Without freebie devours, Redemption is almost always an inferior upgrade to Regen/Carapace. If you don't understand why, you should probably try playing both of them more often because it's fairly obvious. Rarely dying is irrelevant when you take into account the fact that the redemption Onos rarely accomplishes much of anything in his 2-3 second long base attacks, and spends an extremely large amount of downtime between them. And redemption Onoses are laughably useless when trying to defend a hive. The regen Onos can cause more destruction in one attack and can come back to do it again in much less time; the only real difference is that keeping yourself alive with regen actually takes skill. Just because marines get irritated when they can't get the kill doesn't mean it's overpowered...
ssjyodaJoin Date: 2002-03-05Member: 274Members, Squad Five Blue
How about, everytime you redem, the probablity decreases that u will redem the next time. And so on and so forth. Also, a limit to turrets will greatly help. Maybe 15 or so, so the battle is still for the most part, on the shoulders of the marines.
the problem is that 8 turrets per tf means you ahve to somehow link the turrets to the TF. if you had two TF's and 16 turrets and one TF fell, which ones should go offline? random? in any event its a LOT more programming work than the player would notice.
i dont think this is the type of thing you have to worry about anymore. It's been talked about <i>alot</i> and as far as i can see the dev team and co (playtesters, vets) are dealing with it. Rather than spend time on the forums talking about it think up some more strats so you dont have the onos problem. Easier said then done i know but it doesn't hurt to try.
Just played a 74 minute game on bast where losts of redeption onos won us the game. By us I mean the marines, we had a half dozen turrets in main aft and engine room, no upgrades and no tech after a pretty poor start and several phase gate faliures (WTH is up with them anyway?) Aliens were on 2 hives after 7-8 minutes and we had onos comming in a few minutes after than. Basically we held the two res and kept the onos redeeming with concentrated lmg fire. We added turrets when we could and very slowly teched up. The worst casualties was when 3 regen onos, a fade, a gorge and a lerk snuck into engine rom corridor. It took us nearly half an hour to secure than corridor but main aft was being hit by redept onos and they barely made a dent before redeeming. Eventualy we got full tech and the shotguns and GLs cut through them like butter.
If the aliens had regen onos attack main aft we wouldn't have stood a chance - but you cant eat a marine when he's 10 feet the other side of a line of turrets <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
A simple solution can be used to make the onos less cheap. Give it 850/1000 health and make redemption only work 30-50% of the time. Onos would still be taken down, but could still run away...would be taken down a lot more though I'm sure. I would go with 1000 HP, 750 AP and 25% redempt chance. That might still be too strong though.
<!--QuoteBegin--eaglec+Aug 16 2003, 09:06 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (eaglec @ Aug 16 2003, 09:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Just played a 74 minute game on bast where losts of redeption onos won us the game. By us I mean the marines, <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yep. These marines don't know just how lucky they are that so many nub onoses refuse to use anything but Redemption <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
- Change/elminate RFK system. - Digesting marine drops when Onos redeems. <b>- When you redeem, you used up the upgrade and have to use 2 res to get it again.</b>
I have the greatest redemption nerf that doesn't make any thing change. Make your redemption upgrade only last once per redemption. after you redeem back to your hive you have to re-evolve redemption to use it again. make redemption cost 5 res instead of 2 after the first redempt.
This does 2 things, first if you are assaulting a hive and onos are running out and killing some guys then getting redeemed and healing and doing it again, this makes them slow down to re-evolve their upgrade or risk dieing if its an emergency, secondly, it makes the redempt onos use up a lot of res so if they do ever die, they won't have 100 res to go onos again imediately.
Arge, Hand me the gasoline and a book of matches! Yeah why dont we nerf everything in the damn game that makes any class worth having. You know why all onos players take redemption?<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> becuase all the other def upgrades are nearly useless. For christ sakes, It cost a aleins entire 100 rs pole to go onoes and rine fanboys feal they should be a easy kill for two noobs with 20 res HMGs (which incedently another marines can pick up after you die meaning your team loses nothing.
How about they delete dropped weapons?? How about they take away upgarded damage to turrets? how about they either add damage upgrades to aleins and/or make all the def upgrades usful
I play marines alot, I com alot. I win nearly all the time. With a good com and just decent marines there is no reason a alien team should be able to win. Once most player actualty take time to figure out v2 instead of whining that there faveret team isent winning 60% of there matches they will actualy be able to play marines and win.
Hey, thats a great idea to fix redemption..... maybe 1 or 2 redemptions only.. heck, you could even make it 100% redeem chance..... You would have to kill them once or twice, but at least you would be able to end that endless cycle of Onos death......
If we let redemption work only a set number of times,this will actually FORCE onos to use lerk,fade and skulk support in attacking HA trains instead of just running at the HA train using a combination of stomp devour and gore.Maybe even charge if aliens can get 3rd hive up.Rinese and repeat.Heaven forbid that a single player should not be able to survive against a squad of marines repeatedly and gasp actually have to rely on other lifeform's support!
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I have the greatest redemption nerf that doesn't make any thing change. Make your redemption upgrade only last once per redemption. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->Um, look up one post. I just made the same suggestion right before you. Hopefully that's just a coincidence.... hopefully... for your sake. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Err why not just put a respawn time on redemption. Sure your invulnerable, but you have to wait 20 seconds to re-appear at the hive after redeeming. This could give marines time to weld, regroup and move on.
I just feel that electrifying res nodes and TF is really useless if any onos or even a fade with regen can take it out alone. The whole point of electrified TF or RTs was so you wouldn't have to worry about them being killed by anything but bile bombs or a large alien group. As i see it now it's a waste of 20/30 res as even a lerk can take it out with enough time. (i took out 3 elect RTs as a lerk by myself once)
<!--QuoteBegin--Trojan2+Aug 16 2003, 11:35 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Trojan2 @ Aug 16 2003, 11:35 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Arge, Hand me the gasoline and a book of matches! Yeah why dont we nerf everything in the damn game that makes any class worth having. You know why all onos players take redemption?<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> becuase all the other def upgrades are nearly useless. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Sorry but you're wrong, redemption is the one that's nearly useless in the hands of a skilled player... Surely if you play marines that often you've seen how fast Onoses redeem when under fire from L3 weapons of any kind? Just think that for every one of those rushes where he hurts nothing before being redeemed, he has to sit at his hive until he heals(a rather slow process if the team didn't bother to drop D chambers there), then make the trek back to your base, only to be redeemed again. I play Regeneration exclusively now and I'm usually leaps and bounds above the redemption Onoses in kills and structures destroyed...
I think the majority of redemption Onoses do it because they don't feel like learning when to pull out to keep yourself alive(a skill that's crucial for all aliens), and thus pick the path of least resistance. Apparently most of them haven't figured out yet how much usefulness they actually sacrifice for their "immortality". And I have a hard time comprehending how marines say they're so overpowered when they are incapable of damaging a defended base with a reasonable number of turrets...
Really I perfer car for my def upgrade as onos combined that with clerity Im fast enough to get in smack the people around devour one and run like hell iunno I find that onos seem to redempt at like 200 hp its super quick.
matsoMaster of PatchesJoin Date: 2002-11-05Member: 7000Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Squad Five Gold, Reinforced - Shadow, NS2 Community Developer
<!--QuoteBegin--eaglec+Aug 16 2003, 09:06 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (eaglec @ Aug 16 2003, 09:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Just played a 74 minute game on bast where losts of redeption onos won us the game. By us I mean the marines, we had a half dozen turrets in main aft and engine room, no upgrades and no tech after a pretty poor start and several phase gate faliures (WTH is up with them anyway?) Aliens were on 2 hives after 7-8 minutes and we had onos comming in a few minutes after than. Basically we held the two res and kept the onos redeeming with concentrated lmg fire. We added turrets when we could and very slowly teched up. The worst casualties was when 3 regen onos, a fade, a gorge and a lerk snuck into engine rom corridor. It took us nearly half an hour to secure than corridor but main aft was being hit by redept onos and they barely made a dent before redeeming. Eventualy we got full tech and the shotguns and GLs cut through them like butter.
If the aliens had regen onos attack main aft we wouldn't have stood a chance - but you cant eat a marine when he's 10 feet the other side of a line of turrets <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Bet they had sensory too ... engine room/aft junction is EXTREMLY hard to take out without MC's. Onoses has to crawl on their bellies to get into the engine room hive, so the only effective attacking force is actually gorges, while Onoses are relegated to cover the gorges retreat and backs...
And gorges without MC's can't really harm an activly defended marine base.
I don't like very much redemption when I play on the alien side.
Understand me well: I don't mean it should be removed or what, I just say that I don't like it <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
I almost never play as Onos, because so many players seem to only lust for this class. So I usually play as a Lerk, or a Gorge.
When we lead a coordinated assault on a marine base, there's usualy at least one Onos (usualy two) and fades, but only a few Lerks and scarcely a Gorge. When I play as a Lerk I usualy spend my energy on Umbra and Primal Scream to improve the eficiency of the Onos and Fades rush into the marine base, but I really get annoyed when I see them suddenly fade out (for a Fade, at least, I could understand <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->), leaving the support classes lonely (if marines decide to rush out, then we won't live very long).
When I play as a Gorge I usualy spend my energy on healing the Fades and Onos that are charging the base when they retreat, but I feel completely useless if they start to redeem, and by the time they get back to the front, we may already have been slain or the rines have built back their defences.
For me, a good assault is an assault that put alot of pressure on the opposing camp, giving them not time to breath, ruining the moral of the troops, and rendering their defences useless little by little.
That's a siege. But if you let go the steam repeatedly, then it is way less effective.
A good siege is acheived when people of the other side just want to quit (what they should never do, even if they want of course^^).
Whats more useful : Risking getting owned by a co-ordinated HA with shotty/hmg team and having to save up 100 res but being able to hurt their main base more or 95% godmode and not being able to hurt their main base a lot before you redempt.
I pick the latter.We can always go umbra/bile/charge their base but as a lone onos against a squad of marines,95% godmode is indipensable.
And btw whenever im in aliens i notice the gorgs never seem to run out of res when onos comes in.They can afford to drop chambers wherever they want to.
I can't remember the last time I acutally used redemption. I think I stopped using redemption when I stopped using onos. Fade is more fun for me. Now I use regen/cara because redemption sucks on a fade.
Several people have suggested giving the marines res whenever an alien redeems. First of all, I don't think this would balance the problem of redemption onos being too powerful. Secondly, this makes redemption less useful for lower aliens, and completely useless on a skulk. For people that suggest the redemption upgrade only working once, would that alien not be able to get any defense upgrade afterwards or could they keep getting redemtion? If they get nothing afterwards it would be quite useless, and if it has to be gotten repeatedly it becomes less useful on lower life forms.
On the subject of turret farms, if a limit was imposed it would have to be per area. If it were per tf, comms that wanted turret farms would simply build more tf's.
The number of onos ive seen redeem only to leave the rest of the team there to die horribly is unbelievable, 3 gorges an onos a fade and a lerk attacked base, doing well until the onos redemed, then it was over in a matter of seconds, if the onos had regen the game would have been over at that point, not lasted another hour <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The number of onos ive seen redeem only to leave the rest of the team there to die horribly is unbelievable, 3 gorges an onos a fade and a lerk attacked base, doing well until the onos redemed, then it was over in a matter of seconds, if the onos had regen the game would have been over at that point, not lasted another hour <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
In fact, Redeem should be removed not to please the marines, but for the good of the alien teamates <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
You dont use redempt to smash a marine base,you use it to smash the marine squads that are powerless to stop you coming back from the dead and killing at least one of them each time.If they DO manage to kill you,guess what,your team should own at least half the map's RTs compared to about um 1 of marines(onos + marine rts = ?) and the RFK you get is incredible.....everytime i see a redempt onos die to marine squads away from their base,they can go onos IMMEDIATELY....yes.....redempt works THAT well.....
You use cara with gorg building DCs further back with umbra,primal scream and bile bomb support...
Anyone who uses redempt onos for just rushing into base and mindless goring anything in sight should really stop to think.....
Its like saying cara for fade/onos sucks because you have to run all the way from the marine base back to hive to heal....its being used the wrong way.....
Comments
Basically we held the two res and kept the onos redeeming with concentrated lmg fire. We added turrets when we could and very slowly teched up. The worst casualties was when 3 regen onos, a fade, a gorge and a lerk snuck into engine rom corridor. It took us nearly half an hour to secure than corridor but main aft was being hit by redept onos and they barely made a dent before redeeming. Eventualy we got full tech and the shotguns and GLs cut through them like butter.
If the aliens had regen onos attack main aft we wouldn't have stood a chance - but you cant eat a marine when he's 10 feet the other side of a line of turrets <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Yep. These marines don't know just how lucky they are that so many nub onoses refuse to use anything but Redemption <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
- Change/elminate RFK system.
- Digesting marine drops when Onos redeems.
<b>- When you redeem, you used up the upgrade and have to use 2 res to get it again.</b>
This does 2 things, first if you are assaulting a hive and onos are running out and killing some guys then getting redeemed and healing and doing it again, this makes them slow down to re-evolve their upgrade or risk dieing if its an emergency, secondly, it makes the redempt onos use up a lot of res so if they do ever die, they won't have 100 res to go onos again imediately.
Yeah why dont we nerf everything in the damn game that makes any class worth having. You know why all onos players take redemption?<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> becuase all the other def upgrades are nearly useless. For christ sakes, It cost a aleins entire 100 rs pole to go onoes and rine fanboys feal they should be a easy kill for two noobs with 20 res HMGs (which incedently another marines can pick up after you die meaning your team loses nothing.
How about they delete dropped weapons??
How about they take away upgarded damage to turrets?
how about they either add damage upgrades to aleins and/or make all the def upgrades usful
I play marines alot, I com alot. I win nearly all the time. With a good com and just decent marines there is no reason a alien team should be able to win. Once most player actualty take time to figure out v2 instead of whining that there faveret team isent winning 60% of there matches they will actualy be able to play marines and win.
<!--emo&::sentry::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/turret.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='turret.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::sentry::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/turret.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='turret.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo-->
(not my idea! sorry, I forgot who posted it)
I just feel that electrifying res nodes and TF is really useless if any onos or even a fade with regen can take it out alone. The whole point of electrified TF or RTs was so you wouldn't have to worry about them being killed by anything but bile bombs or a large alien group. As i see it now it's a waste of 20/30 res as even a lerk can take it out with enough time. (i took out 3 elect RTs as a lerk by myself once)
Yeah why dont we nerf everything in the damn game that makes any class worth having. You know why all onos players take redemption?<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> becuase all the other def upgrades are nearly useless. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sorry but you're wrong, redemption is the one that's nearly useless in the hands of a skilled player... Surely if you play marines that often you've seen how fast Onoses redeem when under fire from L3 weapons of any kind? Just think that for every one of those rushes where he hurts nothing before being redeemed, he has to sit at his hive until he heals(a rather slow process if the team didn't bother to drop D chambers there), then make the trek back to your base, only to be redeemed again. I play Regeneration exclusively now and I'm usually leaps and bounds above the redemption Onoses in kills and structures destroyed...
I think the majority of redemption Onoses do it because they don't feel like learning when to pull out to keep yourself alive(a skill that's crucial for all aliens), and thus pick the path of least resistance. Apparently most of them haven't figured out yet how much usefulness they actually sacrifice for their "immortality". And I have a hard time comprehending how marines say they're so overpowered when they are incapable of damaging a defended base with a reasonable number of turrets...
Basically we held the two res and kept the onos redeeming with concentrated lmg fire. We added turrets when we could and very slowly teched up. The worst casualties was when 3 regen onos, a fade, a gorge and a lerk snuck into engine rom corridor. It took us nearly half an hour to secure than corridor but main aft was being hit by redept onos and they barely made a dent before redeeming. Eventualy we got full tech and the shotguns and GLs cut through them like butter.
If the aliens had regen onos attack main aft we wouldn't have stood a chance - but you cant eat a marine when he's 10 feet the other side of a line of turrets <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bet they had sensory too ... engine room/aft junction is EXTREMLY hard to take out without MC's. Onoses has to crawl on their bellies to get into the engine room hive, so the only effective attacking force is actually gorges, while Onoses are relegated to cover the gorges retreat and backs...
And gorges without MC's can't really harm an activly defended marine base.
Understand me well: I don't mean it should be removed or what, I just say that I don't like it <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
I almost never play as Onos, because so many players seem to only lust for this class. So I usually play as a Lerk, or a Gorge.
When we lead a coordinated assault on a marine base, there's usualy at least one Onos (usualy two) and fades, but only a few Lerks and scarcely a Gorge.
When I play as a Lerk I usualy spend my energy on Umbra and Primal Scream to improve the eficiency of the Onos and Fades rush into the marine base, but I really get annoyed when I see them suddenly fade out (for a Fade, at least, I could understand <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->), leaving the support classes lonely (if marines decide to rush out, then we won't live very long).
When I play as a Gorge I usualy spend my energy on healing the Fades and Onos that are charging the base when they retreat, but I feel completely useless if they start to redeem, and by the time they get back to the front, we may already have been slain or the rines have built back their defences.
For me, a good assault is an assault that put alot of pressure on the opposing camp, giving them not time to breath, ruining the moral of the troops, and rendering their defences useless little by little.
That's a siege.
But if you let go the steam repeatedly, then it is way less effective.
A good siege is acheived when people of the other side just want to quit (what they should never do, even if they want of course^^).
I pick the latter.We can always go umbra/bile/charge their base but as a lone onos against a squad of marines,95% godmode is indipensable.
And btw whenever im in aliens i notice the gorgs never seem to run out of res when onos comes in.They can afford to drop chambers wherever they want to.
For people that suggest the redemption upgrade only working once, would that alien not be able to get any defense upgrade afterwards or could they keep getting redemtion? If they get nothing afterwards it would be quite useless, and if it has to be gotten repeatedly it becomes less useful on lower life forms.
On the subject of turret farms, if a limit was imposed it would have to be per area. If it were per tf, comms that wanted turret farms would simply build more tf's.
...so true, just as I said before...
*sigh* <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
...
Lol, <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
In fact, Redeem should be removed not to please the marines, but for the good of the alien teamates <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
You use cara with gorg building DCs further back with umbra,primal scream and bile bomb support...
Anyone who uses redempt onos for just rushing into base and mindless goring anything in sight should really stop to think.....
Its like saying cara for fade/onos sucks because you have to run all the way from the marine base back to hive to heal....its being used the wrong way.....