Water In Natural Selection
Lt_Gravity
Join Date: 2003-04-28 Member: 15909Members
Join Date: 2003-04-28 Member: 15909Members
<div class="IPBDescription">this atmospheric entity causes trouble</div> is it just me or is it really this complicated to place water in maps as you like it to be?
what I figured out that works:
- to place a func_water entity in a map (as long as the center is IN the map)
- to place a solid with water texture on it (ingame its still water but it creates a "shadow")
- to change the shape of the entity with clipping tool
- to change the shape with the vertex manipulation tool
things that doesnt work:
- unify two different func_water to one entity
- func_water that consist of mulitple brushes
possible errors:
- the water is present but you cant see any surface. if u dive its all like it should be.
- the water is not present
- two unified brushes are seperated with the "moses wall", means every brush exists for its own. its more like swimming from one "pool" to another. there is a visible border sometimes
possible ways to fix this:
- make a func_water that covers all the areas you want the water to be (make shure the center of the entity is IN the map, its no problem if the entity touches freespace or even ends in it)
- take alternate methods like func_illlusionary if the water is too low to swim in (make shure a player cant drop in it from a high altitude cause water prevents falling damage, func_illusionary doesnt, I think <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> )
- you cant fix it at all <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
so there is one question left:
how is it possible to create areas that are full of water but twist and bend so the center would be in freespace? maybe I can fix my problem with one of these methods but additional information is allways welcome ^^
what I figured out that works:
- to place a func_water entity in a map (as long as the center is IN the map)
- to place a solid with water texture on it (ingame its still water but it creates a "shadow")
- to change the shape of the entity with clipping tool
- to change the shape with the vertex manipulation tool
things that doesnt work:
- unify two different func_water to one entity
- func_water that consist of mulitple brushes
possible errors:
- the water is present but you cant see any surface. if u dive its all like it should be.
- the water is not present
- two unified brushes are seperated with the "moses wall", means every brush exists for its own. its more like swimming from one "pool" to another. there is a visible border sometimes
possible ways to fix this:
- make a func_water that covers all the areas you want the water to be (make shure the center of the entity is IN the map, its no problem if the entity touches freespace or even ends in it)
- take alternate methods like func_illlusionary if the water is too low to swim in (make shure a player cant drop in it from a high altitude cause water prevents falling damage, func_illusionary doesnt, I think <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> )
- you cant fix it at all <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
so there is one question left:
how is it possible to create areas that are full of water but twist and bend so the center would be in freespace? maybe I can fix my problem with one of these methods but additional information is allways welcome ^^
Comments
than 512 units.
than 512 units. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Splitting the water up into multiple func_water entities is the solution AFAIK. I've never made a map with enough water that I needed to do this.
Cos in Quake mapping I made some twisty water maps where the water brushes had the null texture on the faces that meet to get rid of the 'moses wall' effect, does this work in half-life?
[Edit] How about making all the brushes, and texturing only the top surface with water, and the other surfaces as null, then grouping all the brushes, and then tie-to-entity the whole lot at once?
- func_water HAS TO BE boxlike. if u create a wedge...
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this wont work. hl cant render the surface correct and the seperated patches will be visible, the borders wont fit each other and it will look weird.
maybe now I can create my water...
- sometimes water tends to create "hollow" brushes.
you can see a surface... but there is no water under it!
how this may happen:
as far as I noticed, this may happen if you create a box with any texture, changing it to a func_water and then changing the texture to any watertexture. also may be invalid brushes.
- water creates a lot of patches on the surface.
it seemed to me that it doesnt matter how you scaled the texture. the patch will allway be the same. its used to simulate the movement of the water.
- rendermodes of the water can be used to lower r-speeds.
funny thing: the water (no matter if tied to entity or not) seems to be a masive wall to the hl engine if the rendermode isnt changed. for exapmle: any additiv value will kill this effect.
the brushes underwater will be dropped. underwater the brushes of the surrounding abouve the surface will be dropped. the water might look little "massive" but this can be used to create detailed areas if you know how to use it.
- ns specific: most weapons doesnt work underwater. funny to see an onos, which stomp and charge is completely useless, skulks without parasite... try it out <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
I think there is nothing in hl more buggy than water. one day all creatins with water are a success, on the other day all things go wrong. so dont use water if you dont need to. shure, its a nice effect but it can resut in a lot of unpredicable, unrepairable errors. besides gameplay probs.
funny thing: the water (no matter if tied to entity or not) seems to be a masive wall to the hl engine if the rendermode isnt changed. for exapmle: any additiv value will kill this effect.
the brushes underwater will be dropped. underwater the brushes of the surrounding abouve the surface will be dropped. the water might look little "massive" but this can be used to create detailed areas if you know how to use it.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
wow. this is like DN3D's (Duke Nukem 3D) water effect...
you could give tons and tons of effects and detail to the underwater area yet never be effected because the underwater area was effectively half way accross the map and on a different elevation and thus couldn't be "seen into" by the engine. (though there was a trick for transparent water and other water tricks... it involved too much work to be worth it, though)
- func_pushable (not too important in ns) cant be placed IN water!!!
func_pushables have the ability to swim in the water, I believe its 3/4 underwater, 1/4 abouve... if you want the entity to start in the water, simply place it OVER the surface. when the map starts the pushables will automatically fall into and start swimming XD
- areas with water show up as "outside-world" areas in the minimap. its little weird because water is an entity, so the calculating for the minimap should leave it out. it seems that water, even with rendermode set to additiv is kinda worldarchitecture. but I dont understand why the whole area will be left out, not even walls show up...
only way to fix it: repaint your minimap sprites ^^
The mini map works by looking at what areas are buildable. Any location that the commander can drop a medkit is colored, any part that he can't (water, ?nobuilds?) is not colored. The shade of the blue indicates relative elevation (to commander mode I believe).
This can be another problem with water. If you abuse it on your paths people will have a hard(er) time using the mini map.
amckern