Ns_freefall Betas 12+
HoundDawg
Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 3362Members
Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 3362Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Thread for all Betas after 11</div> <b>CURRENT BETA:</b> 13 (changelog posted later in thread)
<b>OVERVIEW:</b> This map is strictly a "fun" style map, which was inspired by playing ns_missilecommand. There were just a few design issues I had with that map, which really favored the marines.
<b>KHARAA OBJECTIVE:</b> Build and defend 3 hives while falling down to attack the marines.
<b>TSA OBJECTIVE:</b> Build and defend the spread resource nodes while quickly upgrading to obtain jetpacks. Ladders may also be used in earlier attacks before jetpacks are available.
<b>PICTURES AND DOWNLOAD:</b> <a href='http://www.wwgaming.com/nc/ns_freefall.php' target='_blank'>http://www.wwgaming.com/nc/ns_freefall.php</a>
Have fun!
<b>OVERVIEW:</b> This map is strictly a "fun" style map, which was inspired by playing ns_missilecommand. There were just a few design issues I had with that map, which really favored the marines.
<b>KHARAA OBJECTIVE:</b> Build and defend 3 hives while falling down to attack the marines.
<b>TSA OBJECTIVE:</b> Build and defend the spread resource nodes while quickly upgrading to obtain jetpacks. Ladders may also be used in earlier attacks before jetpacks are available.
<b>PICTURES AND DOWNLOAD:</b> <a href='http://www.wwgaming.com/nc/ns_freefall.php' target='_blank'>http://www.wwgaming.com/nc/ns_freefall.php</a>
Have fun!
Comments
<ul><li>Removed ladders and glass ladder tubes.
<li>Re-created the marine bunkers from scratch. They are now improved and better on the poly counts with less chances of leaks.
<li>Simplified the marine base floor, by removing the curved sand paths.
<li>Re-designed the marine layout and added different terrain effects.
<li>Re-designed and re-created the entire alien hive area. Improved construction and layout.
<li>Color-coded hives for easier identification for both aliens and marines.
<li>Changed both mid-level platforms, which now block more of the map, increasing FPS.
<li>Removed ramps that linked hives to the center. This should help slow aliens down a little from immediately gaining all 3 hives before marines are prepared.</ul>
The following issues that are planned for beta 13 (sometime today):
<ul><li>Raise the command chair out of the ground. This was caused by the new Hammer Beta, which I have reverted back to the older version.
<li>Add spawn points to each hive location.
<li>Figure out how to fix the spike slope so that skulks can climb up it and get into hive location.
<li>Increase the brightness on the color hive chambers.
<li>Invert the slope on one of the middle level sections to go the opposite direction.
<li>Increase the transparency of the marine bunker see-through tops.
</ul>
<ul><li>Raised the Command Chair out of the ground.
<li>Added spawn points to each hive chamber.
<li>Made external hive chamber walls easier for skulks to climb up on.
<li>Increased the brightness of the lights for each hive.
<li>Inverted the lower mid-level so they tilt upward rather than downward.
<li>Increased the transparency of the marine bunker tops for commander.
<li>Added transparency to the water in the ready room.
<li>Fixed the backside of the command bunker to avoid getting stuck there.</ul>
(see first post for more info and links)
Heh, yeah. I probably should have started with alphas first. But, at the beginning, I thought it was going to be a simple quick map. But, then all sorts of things kept getting suggested and it's incredibly hard to strike a good balance with NS v1.0. Then, we ran into all sorts of FPS issues.
So, through the evolution from a boxed vertical room to a detailed fallmap....with higher FPS everywhere... we have b13. <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo-->
1) Thanks for the feedback! A lot of work and creativity went into the designs through the various beta releases.
2) The pool at the bottom is by design to assist both aliens and marines from the fall. You'd be surprised just how many still miss it. LOL
3) The angled walls..... I did have nobuilds on them when they were flat and they had no effect on O and D building for some reason. So, I then made them angled to help with that. But, alas, I've run out of ideas on how to prevent stacks of O and D chambers at those 2 mid-levels. It seems that gorges can drop chambers from anywhere and they can fall even on any "nobuild" areas. Would be nice if this was fixed in v1.1. Besides, if a gorge stacks too many down there, NS may cause the server to crash when a marine JP comes within range.
4) If a gorge can drop chambers all the way down to the marine start, more power to them. First, it'll take time before they are built. Second, marines should have at least 1 siege to deal with them.
5) I used to have trigger_hurt entities at the spike tips, but I've removed them since it's hard enuf for JPers to get up there. We're going to playtest it this week and see if there are any further balance issues.
Thanks again for all the feedback!
<a href='http://www.wwgaming.com/nc/ns_freefall.php' target='_blank'>http://www.wwgaming.com/nc/ns_freefall.php</a>
- The lights above the lower platforms coming from below (func setrhough with zhlt lightflag?). Same on the three hives. light shining through walls.
Make them solid and set the command view lower or use the second-last zhlt-lightflag (opaque+embedded fix) if not done already.
- The water pool surface has 2 stripes in it breaking the water surface.
Scale the texture to "fit" and turn it along any degree OR just turn it around 0° or 45° (or was it -45° or 90°?) with any scale OR use func_wall.
- Aliens getting stuck in some places, Its hard to climb up at the rocks.
Use "-cliptype precise" as CSG parameter with XPs tools if not already and redo places you can stick at or get stuck.
- Some gaps make the spikes flying in the air. (solids missing)
- I miss the ladders
The nobuild problem:
Gorges and Commanders can not build ON doors (that have a name) so just make the platform large doors that dont move.
Thoose door platforms can be transformed into "falling spikes", set angle "down", lip "-500 or more", speed "fast" and let the doors be triggered ONLY by a func_weldable (weld time one second) that makes them moving down fast.
Thanks for taking the time to look it over and provide feedback!
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->- The lights above the lower platforms coming from below (func setrhough with zhlt lightflag?). Same on the three hives. light shining through walls.
Make them solid and set the command view lower or use the second-last zhlt-lightflag (opaque+embedded fix) if not done already.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The platforms and the hive chambers are using the 1pixel away from other brush technique. Unfortunately, it has issues with how lighting is applied. I'd like to keep them brushes (non-entity) which help with the reduction of FPS caused by VIS. So, I use the 1pixel trick to prevent additional poly divisions on the larger brushes. So, it's a catch-22 I guess. Unless you know another way around it. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->- The water pool surface has 2 stripes in it breaking the water surface.
Scale the texture to "fit" and turn it along any degree OR just turn it around 0? or 45? (or was it -45? or 90??) with any scale OR use func_wall.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, I couldn't figure out what it is. Hmm, I'll try doing this texture trick and see what happens. Thanks!
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->- Aliens getting stuck in some places, Its hard to climb up at the rocks.
Use "-cliptype precise" as CSG parameter with XPs tools if not already and redo places you can stick at or get stuck.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No kidding...and it's annoying. I'll have to try with this CSG parameter. Because right now, every edge seems to cause models to get stuck on (aliens and marines).
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->- Some gaps make the spikes flying in the air. (solids missing)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, I noticed a few of these while testing b13 with a few others.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->- I miss the ladders<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, you're one of the only ones. It served no practical purpose except for marines to use with JP to reach hive uber fast. But, the marines also complained about it either being an alien trap or fades bombarding from it.
Removing them and the glass cut my compile down by 15 minutes. I'm sure it also improved the FPS too. So, it's worth it that they're gone.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The nobuild problem:
Gorges and Commanders can not build ON doors (that have a name) so just make the platform large doors that dont move.
Thoose door platforms can be transformed into "falling spikes", set angle "down", lip "-500 or more", speed "fast" and let the doors be triggered ONLY by a func_weldable (weld time one second) that makes them moving down fast.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Interesting. If I didn't have to worry about FPS issues with the map already, I'd get more creative with it. Unfortunately, I don't have a lot of room to play here. Maybe with the HL2 engine, we'll have more abilities to having larger maps.
Thanks again for the feedback.
There was another concept that I was going by and creating..... but, I was told to just use that in another map. So, ns_caverns is partially designed. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
They were all supposed to be internal man. As he said above, we ran into so many issues while testing. He also said he underestimated the amount of tweaking involved in makeing a good, balanced map in NS v1.0. When he realized this it was too late, he couldn't release an alpha after a beta.
This message was for all mappers (specialy those funmaps mappers).. please..before you release a map... wait a day or two, run around, think about everything. and only THEN release it.
Of course this adds to the w-polys.
OR delete all solids that you can see around and rebuild the inner architecture out of func_walls (or func doors) with the ZHLT lightflag (wich will RAD cause to take ages, VIS much faster, and add to w_poly like above)
The rock-hive-spikes for example are rendered from anywere so it does not change anythin making them func_wall since they rarey block any vis when they are solid.