Blame The Commander!

Creepsie_CreatureCreepsie_Creature Join Date: 2003-06-20 Member: 17536Banned
<div class="IPBDescription">annoying</div> I was playing a game of NS on my friends LAN. We were both logged into a server and I think the map was ns_eclipse. We were both marines, and the commander had dropped jetpacks for the entire team and he had little in the way of defence for the base, with only one sentry gun.

After watching my entire team play with their toys for almost five minutes, the commander left the server so I decided to have a go. We had 10 resources, not enough to do anything really. But the team insisted on going off on their own with jetpacks and ended up getting creamed by the alien team.

As a commander trying to help our ridiculously vulnerable base, I must say it was very pleasurable to hear cries of "medpack!" and "we want HMG's" every ten seconds when I was trying to get some sentry guns positioned. It was infuriating to place sentry guns in our base whilst marines did nothing but cry about heavy weapons, liberal calling of "n00b", and "eject the comm!". I even dumped sentry guns in front of people, to find they did nothing only shout on the voice comm at me.

Does this happen often? Because in almost every game I go in, all I see is people crying for the big toys and doing nothing in the way of teamwork. I like a game to be based on working together to make an efficient base, then go out and attack aliens. People seem to be too quick to blame the commander, and seem to think HMG's are available at the start of the game.

Just needed to vent. Thanks for listening.

Comments

  • XCanXCan Join Date: 2002-11-03 Member: 5904Members, Constellation
    This indeed happend a lot during NS' early days. However now I very seldom see it. And if there is some moron doing it he'll get utterly bashed by the whole team.
  • meatballmeatball Join Date: 2003-05-10 Member: 16196Members
    It was much more usual when there were less experienced players, but I still see it happen as last time I went com. I and the marines had owned the aliens the last round and the next round the team contains only those noob players and those who don't know how to follow orders, yeah so we lost pretty bad and the startet to complain. But happily these things dont happen all the time anymore.
  • MEShootHereMEShootHere Join Date: 2002-11-05 Member: 6975Members
    Oddly its an on and off situation.
    Sometimes it seems school's out for a day and you run into swearing/whatnot all the time.
    Others I see people saying "ib n00b" and they get more help than they could have wished for.
    It mainly depends on the people playing. If 4 buttoxes join, theyll dominate with their bashing, if there is only 1, he'll get pounded and leave.
    I have had games where the teamwork/voicecomm were insanely good and it was fun as heck.
    Others have just made me leave a match halfway.
    I wouldnt take it all too seriously..I admit it can be hard to learn how to comm what with all the bashers around.
    Stick at it, youll win eventually and then I can beat you after what you thought was great comming!
    <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
    Anyways...
  • SuperBOBSuperBOB Join Date: 2003-02-21 Member: 13795Members
    I play with the same group of people everyday, except for PCW/League matches.
  • HalikHalik Join Date: 2003-06-09 Member: 17159Members
    I see this often on ffa day serwers but when i play at night all kids go sleep and some good players are playing.

    Marine base relocated, armory upgraded, some ammo ups and jetpacks. I was chasing for skulks near base while commander provided some JPs and HMGs for whole team while me and my friend returned to base. "Oh, well... We gonna defend base while they gonna have fun". Only with LMGs some skulks attacked in panic (Hive is under attack) and we killed them. But then fade and lerk attacked trying to blow up our base by trip mines. We shooted down lerk, badly wounded we chased fade trough the corridor. I reloaded LMG, pistol was empty, my friend was still shooting. Fade turned back tu us while i attacked him with knife so my friend can reload lmg. I died by acid rocket but fade was on the floor wit houndreds of lmg bullets in his **** :> No matter what the comm to "big toys" aspect. Teamplay is much more worth then HMG guy hunting for frags... Commander was saved and one hive was killed during the jp raid... We saved the base. With no comm help :>
  • MastodonMastodon Old Fogie Join Date: 2003-01-09 Member: 12052Members, Constellation
    No respect for the commanders, that's all I have to say.
  • WodinWodin Join Date: 2003-06-09 Member: 17138Members
    edited June 2003
    I've seen a lot of comm bashing too, most definitely by people who've never played comm. However, there are some comms that should watch their marine bashing. When things go wrong, some people just love jumping to blame someone. Should anyone who reads this get that urge, I suggest not bothering. You're not getting anything done, and you lose respect.
  • coilcoil Amateur pirate. Professional monkey. All pance. Join Date: 2002-04-12 Member: 424Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
    I'd say in the minds of most useless NS players, there are 3 kinds of commander:

    1) Good Commander - this is a fictional, hypothetical construct; there are no actual Good Commanders in the world.

    2) Utter Noob Commander - the guy who's never sat down in a Comm Chair and wouldn't know an IP from his own nose hair.

    3) Noob Commander - the guy who knows how to play, but doesn't play the way "Joe HMGh4x0r" thinks is the best way to play.

    Currently, building turrets is probably considered "noobish" behavior, unfortunately; 1.1 is working to make turrets more useful. That's probably why you got called noob, aside from the not granting their every whim.

    I'd suggest playing on well-admined servers that keep a lot of regulars; CoFR and Nano-Gridlock come to mind, or Roobubba's servers in the UK. FoR's server is good, but is currently a 1.1 playtest server. They're not perfect, but they're better than average at least.
  • AgkelosAgkelos Join Date: 2003-02-07 Member: 13243Members
    Heh. I like admined servers.

    Banned from CHI MAYHEM, CoFr, OSS, Evil, Ars Clan, Sleepless.
    Wont get unbanned from CoFr, the one I like, but bleh, thats another story.
  • TiaxTiax Join Date: 2003-05-28 Member: 16802Members
    Even worse is the moron who hops into the com chair and drops himself ammo and a shotty early on. Usually though we'll vote kick him and take his shotty.

    Sucks when teh comm hops out to build something real quick and the guy respawns and drops himself a bunch of gear.
  • AgkelosAgkelos Join Date: 2003-02-07 Member: 13243Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Tiax-+Jun 24 2003, 12:57 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Tiax- @ Jun 24 2003, 12:57 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Even worse is the moron who hops into the com chair and drops himself ammo and a shotty early on. Usually though we'll vote kick him and take his shotty.

    Sucks when teh comm hops out to build something real quick and the guy respawns and drops himself a bunch of gear. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Take offense to that! Every game start I quickly jump into chair, drop 3 packs of ammo nearby, get out, take it, go early rambo -_-.
  • CplDavisCplDavis I hunt the arctic Snonos Join Date: 2003-01-09 Member: 12097Members
    I usualy find its with one guy or so ,he will sit n base and keep saying over voice chat.

    Com gimee this, gimme this! Im right next to your chair.

    Give me one and il leave, give me another even though I lost the other 4 b/c i ran off and got killed, give me another even though we only have 9 rez...


    Usualy the team just tells him to suyf. and ignores him.
  • MeLeNkOMeLeNkO Join Date: 2003-04-06 Member: 15240Members
    i wouldnt play there here are some cool server who are polit n play fun

    198.247.231.15:27019 DEADCLAN'S GRAVEYARD V1.05 C-D V 3.2.0 REQUIRED!!

    207.44.180.88:27015 [CoFR]FR31NS-Alien Infest 1.04 1RSRV


    they are the best servers
  • GlissGliss Join Date: 2003-03-23 Member: 14800Members, Constellation, NS2 Map Tester
    <!--QuoteBegin--MeLeNkO+Jun 23 2003, 11:10 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MeLeNkO @ Jun 23 2003, 11:10 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> i wouldnt play there here are some cool server who are polit n play fun

    198.247.231.15:27019 DEADCLAN'S GRAVEYARD V1.05 C-D V 3.2.0 REQUIRED!!

    207.44.180.88:27015 [CoFR]FR31NS-Alien Infest 1.04 1RSRV


    they are the best servers <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Nano-Gridlock (64.237.35.100:27015) - Lots of nice people there, though I got banned by Us3r once.
    I recommend you play on that, though usually it's either completely empty or full, I can never seem to get in.
  • Brave_UlyssesBrave_Ulysses Join Date: 2003-04-28 Member: 15922Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Tiax-+Jun 24 2003, 12:57 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Tiax- @ Jun 24 2003, 12:57 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Even worse is the moron who hops into the com chair and drops himself ammo and a shotty early on. Usually though we'll vote kick him and take his shotty. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I once played in a game where some **** used our tiny res count to order himself a shotgun. Which he promptly lost because he dropped it onto a railing ledge in Eclipse marine start and it disappeared.
  • Nemesis_ZeroNemesis_Zero Old European Join Date: 2002-01-25 Member: 75Members, Retired Developer, NS1 Playtester, Constellation
    edited June 2003
    Personally, I hope that the Constellation system will help a little. How?
    Well, many of the 'less informed' players seem to think that any kind of scorescreen icon indicates admin on that server - happens all the time to me, at last. Most of these raging idiots pipe down when they see admins around. Now, imagine <i>every</i> server out there having at least one iconed player on them <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • MoquiaoMoquiao Join Date: 2003-05-09 Member: 16168Members
    i just make them feel small...

    like if they say eject the comm just reply with somethign that makes them look stupid...

    ' why eject me? you have not had a chance to see what i can do.. at least wait and see my tactics perhaps... or is that to tricky for you..

    muh that isnt quite my phrasing but it is the general idea of it

    but Adapt And survive baby when 1.1 comes knocking ill be ready i use a diverse range of tactics 80% of place still jp/hmg :S
  • falloutx2falloutx2 Join Date: 2003-05-01 Member: 15979Members, Constellation
    What I generally see among new players is the scatter to the wind and you have to rely on them wandering to the the right place, then grabbing them and making them stop wherever you want, usually in the form of multiple waypoints to the same place and some verbal "that is not the way to power sub-junction, turn around NOW!"

    Some players know enough just to be dangerous. I tend to occasionally pull some unusual strats just to see if they work, knowing it might cost us victory. With talented players, they will usually at least try it, even if they think its the stupidest idea they've ever heard of. The moderately experienced player, however, often begins to demand that you should build in x location instead of y location that you are building in.

    Personally, the most fun games are the ones that control one hive and res starve 2 hives aliens until HA/HMG/GL can walk in, maybe supported by some JP/GL to contain webs or early JP/LMG to contain alien movement. EU used JP/LMG to contain alien movement in one of the EU vs US matches and it proved very effective.
  • GhostlyPeaGhostlyPea Join Date: 2003-03-12 Member: 14431Members, Constellation
    My tip, and this is what i do..it works. If they want something and you want something, make them work for it

    "gimme a HMG"
    'only if u go get this RT first'
    "ok"

    seems to work..but then i mainly play on clan servers..i.e. no n00bs/ morons

    <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • MintmanMintman Join Date: 2003-05-30 Member: 16866Members
    I just commed a game where the marines were pretty obidient and the aliens were deep in the brown stuff. Then I started handing out JPs and the odd shotgun.

    We'd got them to 1 hive and a few res nodes and were pressuring their hive. It was pretty WOLed up though so I gave the entire team a waypoint to a siege position, telling them we were going to siege. One marine went towards the waypoint... and promptly flew straight over it towards the hive. I told them again and again. Finally I got so annoyed I told them all to rush the hive and I sold the IP. In the ready room a few minutes later I get the obligatory "OMG NOOB COMM" even though we had the majority of the map under control and full weap and armour upgrades. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> I love this game, it's just a shame about some of the players.
  • kingmobkingmob Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 3650Members, Constellation
    concerning the "gimme gimme requests"...

    I saw the best response to one in a pub game
    the marines were divided into the 'gimme gimme'
    and just the scrubs who take orders.

    anyways one of the 'gimme gimme' fools was saying somehint like
    "OMG gimme HMG NOW NOW!!!"

    and one of the marines (the other half) said "Comm i want a pony"
    which caused all us scrubs to all join in

    "Comm i want a pony too"
    "come on Comm, i have been good ...don't i deserve a pony"

    needless to say the 'gimme gimme' people shut their traps
    and we played a solid game.
  • ZiGGYZiGGY Join Date: 2003-01-19 Member: 12479Members
    commanding or indeed playing wtih idiots, not necessarily new players is so damn frustrating <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> oh the things people say including me under their annoyance <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • UKCZeNnUKCZeNn Join Date: 2003-04-26 Member: 15848Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Mintman+Jun 24 2003, 07:11 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mintman @ Jun 24 2003, 07:11 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I just commed a game where the marines were pretty obidient and the aliens were deep in the brown stuff. Then I started handing out JPs and the odd shotgun.

    We'd got them to 1 hive and a few res nodes and were pressuring their hive. It was pretty WOLed up though so I gave the entire team a waypoint to a siege position, telling them we were going to siege. One marine went towards the waypoint... and promptly flew straight over it towards the hive. I told them again and again. Finally I got so annoyed I told them all to rush the hive and I sold the IP. In the ready room a few minutes later I get the obligatory "OMG NOOB COMM" even though we had the majority of the map under control and full weap and armour upgrades.  <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->  I love this game, it's just a shame about some of the players.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    im sorry but i just cant condone this sort of action. i have been in similar situations and if people simply will not do what the comm says (and you are that comm) you do NOT sell the ip and end the game. its unfair to both your players and the other team as that game may have gone on and got better. the comm has the power to end the game just because he is a little frustrated and thats not good play dude.
    best action to take (although still disruptive to the team) is to simple get out of the chair and let someone else takeover or leave. dont ruin it for everyone on the server.
  • ByekaByeka Name changed from Freak83 Toronto Join Date: 2003-03-13 Member: 14484Members, Constellation
    I was in a game where they were calling me a noob comm yesterday because I was trying to get resources and not defending hives. But yet in fact my main plan was to get maintenance first and defend it. However when I told the team to go to maint (and gave them a wp) I found a grand total of one person went. Of course he didn't last long and I found my team wandering around the map. My team never ended up going anywhere together which christianed me as a noob comm.
  • SkydancerSkydancer Join Date: 2003-03-28 Member: 14959Members, Constellation
    I enjoy playing with n00bs and idiots just to show them how stupid they are. Am I cruel?
  • HawkeyeHawkeye Join Date: 2002-10-31 Member: 1855Members
    edited June 2003
    This is the best piece of advice you'll ever hear about being comm.
    Good comming is an art form of balancing these 4 things:

    1. Not always getting what you want, but making sacrifices to keep things that are more important strategically.
    2. Utilizing the resources in the most efficient way possible by making res nodes while maintaining it with turrets and keeping upgrades flowing.
    3. Earning the team's respect, but at the same time, not giving joe schmoe an hmg everytime he asks for one.
    4. Doing what works, not necessarily what the team wants.

    Do these 4 things, and you'll be a good comm. Most comms give exactly what the marines want. Sure this is good for respect and making your team listen, but that isn't always what's best. If a guy keeps asking for hmg, and he runs out of the base rambo style and gets himself killed, he just lost you 25 resources. Hopefully you'd be smart enough not to repeat your mistake twice. The best way to avoid a mistake like this is to give it to the guy with the highest score. Typically they are the more experienced players and will listen.

    Suppose you are comm, and a group of marines are building phase and res node in one hive, and your other hive is under heavy attack by skulks and lerks. What do you do? If you're at least a mediocre comm, you'd finish the phase and have them use it to get to other hive (assuming the phase is still operational). What if they die and your phase is down in that hive? What do you do then? If you're at least a good comm, you'd realize that retaking the hive isn't a distinct possibility since most of your buildings are gone. You'd recycle the other hive, get your freshly spawned team through phase to build your new base in the hive. So what if you had tried to retake your old base? You'd send a team of marines to the old hive only to find little to nothing left, and in the meanwhile, the same team of aliens which swarmed the previous hive is now attacking your new hive. You just lost 2 hives! Had you been a good comm, you would have seen that 2 in the hand is worth 1 in the bush.

    The difference between a good comm and a bad comm in this instance is sacrificing one thing for another. If you feel you have to control everything, it aint' gonna happen. The more res nodes you have, the harder it will be to keep each and every one secure. However, if you're an EXCELLENT comm, you would have had half your team already in the hive awaiting the attack, and the other half building the new hive base (very difficult to achieve this level of comming though).
  • NiteowlNiteowl Join Date: 2002-09-04 Member: 1274Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
    yeah, herding cats can be tough. i posted all the stuff i've learned on the matter here:

    <a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=20&t=34675' target='_blank'>http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/in...ST&f=20&t=34675</a>

    yes, i know, shameless plug, what can i say?

    it's a thankless job. just keep getting in that chair, and find good servers *cough*check sig*cough*.
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