<!--QuoteBegin--rebo+Feb 21 2003, 07:21 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (rebo @ Feb 21 2003, 07:21 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> You obviously play on newbie servers Ackz, every good player knows carapace is for the unskilled who arent good enough to use advanced hive site to singlehandedly win whilst simultaneuosly standing on their heads and singing the latest Britney spears single. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I can't detect sarcasm on the internet, and I don't know who you are. But if you're serious, please shoot yourself.
Ok, its starting to degenerate slightly, but in response to the original post - do you really want to play on a server where the admin bans people for not building in the order they want?
Ok, maybe the team wanted cara first (plenty do, but thats not the issue) and dropping sensory was a mistake, but even so, a warning, an admin slap, or maybe even restarting the round if a consensus was reached would be better options. An outright ban is the equivalent of taking your ball home...... <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
As has been said before, we only have half the story. Unless the admin came forward with his side of the story, it's not much use speculating on what might have happened. It's only human nature that this guy who was banned is going to 'sugar coat' his story to get sympathy.
Minstrel_KnightThe truth and nothing but the truth...Join Date: 2002-11-21Member: 9562Banned
<!--QuoteBegin--MonsieurEvil+Feb 20 2003, 08:50 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MonsieurEvil @ Feb 20 2003, 08:50 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Winning is everything, and having an interesting or fun experience is secondary. This seems to be the dominant argument here. Bleh. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Winning is fun.
<!--QuoteBegin--AcKz+Feb 21 2003, 06:42 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (AcKz @ Feb 21 2003, 06:42 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I would have banned you too. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> You people banning for these kinds of offenses are immature. It's your server, you have a right to do what ever you want on it. But don't complain, and sit back and wonder why my server isn't full; when it's just you and your admins left to play.
My ban list is very very very small. I have banned a total of 2 people. Maybe because of our admin policies is why our servers (all 3, 22 slots) stay full all day, and all night.
I've heard, "I don't play on modded games." However, I noticed you playing NS; which IS a modded game. Secondly, people who claim they don't like playing modded games; are really people that don't like change, or learning something new; basically CLOSED MINDED individuals.
This is just a fact of life: learning is a good thing, and you can't learn with closed minds.
Offense Chambers, on any server (but especially on voogru servers) is one of the best to start with. The traditional (and I've heard that term used) Defense/Movement/Sensory priority list is just fine. However, Sensory/Movement/Defense last *CAN* and *DOES* make a lot of sense.
If you are interested in how the Sensory Chambers are used at our server, feel free to stop by and see for youself.
It's not really a counter. It's merely a window of opportunity to deny the marines however much res. It would be a counter (albeit a weak one) if you needed the observatory to remain active for MT to work; otherwise, it's a matter of luck. As you say, there's no way to tell if they're researching MT. Saying, "Quick, team, they...<i>might</i> be getting MT!" lacks the punch needed to rally and lead your fellow skulks into a base assault. Even more so when those pesky fleshbags are trying to secure the empty hives.
If you fail to prevent the research, then you're (pardon my French) <b>buggered</b> without defense upgrades. Until this changes, DMS is set in stone for most people. When/if silence negates MT, MT has limited range, walking negates MT, sensory chambers negate MT, MT is something that has to be carried by a marine, or a combination of the above, <i>then</i> defense upgrades are less vital. Until that happy day, though, people will plump for defense.
Once again this thread has gotten more off track than a drunk man on a blind mule. It's not about the viability of Sens first, it's not about how leet (yea right) it is to mod a mod. It's not about admin abuse. It IS about getting half a story from someone who has yet to come back and say anything in his defense (hmmm griefer?), and the responsibility the Admin has to keep the majority of people on the server happy and protect it from lamers. The people who half read the posts and say "banning for building sens is admin abuse" need to spend some time as an admin and watch the llamas try and tear down the games. I wind up spending more time policing the game as a spectator at times than playing. Do not base your judgement on half a story.
As far as Sens first, a skulk without Carapace lacks base cracking ability. A hive without DC's lacks healing necessary to stop JP/HMG rushes. OC's with out DC's backing them are merely speed bumps.
I try to be as fair as possible but people do not behave themselves even when they know the admin is on. They seem to think they have one free ticket to be lame (what no warning?) Consider this your warning. Lameness (build sens and quitting, build sens on Res Nodes and quitting) will get you kicked at the very least, and, at least a temp ban so I can play a game with out having to constantly watch to see if the lamer has rejoined, this time the marine team so he can spam CC's and IP's in marine start. Then he can come here and say:
Sensory can work against marines who attempt to secure two hives. It CAN work against marines who attempt to res rush.
HELL it CAN work against the marine team who hole up in their base tech to jp and JP/LMG rush you're hive.
The problem is the chances of it workin in any of these situations is LOW.
In one of the above situations it does you absolutly NO GOOD WHAT SO EVER.
While I personally find sensory fun to play with and definatly a worthwhile interesting diversion. I wouldn't suggest ANYBODY forces it on their team because thats all it is against an equally skilled marine team, an interesting diversion.
As for 'marine teams won't have MT befor the 2nd hive' I can happily state that on my watch they DEFINATLY will.
If its not a newbie server, if its a server where the marine team WILL be organized, WILL go 'ho look they've got sensory first hehehe, lets JP/LMG rush them guys that'll be a laugh'.
and IF the gorge just randomly built sensory without asking any of the team if they wanted to play an 'interesting diversion' then hell I'd hope you get banned.
banned for sensory..... that is lame. i maybe build carapace first too but that is only if they ask, if someone says sensory before carapace i build sensory, that's the way it goes and if you don't like it then whine all you wan't, but remember: MY WORK IS BASED ON ORDERS! and besides ididn't request the damn thing. a gorge is not a commander, but a slave. he just gets bossed around by skulks who constantly say things in 1337 or brits who use voicechat. and they say: G3t T4 H1V3 PUD9Y and someother guy says: N0 D3WD G3T 4TM0SPH3R3 PR0C3SS1N9 W3 D0NT N33D 4 H1V3. and at this point a brit voichat says: WE NEED DCs. and plz tell us the whole story, i can't draw a conclusion out of this. i know there are crappy admins out there(mostly clanners who receive a dent in their ego) but that you are one of those lamers who screws games up is also a probability or perhaps you were a newbie player.
<!--QuoteBegin--MMZ>Torak+Feb 21 2003, 10:13 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MMZ>Torak @ Feb 21 2003, 10:13 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Do not base your judgement on half a story.
As far as Sens first, a skulk without Carapace lacks base cracking ability. A hive without DC's lacks healing necessary to stop JP/HMG rushes. OC's with out DC's backing them are merely speed bumps. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> while you cant exactly base your judgement on half a story, and I would be inclined to agree with you if you banned him for doing what you said he did, you must realize, its really the team that makes the upgrade, not the other way around....... if you dont mind me harkening back to one of my fabled games, ill tell you a short story about a n00b gorge, a good gorge, and a really long game...... here we go ^_^ well, here we are, newly spawned in, and as per the usual, I say ill go gorge. BUT! today is not like any other day, as some n00b claims he called gorge first, and demand I go back. Me, being the experienced gorge, (think I am BSing? just TRY to get past my WOLS) kindly ask him not to, and continue on with my job. While I sit there, get my res, slowly but surely, he waddles over, and tried to build a sense on top of me..... he missed... the team gets really **** at this, and demands to know who did it, to which the n00b says I did, and I said he did. Well, we tried to kick the n00b there, but the marines were being @&#^ers, and he survived. I contine on, with him constantly trying to stop us from winning at every corner, and we lose one hive. We quickly secure a hive, and get up D chambers. the n00b was building towers on people, building em on ladders, and all the while trying to get me kick voted. Well, we get two hives, go fade, and eventually beat the marines...... SO! in summary of that long tale, if your team sucks, it wont matter how much defense carapace gives, they will die. but if a gorge wants to build sense on res points, or builds em when the whole team dosnt want them, then ill agree, get rid of em ok I am done now ^_^
I feel your pain sir <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
I'm sorry, but myself and many others view a gorge getting sensory first against his entire team's wish in the same way that we view a T tossing the bomb in an unreachable area in CS: an obvious griefer. Obvious solution the problem: kick/ban.
<!--QuoteBegin--AcKz+Feb 21 2003, 02:20 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (AcKz @ Feb 21 2003, 02:20 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I like your style! I would ban you too. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> An admin after my own heart!
I know this discussion has begun degenerating into the "admin suck" on one side and "players suck" on the other.
I have banned people for sensory, and will continue to do so. However, I've also played games where we (the aliens), have agreed to sensory first as a change of pace. Key word: agreed.
Sensory/Cloaking is quite easily defeated with the single upgrade of motion tracking, while Defense/Carapace takes multiple upgrades of the armslab to counter. This can give the alien side much needed time to secure the 2nd hive and prepare defenses.
If I'm on the marine team and suddenly 6 messages fly up the screen "XXXXX made a sensory chamber! We're screwed!" Admin_ban. Its typically either a grief player, or some guy that decided to go Gorge and ignore the rest of his team as they scream at him to get off. Either way, its annoying and disruptive. All 3 of my servers are full except early morning so I assume I'm not out of line. And if I was, and my servers were empty? It would be a load off my day to shut them down. Running servers is not particularly cheap and tends to be quite time consuming.
Defence chamber is the standard. Defence chamber benefits the team greatly.
If your going to break the normal routine, then ask your team first.
If you just build a sensory without asking, breaking the normal and effective upgrade order then you should be kicked or banned becuase you have just performed an act that is against the wishes of your entire team and most often crippling to your teams chances of winning.
Well played to all the admins that would ban these people as the times ive had this happen there have been no admins around and weve had to put up with a losing game from the start.
I'll add my 2 cents to the side and agree that sensory first is a tactically inferior choice. If you want to do it 'for fun', that's fine. However, just because it is 'fun' doesn't make it the best choice.
I think people have covered all the reasons why sensory chambers is not a good first chamber. My thoughts in brief are:
-Sensory chambers will not heal other chambers/towers/hives/aliens -Sensory provides no counter to motion tracking, and as such MT negates any real advantage -The CLOAK function of Sensory is not 100% and thus -The LACK of carapace makes skulks easier to kill. Only 9 shots from an unupgraded LMG, 5 shots from a pistol/HMG, 4 shots from a turret, or 1 grenade. Level 3 carapace will provide nearly double the protection.
The BIGGEST reason is that sensory is a one shot deal.
-If you go sensory and you do NOT secure a second hive, and the marines get into the other two hives and turret them up, you are LOST. That's it, game over.
The problem being that as the game progresses the marines get ammo/armor upgrades that make a non-carapace skulk so easy to kill it's not funny. When the marine has doubled his armor and increased his weapon damage by 50%, you'll be kicking yourself as you get picked off.
Even if you do get second hive up, you are stuck without adrenaline (if you choose D as second chamber) and that means all fades/lerks are gimped and cannot atack effectively. If you choose movement as second chamber then you have adrenaline but NO redemption and that means your 54 res fades will get smoked. I'll trust that when Flayra says he wants to make the chambers equally viable that we'll work on this.
Yeah going sensory first can be fun if you want to lose.
<!--QuoteBegin--kInG kAhUnA+Feb 20 2003, 10:43 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kInG kAhUnA @ Feb 20 2003, 10:43 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--burkeout+Feb 20 2003, 05:25 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (burkeout @ Feb 20 2003, 05:25 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> it's true I was in a server the other day and built a sensory and got banned. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> WOW, sensory chambers are best if built first. Well on our servers it is.
Our sensory chambers at voogru; not only cloak the aliens, but the aliens structures; like O & D chambers. They appear to be totally invisible to the Marine. It's hot.
Click the link below for more information about it:
admins "can" do whatever they want too but manipulation, as I call it, and then constant pimping of the "specialties" of the server through some server promoting link is well...
Well, I recently played a game with sensory first and still won. It was on ns_bast, we were doing well without upgrades in the beginning (gorge was going for res first). While the gorge was collecting res, we shredded the marine start, CC, IP, armoury,... Eventually they were down to one guy and no base, so I suggested sensory chambers to track down the last one quickly. the team did not seem very pleased when the marines started respawning in atmospheric <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
But we still won. The resource loss of their first base getting ripped to pieces by our rush delayed them, despite getting the double res. By the time they were strong enough to try an attack on us, refinery was done (def+sens now), feedwater was hit by skulks (the defense wasn't perfect and the tf died quickly), followed by a few fades for cleanup. We got three hives in the end, though the adrenalin wasn't absolutely necessary. By the time we got that, it was just an aid in cleaning up.
Defence is the most effective starting chamber by a significant margin. If you ignore this and place a sensory, you are not taking the game seriously. Teams that screw around and do not play seriously are a fact of public play, but individual players that force their team into this style of play are disruptive.
Dropping a sensory chamber is not equivalent to a comm who doesn't hand out HMGs, it is equivalent to a comm who decides to make a pretty looking tower out of command consoles in the middle of the marine start. Do that without the consent of the marine team on a server i have admin to and i'll ban you, do that <b>with</b> the consensus of the marine team in a game where i'm playing aliens, and i'll find a more mature server.
posting a single instance where sensory has won a game is useless. i'm almost 100% certain that in a mass sampling of games that are won when sensory is built first, the percentage would be VERY low.
i play gorge a lot, and on the server i admin on, i ALWAYS go defense chamber first (unless the team wants a sensory just for fun). why do i go defense chamber first? well, the regulars of the server LOVE sending a gorge/RT hunter out right off the bat. the skulks usually eat this hunter until i can get my 2nd RT up. i then proceed to build a defense chambers (3) near the next RT i want to cap (usually in the hive i want). i get carapace and hang around the DCs. 'lo and behold, the gorge hunter comes in and opens fire! no carapace/DCs nearby = a dead gorge. a single gorge can EASILY hold their own against a marine, even TWO marines... IF they have carapace and some DCs nearby. just use the DCs as cover, constantly heal them when they get shot.
sorry, but no sensory upgrade will save my hiney from a situation like that.
To be honest, it is equally possible to win given any combination of chambers. All it requires is a shifting of tactics.
Of course you are going to lose if you keep trying to skulk charge with only a sensory chamber. But instead why not cloak in hallways near the marine base and use a little thing called patience and wait till marines walk by then bite their spines. (just one of the many tactics that make sensory first work)
If your team has any amount of talent or skill, the order of chambers will not matter (though there are always some advantages to a certain order depending on the marine play style) The fact remains that changing circumstances require different tactics.
I have been on numerous games where sensory was the first or second upgrade. We did not get rapped as one blinded whiner said over the comm 400 times. In fact, my team adapted to the new style and went on to completly destroy the marines even though we never even got the third hive till the last minute of the game.
If some people took the time to stop whining about a sensory chamber being placed out of order and instead took the time to learn new tactics for such an arrangement, they would be whiping the floor with marines who only play expecting the same tactics from the aliens time and time again
It has already been explained exhaustively how "skill" and "shifting of tactics" will not change anything to the fact that a decent marine team will completely negate any advantage cloaking might give, even in the early game. A good marine team moves together, not seperately. To prevent ambushes, a good comm will scan ahead. That makes cloaking completely useless. Besides, why do some people make it sound like ambushing is a cloaked skulk exclusive? With carapace, you can ambush too, and you'll actually have a helpful upgrade once the fighting begins and the bullets start flying.
Losing can still be fun if it was a good game. Losing or even winning (if you're a marine) because a gorge decided to cripple his team is not.
Comments
I can't detect sarcasm on the internet, and I don't know who you are. But if you're serious, please shoot yourself.
Ok, maybe the team wanted cara first (plenty do, but thats not the issue) and dropping sensory was a mistake, but even so, a warning, an admin slap, or maybe even restarting the round if a consensus was reached would be better options. An outright ban is the equivalent of taking your ball home...... <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
Winning is fun.
You people banning for these kinds of offenses are immature. It's your server, you have a right to do what ever you want on it. But don't complain, and sit back and wonder why my server isn't full; when it's just you and your admins left to play.
My ban list is very very very small. I have banned a total of 2 people. Maybe because of our admin policies is why our servers (all 3, 22 slots) stay full all day, and all night.
I've heard, "I don't play on modded games." However, I noticed you playing NS; which IS a modded game. Secondly, people who claim they don't like playing modded games; are really people that don't like change, or learning something new; basically CLOSED MINDED individuals.
This is just a fact of life: learning is a good thing, and you can't learn with closed minds.
Offense Chambers, on any server (but especially on voogru servers) is one of the best to start with. The traditional (and I've heard that term used) Defense/Movement/Sensory priority list is just fine. However, Sensory/Movement/Defense last *CAN* and *DOES* make a lot of sense.
If you are interested in how the Sensory Chambers are used at our server, feel free to stop by and see for youself.
<a href='http://forums.voogru.com/showthread.php?threadid=1665' target='_blank'>http://forums.voogru.com/showthread.php?threadid=1665</a>
The following link above can help give you an idea of our stradigy.
It's not really a counter. It's merely a window of opportunity to deny the marines however much res. It would be a counter (albeit a weak one) if you needed the observatory to remain active for MT to work; otherwise, it's a matter of luck. As you say, there's no way to tell if they're researching MT. Saying, "Quick, team, they...<i>might</i> be getting MT!" lacks the punch needed to rally and lead your fellow skulks into a base assault. Even more so when those pesky fleshbags are trying to secure the empty hives.
If you fail to prevent the research, then you're (pardon my French) <b>buggered</b> without defense upgrades. Until this changes, DMS is set in stone for most people. When/if silence negates MT, MT has limited range, walking negates MT, sensory chambers negate MT, MT is something that has to be carried by a marine, or a combination of the above, <i>then</i> defense upgrades are less vital. Until that happy day, though, people will plump for defense.
As far as Sens first, a skulk without Carapace lacks base cracking ability. A hive without DC's lacks healing necessary to stop JP/HMG rushes. OC's with out DC's backing them are merely speed bumps.
I try to be as fair as possible but people do not behave themselves even when they know the admin is on. They seem to think they have one free ticket to be lame (what no warning?) Consider this your warning. Lameness (build sens and quitting, build sens on Res Nodes and quitting) will get you kicked at the very least, and, at least a temp ban so I can play a game with out having to constantly watch to see if the lamer has rejoined, this time the marine team so he can spam CC's and IP's in marine start. Then he can come here and say:
Banned for building a CC.
Banned for playing the game.
Banned for having fun.
It CAN work against marines who attempt to res rush.
HELL it CAN work against the marine team who hole up in their base tech to jp and JP/LMG rush you're hive.
The problem is the chances of it workin in any of these situations is LOW.
In one of the above situations it does you absolutly NO GOOD WHAT SO EVER.
While I personally find sensory fun to play with and definatly a worthwhile interesting diversion. I wouldn't suggest ANYBODY forces it on their team because thats all it is against an equally skilled marine team, an interesting diversion.
As for 'marine teams won't have MT befor the 2nd hive' I can happily state that on my watch they DEFINATLY will.
If its not a newbie server, if its a server where the marine team WILL be organized, WILL go 'ho look they've got sensory first hehehe, lets JP/LMG rush them guys that'll be a laugh'.
and IF the gorge just randomly built sensory without asking any of the team if they wanted to play an 'interesting diversion' then hell I'd hope you get banned.
BlueGhost
and besides ididn't request the damn thing.
a gorge is not a commander, but a slave. he just gets bossed around by skulks who constantly say things in 1337 or brits who use voicechat.
and they say: G3t T4 H1V3 PUD9Y and someother guy says: N0 D3WD G3T 4TM0SPH3R3 PR0C3SS1N9 W3 D0NT N33D 4 H1V3. and at this point a brit voichat says: WE NEED DCs. and plz tell us the whole story, i can't draw a conclusion out of this. i know there are crappy admins out there(mostly clanners who receive a dent in their ego) but that you are one of those lamers who screws games up is also a probability or perhaps you were a newbie player.
As far as Sens first, a skulk without Carapace lacks base cracking ability. A hive without DC's lacks healing necessary to stop JP/HMG rushes. OC's with out DC's backing them are merely speed bumps.
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
while you cant exactly base your judgement on half a story, and I would be inclined to agree with you if you banned him for doing what you said he did, you must realize, its really the team that makes the upgrade, not the other way around.......
if you dont mind me harkening back to one of my fabled games, ill tell you a short story about a n00b gorge, a good gorge, and a really long game...... here we go ^_^
well, here we are, newly spawned in, and as per the usual, I say ill go gorge. BUT! today is not like any other day, as some n00b claims he called gorge first, and demand I go back. Me, being the experienced gorge, (think I am BSing? just TRY to get past my WOLS) kindly ask him not to, and continue on with my job. While I sit there, get my res, slowly but surely, he waddles over, and tried to build a sense on top of me.....
he missed... the team gets really **** at this, and demands to know who did it, to which the n00b says I did, and I said he did. Well, we tried to kick the n00b there, but the marines were being @&#^ers, and he survived. I contine on, with him constantly trying to stop us from winning at every corner, and we lose one hive. We quickly secure a hive, and get up D chambers. the n00b was building towers on people, building em on ladders, and all the while trying to get me kick voted. Well, we get two hives, go fade, and eventually beat the marines......
SO! in summary of that long tale, if your team sucks, it wont matter how much defense carapace gives, they will die. but if a gorge wants to build sense on res points, or builds em when the whole team dosnt want them, then ill agree, get rid of em
ok I am done now ^_^
that some people have had similar experiences.
im takin it further, and i think i can safely say he's banned his last bojo.
An admin after my own heart!
I know this discussion has begun degenerating into the "admin suck" on one side and "players suck" on the other.
I have banned people for sensory, and will continue to do so. However, I've also played games where we (the aliens), have agreed to sensory first as a change of pace.
Key word: agreed.
Sensory/Cloaking is quite easily defeated with the single upgrade of motion tracking, while Defense/Carapace takes multiple upgrades of the armslab to counter. This can give the alien side much needed time to secure the 2nd hive and prepare defenses.
If I'm on the marine team and suddenly 6 messages fly up the screen "XXXXX made a sensory chamber! We're screwed!"
Admin_ban. Its typically either a grief player, or some guy that decided to go Gorge and ignore the rest of his team as they scream at him to get off. Either way, its annoying and disruptive.
All 3 of my servers are full except early morning so I assume I'm not out of line. And if I was, and my servers were empty? It would be a load off my day to shut them down. Running servers is not particularly cheap and tends to be quite time consuming.
Cloak is useless against good marines
If your going to break the normal routine, then ask your team first.
If you just build a sensory without asking, breaking the normal and effective upgrade order then you should be kicked or banned becuase you have just performed an act that is against the wishes of your entire team and most often crippling to your teams chances of winning.
Well played to all the admins that would ban these people as the times ive had this happen there have been no admins around and weve had to put up with a losing game from the start.
I think people have covered all the reasons why sensory chambers is not a good first chamber. My thoughts in brief are:
-Sensory chambers will not heal other chambers/towers/hives/aliens
-Sensory provides no counter to motion tracking, and as such MT negates any real advantage
-The CLOAK function of Sensory is not 100% and thus
-The LACK of carapace makes skulks easier to kill. Only 9 shots from an unupgraded LMG, 5 shots from a pistol/HMG, 4 shots from a turret, or 1 grenade. Level 3 carapace will provide nearly double the protection.
The BIGGEST reason is that sensory is a one shot deal.
-If you go sensory and you do NOT secure a second hive, and the marines get into the other two hives and turret them up, you are LOST. That's it, game over.
The problem being that as the game progresses the marines get ammo/armor upgrades that make a non-carapace skulk so easy to kill it's not funny. When the marine has doubled his armor and increased his weapon damage by 50%, you'll be kicking yourself as you get picked off.
Even if you do get second hive up, you are stuck without adrenaline (if you choose D as second chamber) and that means all fades/lerks are gimped and cannot atack effectively. If you choose movement as second chamber then you have adrenaline but NO redemption and that means your 54 res fades will get smoked. I'll trust that when Flayra says he wants to make the chambers equally viable that we'll work on this.
Yeah going sensory first can be fun if you want to lose.
Regards,
Savant
I was in a server the other day and built a sensory and got banned. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
WOW, sensory chambers are best if built first. Well on our servers it is.
Our sensory chambers at voogru; not only cloak the aliens, but the aliens structures; like O & D chambers. They appear to be totally invisible to the Marine. It's hot.
Click the link below for more information about it:
<a href='http://forums.voogru.com/showthread.php?threadid=1665' target='_blank'>http://forums.voogru.com/showthread.php?threadid=1665</a> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
yeah...ookay.
admins "can" do whatever they want too but manipulation, as I call it, and then constant pimping of the "specialties" of the server through some server promoting link is well...
But we still won. The resource loss of their first base getting ripped to pieces by our rush delayed them, despite getting the double res. By the time they were strong enough to try an attack on us, refinery was done (def+sens now), feedwater was hit by skulks (the defense wasn't perfect and the tf died quickly), followed by a few fades for cleanup. We got three hives in the end, though the adrenalin wasn't absolutely necessary. By the time we got that, it was just an aid in cleaning up.
Dropping a sensory chamber is not equivalent to a comm who doesn't hand out HMGs, it is equivalent to a comm who decides to make a pretty looking tower out of command consoles in the middle of the marine start. Do that without the consent of the marine team on a server i have admin to and i'll ban you, do that <b>with</b> the consensus of the marine team in a game where i'm playing aliens, and i'll find a more mature server.
i play gorge a lot, and on the server i admin on, i ALWAYS go defense chamber first (unless the team wants a sensory just for fun). why do i go defense chamber first? well, the regulars of the server LOVE sending a gorge/RT hunter out right off the bat. the skulks usually eat this hunter until i can get my 2nd RT up. i then proceed to build a defense chambers (3) near the next RT i want to cap (usually in the hive i want). i get carapace and hang around the DCs. 'lo and behold, the gorge hunter comes in and opens fire! no carapace/DCs nearby = a dead gorge. a single gorge can EASILY hold their own against a marine, even TWO marines... IF they have carapace and some DCs nearby. just use the DCs as cover, constantly heal them when they get shot.
sorry, but no sensory upgrade will save my hiney from a situation like that.
Of course you are going to lose if you keep trying to skulk charge with only a sensory chamber. But instead why not cloak in hallways near the marine base and use a little thing called patience and wait till marines walk by then bite their spines. (just one of the many tactics that make sensory first work)
If your team has any amount of talent or skill, the order of chambers will not matter (though there are always some advantages to a certain order depending on the marine play style) The fact remains that changing circumstances require different tactics.
I have been on numerous games where sensory was the first or second upgrade. We did not get rapped as one blinded whiner said over the comm 400 times. In fact, my team adapted to the new style and went on to completly destroy the marines even though we never even got the third hive till the last minute of the game.
If some people took the time to stop whining about a sensory chamber being placed out of order and instead took the time to learn new tactics for such an arrangement, they would be whiping the floor with marines who only play expecting the same tactics from the aliens time and time again
Why be so worried that you are going to lose the match anyway? Isnt the point to have fun?
Who cares if you win if you are having fun playing?
Losing can still be fun if it was a good game. Losing or even winning (if you're a marine) because a gorge decided to cripple his team is not.