RTs down (and the 22RP gone) is one of the most important tactics in the early game, if you don't want to deal with a HMG/JPer within fifteen minutes, with a good Comm in the CC. And with the removal of donation (which is NOT the resource exploit), it's already extremely difficult to get a Hive up in that amount of time, even with only one Gorge. Especially so if you decide to get a Lerk going to snipe down safe spots in any turret farms that might sprout.

KMO · February 2003

The cheapest way to stop resource chomping is to drop a pack of mines around each RT. It just needs someone to pick them up at the armory, and get them to the RT, which is the only thing which might be hard to arrange on a pub - marines like mining doors.

Maddok · February 2003

100-0 skill factor on aliens to hold 2 hives? neh. if you can get 2 cs players at 1 hive and 1 at another the aliens wont be able to reach <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'>. basicallly what I'm saying is, the marines have the most important thing in the world. first strike capability. they have bullets that go farther than their teeth from the beggining of the game to the end. do NOT get me wrong. this would never work with incompetent marines (pubs) or if the aliens actually used some teamwork for once... in which case the hive can still be taken back after the other is secured with a turrent farm.

/me doesn't like going deep into tactics discussions because he is the evil clan communist "we-might-give-something-away-to-the-others-that-they-might-not-have-thought-of-5000-times" type <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'>

<img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'>

watch_me_die · February 2003

A really workable strategy now is to plant as many R towers as you can, upgrade to Jetpacks and HMGs and then all rush the alien hive. This works best in small (6v6) clan games, and it seems to be used often in the tournament we're holding. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'>

Old School Commander

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