Marines Can't Win In Ns2.0

FriendlyGhost · August 2003

<div class="IPBDescription">aliens overpowered....</div> Hi, guys i'm the commander of Polish NS clan Hunters ( #hunters.ns, #ns.pl on quakenet). I play NS since it has been released, from the very begining. Well i'm totally suprised with ns2.0. It's totally unbalanced. Even more, marines don't win !!! I have never played such a round when marines won. Well, I suspect they probably could but it would be the couse of lack teamplay in aliens. This is terrible, before posting this topic I was commander in a game which lasted for 2h and stoped when i sold everything.... When aliens play as team there is no way to wipe them out, 3 or 4 onoses with redemption always devour fully equipped marines, it doesen't really matter if u have squad with GLs, Shotguns or HMGs. They just rush, eat and got redemptioned before we can kill them. Over and over, insane... I think this is the main reason of unbalancing. Second reason is changed resource system. After 5 mins of gameplay we got 7 (aliens) vs 2 (marines) in rts. Why? Becouse it's harder to defend them (i know electrify, tf, sentrys, blah) when i stop to build defenses, aliens in another 5 mins got 2 hive growing and fades or lerks, then bilebombs and all for nothing. Then we have some pretty good skulks which very fast can become redemptioned onoses and GG. Now, if the team skill is balanced and with great teamplay we can stop them from taking 3rd hive, but how we r supposed to take another 2 hives? If there r 4 onoses eating my squads and destroying all my rts over the map? So now games r not shorter, as U Flay planned, but longer and anoying. They usually end in 1h or 1:30h. ahh, I would forgot saying that playing less than 6 ppl at team is pointless :/

Now :
1) If u have a tactic or some clues which can be usefull pliz post it here or just mail me (jepetto@o2.pl) : How to play as marines?
2) If u r in dev team think about realeasing patch with great changes to make a game balanced.
3) Pliz gimme some support in changing my server to work without devour in pair with redemption or just remove redempt.

For now I play back my lovely ns 1.04 :]

If u dont belive me, that it's impossible to win as marines join our servers : 194.29.140.13:27015 and 217.97.169.80:27018

H|Xan^8th

Best regards to all of ya

Clint · August 2003

I have no comment really. Either than that you should just keep trying.

I've won the marine side about 6 times now. This goes to show you that anything is possible.

devicenull · August 2003

To quote the sticked topic: 2.0 FAQ
</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>The aliens are too strong now! You nerfed the jetpack! Shotties are over-powered! (etc.)
We've had a over 100 very astute and very skilled people that have been playing 2.0 for over three months. Please don't post ANY balance feedback for a couple weeks, as it's just too new for you guys to judge. Balance will not be flip-flopping quickly after release, like in 1.0x. Please post other feedback though.</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>

Your 3rd idea just makes no sense.. I can see that you are mad about bein devoured all the time
Give it time.
Everyone wants to have fun with devour...so they use it alot..
Did you have the JP Nerf plugin to remove the JP+HMG rushes?
If not, why do you want to remove a good alien strat, but not a good marine one in 1.04

Ollj · August 2003

1 - ns is not cs slowly push forward, fall back when wounded, dont rambo.
2 - 2.0 is way different than 1.04 . its all about the resources. 3 hives without 4-5 res are wothless for aliens... all tactics have changed.
3 - against Sens multiple Observatories and regular scanner sweeps are essential and more important than weapon upgrades. you have never secured an area as long as there is one cloaked structure or alien left in or nearby. it just waits for reinforcements and revenge.
4 - 2 hive lockdowns with 3 resnodes can own sens first because all aliens suck when they only have sens for along time. You just need 3-4 res and 2 hives for a draw game.
5 - welders and turret farms are cheaper. use them and defend the outposts good against bilebombing and onos camping.
6 - JP ownz onoses. HA ownz lerks and fades (without gorges). But only if there is no ramboing.

its simple. ppl playing ns first time and that like shooting play marines. ppl that know whats "fun" in ns play aliens more.

TickTock · August 2003

Actually I'm going to have to disagree with you. Yes, there is a problem I believe with devour+redeem, but other than that the game is quite balanced. You're just desperately applying old strategies to a new game, when you have to adapt. It's only been 4 days, so frankly there needs to be more time for new strats to be designed, but I encourage you to send at least a couple of your marines out simply to harass the aliens, just as the aliens harass the marines. It's a res race, so rush enemy nodes with most of your team, and have 2 people you can rely on do your own node planting for you. Also, make sure you protect what you plant. Abuse electrify, as that will prevent a node from being taken by anything less than a good res investment by a gorge, or a lerk that you are ignoring for too long.

It's generally not a bad idea for your res cap team to migrate towards one of the open hives. Plant a sturdy base in a hive early on so you can deny them a 3rd hive. Then migrate towards a 2nd, capping as you go. By the time you reach a 2nd hive, you should have the res from capping to support your men in equipment to take it down, or a siege base to take it down. Also, make sure your men stay together. You don't want an opportunistic skulk picking off your stragglers and getting enough res to go Onos. Although Oni are MUCH easier to kill now.

That, and r = are, u = you. Use full words, it makes you look smarter.

MrMojo · August 2003

Think back to 1.0x

Aliens mostly won there, until marines figured out that they need to work as a team ( or use jp/hmg, whatever <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'>). Just wait a couple of weeks, ffs.

Fieari · August 2003

I've only won 1.04 games as marines on teams that jetpack rushed. However, I've already won a number of marine games on 2.0, and in fact, have lost a number of games TO marines as aliens. And let me make it clear: it wasn't for stupidity on the part of the aliens.

The trick to beating aliens is a COMBINATION of hive and resource denial. Merely going for one or the other won't work at all. In the process of resource denial, the marines should be racking up a significant amount of resource.

Resource denial should be more of a consideration than hive denial, however. You need to secure one hive at least, simply because you don't want xenociding skulks in your base. With one hive denied them, if you then keep them away from resources, you won't SEE onos. Or perhaps you'll only see ONE onos, which is quite possible to take down. Maybe you'll see a scattering of fades, but they can be killed too, with the resources you'll be racking in.

There are two methods to resource denial. Sweeping, and Seiging.

Sweeping is the common method. The commander equips a fair sized squad with what he can afford, and sends them as a group to alien resource nodes as he scans them. He will then usually build AND SECURE these nodes with some turrets, and perhaps an observatory. Seiging can be more interesting, however. On some maps, there is a point on the map where one turret factory can supply seige turrets that can reach the vast majority of nodes on the map, which then only requires occasional pinging to take out the nodes. Even if the comm doesn't ping (which he should be doing, to help his troops as they move), this can supplement a sweep team as they attack manually.

Also, health spam is important. It may cost lots of resources, but it can deny alien resources, which is more crucial.

I've won and lost like this, from respective sides. It is counterable, it's not a BROKEN strategy, and it relies on good tactics... but that's what makes 2.0 so much fun!

coil · August 2003

Come back after you've play 2.0 a little longer, please.

Talesin · August 2003

As was noted, please check the 2.0 FAQ, as well as the reason that the S&I Forum has been temporarily closed.
In short.. play v2.0 for more than just a few days before complaining about a percieved balance issue. There are ways to counter every strat we could think of while testing it (including the redeem/devour Onii), and most have come to recognize that. If there is a problem, try out new tactics! The weapons have been tweaked, and your solution may come from an unexpected angle. In this case, it's been said that Jetpacks are the Onos trump. Shotguns are quite effective at getting rid of Redeeming aliens. So combine the two, and send a couple of JP/Shotgun Marines along with your HA/HMG train. With teamwork and flanking tactics, dropping Mines behind an Onos who has just charged in is quite effective as well, allowing three or four Shotgun-wielding Marines to close in and take him down. Redemption takes time to kick in, and a few Shotgunners firing point-blank at the beastie will kill it almost every time.

And so another 'X is overpowered!!' thread comes to a close.

<span style='color:red'>*LOCKED.*</span>

Marines Can't Win In Ns2.0

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