Personal Thoughts About Same Race Combat
philmcneal
Join Date: 2002-10-24 Member: 1585Members
Join Date: 2002-10-24 Member: 1585Members
<div class="IPBDescription">What you think of it?</div> Do you like the idea if one day NS goes into Aliens vs Aliens combat or vice versa? What's your say on this?
Of course we would have to create new maps but when Marines Vs Aliens is truely balanced, do you think Marines vs Marines or vice versa will be balanced also?
What's your say on this?
Of course we would have to create new maps but when Marines Vs Aliens is truely balanced, do you think Marines vs Marines or vice versa will be balanced also?
What's your say on this?
Comments
That's my opinion.
anyways that's my 2 cents
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How could 2 teams with the exact same tech tree not be balanced? I personally think the RTS is gone and this just becomes an FPS team game then, however =/
MvM + AvA + MvA = 3 Games
In a simple smily...
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In the words of Talesin "Gimme"
Actually, I think MvM will be more of an RTS, commanders on both teams and battle for the res nodes rather than the hives.
Actually, I think MvM will be more of an RTS, commanders on both teams and battle for the res nodes rather than the hives.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, now that I think again, it'll be fine. I was basing that remark on the 1.04 tech tree. I was having nightmares of JP + HMG tech rushes.
Exactly, and therein lies the problem. Rather than being forced, as marines, to expand to the hives of the map you can just build yourself in at base, make it utterly unpenetratable, with maybe some mined RT around the map, then just build your squad into an army of HMG HA clones ready to stomp on everyone else, it's just a case of who gets there quicker.
I was just thinking that actually, how NS would just be CS with buildings if it was MvM. I like the fact it's only MvA as standard, both have their strengths and weaknesses and it makes it a more diverse game, one of the thing that appeals to me as NS as a whole. Also, i don't reckon AvA would be fun whatsoever, the start of the game would just have both teams sitting around doing nothing as a skulk rush either way would leave their base open. Also the trend for Aliens to leave their first hive open as then seal up and build a second hive would be useless since if you got skulk rushed from the start with no defences the game would be over very quickly.
Basically, my 2c is that NS was made to be a AvM game, and that's where all the work of balancing has gone, same-species games would probably just end up extremely "samey" or longwinded and boring. But then again all of this is mere speculation and presumption.
also may i mention the jp hmg rush wont be so effective against these other marines, due to other marin3s are gonna have long distance weapons, where as the aliens don`t untill fades, and so the enemy marines are gonna blast the jet packers out the sky...
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How could 2 teams with the exact same tech tree not be balanced? I personally think the RTS is gone and this just becomes an FPS team game then, however =/ <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactly.... all it boils down to after that is the balance of the maps! To many resources placed nearer to one side starting spot would mean that team gains the upper hand. If the maps for same side combat were symetrical down the middle then each team would have an even chance of winning.
skulk vs skulk? i dont see how that will work
unless they add a new race of aliens for v3.5
skulk vs skulk? i dont see how that will work
unless they add a new race of aliens for v3.5 <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't see the problem? The one that bites twice first wins...
And then we'd call it Counter-Selection <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
In the absolute end, I think you're right, however,
if it wouldn't take too much work to just get
the game to allow it, I think it would be
amusing anyway. Something doesn't have
to be played seriously to be fun.
While i totally agree with you there, i believe that NS just doesn't work unless you are a tad serious. Although saying that, one of the last games of NS i played i was encouraging people to jump down a well with me on some map (tanith or nothing, whichever has Generator Room with the well in the middle).
One of the attractions of NS, for me at least, is the ability to knuckle down and get on with it, when you've put time and effort in securing that all-important second hive, and you finally win on your last assault, the feeling of accomplishment is astounding, it makes it all feel worthwhile in the end.
I guess you've just got to treat it all with a smile, don't get annoyed if you're not winning, just sit back and do the best you can.
And then we'd call it Counter-Selection <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
No need to avoid fun scenarios just because they have similarities to other games. We wouldn't have NS if they did that.
I personally want an escape map scenario first before MvM/KvK. Marines have to get from point a to point b while aliens have to kill them off first. I'm thinking Kharaa would start out with 2 hives and two res points and marines with one res point. They can choose to rush it in the beginning or they can tech up quickly and try to get JPs or something before the Kharaa get fades. (they'd probably get fades if marines went JPs) If a certain percentage of marines escape then marines win. Well, that's a rough idea of what I think would be fun.
As for MvM, that would be crazy and I would prefer some objective-based maps as well. Although I still hesitate for objectives like bombing a site, not so much that it's in CS but that it doesn't fit the NS style.
KvK would be a little more difficult to create since they'd have to create new skins where as the marines could have different colored uniforms. Plus, this one makes less sense. (why would the Kharaa attack other Kharaa) It'd probably have to be a new strain of bacterium fighting for domination. Maps for KvK would have four, five, or six hives. Not sure which Flayra would choose. Good thing about having two skins for Kharaa would be that normal games could probably switch between them randomly and create more diversity.
Heh... the more gametypes, the better. I still think normal games will be the most popular, though. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
but marine versus marine=gimmeh <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
but marine versus marine=gimmeh <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Note of concern that sprung up shortly after reading the above post: Skulk rambos easily taking out gorges, even when they have a lifeguard skulk.
It would be fun to create a map moon like , and you got plenty of open space , lerk/JPs fights could be fun ...
We could be creative here and make it very fun even competitive.
I predict it will be added in version 2.0 =) or the next version after ns 1.1 because I know ns 1.1 or ns 1.14 or something will be balanced.
Predict.... Fall
Accually the game already support M vs M or A VS A already so we just need maps technically.
And for Marines -- building would be a huge issue if weapon damage was the same. If a marine caught another marine building, building marine is dead. 10 bullets go REAL fast. Also damage vs. structures would need to be changed.
Basicaly all the aspects of the game would need an overhaul, which to be quite honest, I do not believe would produce a product that could not be beaten if all this time had been put into developing the current AvM scenarios.
Therefore, although I agree it would be fun, I say NAY!