Sensory Chamber

SkurgeSkurge Join Date: 2003-04-26 Member: 15858Members
<div class="IPBDescription">what exactly do marines see?</div> Running through scenarios in my mind, it came to me that, even if a sensory chamber cloaks all structures, how would a cloaked hive appear?

One of the major advantages I can see by making sensory the first chamber is to cloak your first base, so a marine runs in and sees nothing so leaves. There was also some discussion about making the SC a better first chamber choice. But if the sensory chamber only cloaks the hive then a marine would see nothing there instead of an empty hive transperency. This would be a dead give away that a hive was there, and tip off the marine to other players possibly being in the area.

Maybe the very talented programmers fixed, but I thought it might be one of those things that just don't come up until someone plays with it.

Comments

  • JamlJaml Join Date: 2002-11-17 Member: 9054Members
    As far as i understood sc doesn´t cloak sound effects so only deaf marines would be fooled by a cloaked hive. No need to worry about the transparent placeholder. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • Frogg2Frogg2 Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 4867Members, Constellation
    the transparent placeholder does not show up
  • UnknownUnknown Join Date: 1970-01-01 Member:
    Why can the marines see the transparent placeholders anyway? I never understood why they could.
  • civman2civman2 Join Date: 2002-11-03 Member: 6116Members, Constellation
    Boltman: To help new marines who don't know the maps yet.
  • Umbraed_MonkeyUmbraed_Monkey Join Date: 2002-11-25 Member: 9922Members
    Boltman's got a point.

    1- Why would marines know where an appropriate hive spot will be?
    2- A marine would have visual cues (infestation) and the comm to tell him where the hive is.
  • ZelZel Join Date: 2003-01-27 Member: 12861Members
    so seeing the total lack of a hive placeholder would be a dead givaway.

    lets mark that one as a bug to be fixed before 1.1 comes out.
  • JasperJasper Join Date: 2002-04-08 Member: 390Members
    Does anyone really think that an invisible hive is going to fool anyone? All a marine would have to do to fined to is listen to the sounds it make or fire a round at it and see the blood. I would also like to know if a clocked hive can be seen by motion tracking, I would think that it can…
  • ZelZel Join Date: 2003-01-27 Member: 12861Members
    i would definitely pop one lmg shell into any hive location ever, to test for the reaction.

    this would work in 95% of situations, the 5% being when we are secrretly relocating.
  • Umbraed_MonkeyUmbraed_Monkey Join Date: 2002-11-25 Member: 9922Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Jasper+May 15 2003, 03:41 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Jasper @ May 15 2003, 03:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Does anyone really think that an invisible hive is going to fool anyone? All a marine would have to do to fined to is listen to the sounds it make or fire a round at it and see the blood. I would also like to know if a clocked hive can be seen by motion tracking, I would think that it can… <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Yes that is a pretty big problem...perhaps cloaked BUILDINGS should be silenced as well as cloaked. And if this is really serious...maybe buildings shouldnt show up when hit (still take damage), making the only counters a scan sweep, or building a obs nearby. Lets see what the devs come up with to solve this problem.
  • CyricCyric Join Date: 2003-05-07 Member: 16117Members
    If they didn't appear from damage that would just be cheap and stupid unless it were in a hive room. If you're just roaming around and constantly leaving every building on the map unharrassed unknowingly, the aliens would gain a huge advantage (particularely from defense chambers). They'd fire around and never know if they hit anything. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • Umbraed_MonkeyUmbraed_Monkey Join Date: 2002-11-25 Member: 9922Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Cyric+May 15 2003, 06:41 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Cyric @ May 15 2003, 06:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> If they didn't appear from damage that would just be cheap and stupid unless it were in a hive room. If you're just roaming around and constantly leaving every building on the map unharrassed unknowingly, the aliens would gain a huge advantage (particularely from defense chambers). They'd fire around and never know if they hit anything. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    ya...it seems to jump from easily counter-able to godly <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • UnknownUnknown Join Date: 1970-01-01 Member:
    edited May 2003
    As for marines seeing the transparent placeholders, I think the map textures are already too much of a hint. So what if someone makes a new map without the "infestation hint"? Hera was released with processing, bad maps do exist, and all you need is the remove them from server rotation.

    About cloacked hives,
    what about movement chambers reduces the sounds of nearby structures significantly, to a point of 3 movement chambers could silence all structures near them?

    How to check a hive then? Scanning! Its not a big deal, and it would add a lot to the games atmosphere

    -*bump* Hey Bill check this out! There is something here...
    - Theres nothing there jack! Do you see anything? Hear anything? You are just lagging!
    - Yeah right Bil...
    Thomas <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo--> Jack
    Bill: WTH?
    Thomas <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo--> Bill
  • criticaIcriticaI Join Date: 2003-04-07 Member: 15269Banned, Constellation
    The current area effect cloaking works pretty well right now guys. It does what it was intended for. Cloaks nearby structures and lifeforms. This means you can run into a hive room and suddenly you see several Offense chambers lock on to you and uncloak. ETC. The point isn't to cloak a hive, that isn't going to fool anybody with a little experience under their belt.
  • CEldinCEldin Join Date: 2002-09-16 Member: 1323Members
    Approximatly how large is the radius of this AOE cloak? I am rather curios to know whether it would require multiple SC's to cover a WoL of 6+ towers. Is it comparable to siege distance? Does the radius descent and ascend? (ie. can you go under a SC and still be cloaked, or do you still have to be on the same plane) Thanks in advance ;]
  • criticaIcriticaI Join Date: 2003-04-07 Member: 15269Banned, Constellation
    <!--QuoteBegin--Stung256+May 15 2003, 08:54 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Stung256 @ May 15 2003, 08:54 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Approximatly how large is the radius of this AOE cloak? I am rather curios to know whether it would require multiple SC's to cover a WoL of 6+ towers. Is it comparable to siege distance? Does the radius descent and ascend? (ie. can you go under a SC and still be cloaked, or do you still have to be on the same plane) Thanks in advance ;] <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    It is very similar to the 1.0 siege range. You can cloak whole rooms with it quite easily. You don't have to be in the same plane.. its a spherical cloaking area of effect.
  • AetiusAetius Join Date: 2003-03-11 Member: 14408Members
    What about RT's?

    If a nozzle has a cloaked alien RT, what happens if the Commander tries to build a marine RT on that site?

    Wouldn't that be another dead giveaway?
  • twilitebluetwiliteblue bug stalker Join Date: 2003-02-04 Member: 13116Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    Speaking about give-aways, would the building-sweeping problem in some RTS's be a problem in NS? (ie. can the commander detect cloaked buildings with the "select building location" cursor?)

    BTW, does anyone know how building-stacking is addressed in 1.1?
  • SpazmaticSpazmatic Join Date: 2003-05-10 Member: 16184Members
    I would like to state that I think it would be nice if hive outlines showed up when hives were cloaked. My argument thus is that newbies would have a far easier time if they happened to wander into a cloaked hive... Despite the infestation indications, a new player would have no idea in which direction the hive was at (nor would 1.1 players early on!), and would thus be unable to check by firing if it was cloaked. Amittedly, most newbies probably wouldn't check by firing anyways, but the big transparent hive would go a long way for helping newbies deal with a cloaked hive (especially considering the whole hive thing is a fair bit of confusion for new players as is).
  • BogglesteinskyBogglesteinsky Join Date: 2002-12-24 Member: 11488Members
    do webs get cloaked?

    newbie runs into unseen web then gets cut down by unseen ocs...

    if the web doesnt get cloaked, you could fool marines for ages by just stringin up some webs without the wol behind. they would be there for ages refusing to go further. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
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