Cnc Generals: Zero Hour
SentrySteve
.txt Join Date: 2002-03-09 Member: 290Members, Constellation
.txt Join Date: 2002-03-09 Member: 290Members, Constellation
in Off-Topic
<div class="IPBDescription">The GLA live!</div> I was a huge fan of Command and Conquer Generals and think its one of the best RTS games out there. I think that due to structure interpedently, the massive differences in the armies / units, and the whole "general points" system. I was pumped to get Zero Hour after trying to find information about it (the EA site was lacking...) and everything sounded great. 30 new units, 15 new tech upgrades, a few new tech buildings (forget how many) and this whole new idea with 9 Generals (3 for each army.) The General rundown is thus: USA has: A turtler General (masses particle cannons – very devastating if you cannot kill this General early on) an Air Force General (has special units like the King Raptors, Stealth Comanches, and the ability for Infantry in a Chinook to shoot out!), and an all new unit based Laser General. This General uses Lasers on his tanks, and his base defenses. China, an army that I cannot stand due to the fact they are usually the most overpowered army in the game, I do not know much about. I know one General is a “nuke” general – all his tanks have mini-nuclear shells that they shoot, etc. The other is a Infantry General, and a tank rushing General. The GLA have a stealth general (his whole base/units are invisible unless scanned, and a toxin general. The General I was most eager to test the GLA's (my favorite army) new Demolition General. Unlike the other 2 GLA Generals, the Demolitions General has his motorcycles start with Terrorists (people with bombs strapped to themselves) on them. I _really_ found this excellent because I have a strategy that is not too common. (Like many of the Generals he also have about 5 or 6 things that only he gets – advanced demo traps, cheaper bomb trucks, any unit can explode on command, etc)
The overall goal of my strategy in Generals was to kill their command center (what produces dozers) within 3 minuets of the games start. This part was easy. What I then needed to do was to 'hunt down' all the other dozers that could have gone to expansions, etc. (If their command center, and all of their dozers die - they are unable to build anymore buildings.) This part was very hard because just a few rocket infantry could really mess up my attacks. What the Demo General offered me was the ability to use almost an 'air strike' (the motorcycles go SO fast, its hard to react to them - much like an air attack) on the remaining Dozers that could have gone all over the map - thus making my strategy that much more effective. Out of my 3 quick matches that I've played, this has worked 3 times.
What that one general's unit has done to my personal strategy is a big benefit - and that’s just one General out of 9 - one new unit out of 30. There’s so much new cool stuff in Zero Hour (Mother of all bombs, Helix 2, Specter Gunship, Attack Tunnel...) that is it easily worth your $30 - or $25 if you buy it at Best Buy. Zero Hour adds that extra level of strategy that I was looking for and in my eyes it’s a much better investment over Frozen Throne ($40 at best buy.)
The overall goal of my strategy in Generals was to kill their command center (what produces dozers) within 3 minuets of the games start. This part was easy. What I then needed to do was to 'hunt down' all the other dozers that could have gone to expansions, etc. (If their command center, and all of their dozers die - they are unable to build anymore buildings.) This part was very hard because just a few rocket infantry could really mess up my attacks. What the Demo General offered me was the ability to use almost an 'air strike' (the motorcycles go SO fast, its hard to react to them - much like an air attack) on the remaining Dozers that could have gone all over the map - thus making my strategy that much more effective. Out of my 3 quick matches that I've played, this has worked 3 times.
What that one general's unit has done to my personal strategy is a big benefit - and that’s just one General out of 9 - one new unit out of 30. There’s so much new cool stuff in Zero Hour (Mother of all bombs, Helix 2, Specter Gunship, Attack Tunnel...) that is it easily worth your $30 - or $25 if you buy it at Best Buy. Zero Hour adds that extra level of strategy that I was looking for and in my eyes it’s a much better investment over Frozen Throne ($40 at best buy.)
Comments
There's no unit limit. You just send tank squad after tank squad into their base with no worry with 5 War Factories building on end.
There's no 'max selection' of 12 units, so you don't have to alternate between 4 squads to get where you want to (this I hate the most, the computer can control them all at once, but we can't, at least, not as well).
Turrets actually work, and are not something just to delay the guys.
Lastly, SUPERWEAPONS. These I think are the best aspect of C&C (read below).
Imagine this. You have made a last stand at your base, fortifying it with billions of Patriot Missiles and thousands of tanks. They have a huge tank squad to match yours outside, but they don't have patriot missiles, suckers!
Suddenly, an Ion Cannon comes down and moves along your defenses, decimating a good 3/4 or so, and then their units move in. Without your structure defenses and units, you're toast! I love that game.
It's a great game, though. Really want to get it, just don't have the money.
Its all about the bottom dollar with EA, I felt terrible when they acquired Westwood. And Hands down Red Alert was a better game than Generals.
I really dont play Single Player campaigns becuase I think all of them are jokes. The only SP campaign's I've played was Half Life, by choice, and WarCraft 3 becuase my Internet was down for about 3 days. The sides are not perfectly balanced - which the advantage leading to China - but every tactic they have is counterable by both armies. The famous One Gat/Flame tank rush I can stop every time with my USA missle defenders. The key to fighting China is to have anti-armor units very quickly. They are overpowered, but a skilled player can easily win over them. Online I think General's is top notch. When I do a terriorst rush, or sneak 3 or 4 bomb trucks into their base to take out key structres as my USA ally waits for his power to go down so his aurora bombers can take out his superweapon, clearing the way for my scropions to attack -- you get the feel of how well everything comes together. It is even more so in Zero Hour, but obviously if you <i>hated</i> CNCG, you will probably also hate Zero Hour.
I did not like C&C generals and Westwood are sellouts.
I did not like C&C generals and Westwood are sellouts. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Agreed.
Since when did CNCG have a story to expand on anyway <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
I did not like C&C generals and Westwood are sellouts. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Agreed.
Since when did CNCG have a story to expand on anyway <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm assuming this time the three factions <i>really</i> don't like each other.
As Smokenova said, all the infantry units look terrible. Vehicles are awesome, but the infantry really are walking sticks holding sticks with sticks attached. And what kind of terrorist army makes their units BRIGHT GREEN?!
I just played one online game where I was the USA Super Weapon General. (She cannot buy tanks.) Miss Alexander is her name. Her Power Plant upgrade gives her 300% more power from the plants (only gives the other USA generals 100% more for the same price) and her Particle Cannons are HALF THE PRICE!
This lovely lady also has "EMP Patriots." (EMP Patriots have the ability to disable tanks and ground forces – does not work well against Air attacks – which is clearly this General’s weakness – a few air hits on her power and she’s in crap creak without a paddle.) When EMP’s are combined with Firebases (a new defense structure – it has a big artillery cannon, and the ability to garrison four infantry -- she has no Patriot Missiles) they are very devastating. In this one online game a china tank attacked me with about 10 or 15 tanks - I'd say the EMP Patriots "stunned" about 8 of them, I had 4 raptors kill 4 tanks - and my Aurora Alpha bomber drop a small fuel air bomb on the rest - all while they were being bombarded by my Firebases. By the end of the game I has used one Mother Of All Bombs (a 4,000 upgrade in the Strategy Center - you must have Fuel Air Bomb before you upgrade) and had about 5 Particle Cannons. I've come to the conclusion that if you let a player playing as Miss Alexander to survive into late-game -- you're toast.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
Beh, Generals' multiplayer is awful. 99% of (my) games end up in a disconnect; this is not counting timing out while transferring maps, extreme slowness<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Alot of these problems were fixed in the recent 1.6 patch - disconnects are not nearly as common now, but still happen.
** Oh, and to everyone else - this topic was not created so everyone could say they're boycotting EA - I dont care if you buy their games or not - keep the comments to Generals and ZH please.
I just played one online game where I was the USA Super Weapon General. (She cannot buy tanks.) Miss Alexander is her name. Her Power Plant upgrade gives her 300% more power from the plants (only gives the other USA generals 100% more for the same price) and her Particle Cannons are HALF THE PRICE!
This lovely lady also has "EMP Patriots." (EMP Patriots have the ability to disable tanks and ground forces – does not work well against Air attacks – which is clearly this General’s weakness – a few air hits on her power and she’s in crap creak without a paddle.) When EMP’s are combined with Firebases (a new defense structure – it has a big artillery cannon, and the ability to garrison four infantry -- she has no Patriot Missiles) they are very devastating. In this one online game a china tank attacked me with about 10 or 15 tanks - I'd say the EMP Patriots "stunned" about 8 of them, I had 4 raptors kill 4 tanks - and my Aurora Alpha bomber drop a small fuel air bomb on the rest - all while they were being bombarded by my Firebases. By the end of the game I has used one Mother Of All Bombs (a 4,000 upgrade in the Strategy Center - you must have Fuel Air Bomb before you upgrade) and had about 5 Particle Cannons. I've come to the conclusion that if you let a player playing as Miss Alexander to survive into late-game -- you're toast.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
Beh, Generals' multiplayer is awful. 99% of (my) games end up in a disconnect; this is not counting timing out while transferring maps, extreme slowness<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Alot of these problems were fixed in the recent 1.6 patch - disconnects are not nearly as common now, but still happen.
** Oh, and to everyone else - this topic was not created so everyone could say they're boycotting EA - I dont care if you buy their games or not - keep the comments to Generals and ZH please. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well.... "everyone else" Consisting of me and Dr.D have names....you could've said COMMIE DR.D PIZZ-OFF! <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
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it’s a much better investment over Frozen Throne ($40 at best buy.)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You must not have been watching for the sales, I got my copy of TFT for $20. And even with the $35 average price tag, its well worth it; Many many many new single player missions, almost a whole game unto itself, and the new heroes, units, spells, etc, add a lot more strategy to the game and more fun to online play. AND the world editor has been changed, its so much easier to make custom units, and even heroes, without needing any third party software.
So next time, don't bash a game just because of its price tag.
Woah woah do NOT use air power against Miss Alexander. Perhaps you forgot that EMP kills any air unit instantly. Using Alexander I watched as an opponent sent 10 Helix gunships against me. Lets just say he wasted a lot of cash. It's almost impossible to use your aircraft-delivered super-weapons against Alexander; one shot from her patriots and down they go. I've found the best tactic against her is to either hit her early, hard and fast, or if she gets a base up, lay seige to it. Her patriots will still shoot down Tomahawk missiles but you can get through them. If you're China or the GLA use Inferno cannons or rocket buggies and bust through her base defenses. Once they're down she's easy prey; no tanks for her means not much of a mobile defense. Still, she's one tough lady.
I think EA should work on making a new C&C version that's actually warlike, balance tested and has good graphics (Tiberian Sun looked better than Generals in my opinion). Red Alert 2 (I think that's the one...I had the PS1 version) with modern graphics and some more tweaks.
If you really like RTS I would like to suggest Rise of Nations (by Big Huge Games). While they do have a game network, last time I checked not many people are on it (lent my CD to some people down the hall for now, so I haven't checked it in a while...it's fairly new). Single Player is well balanced. Tommorow I'll make a thread detailing why everyone should buy it, because I don't want to side track this.
Recap: C&C needs better graphics, better gameplay and better storylines before I buy anything related to it anytime soon...I'm especially distasteful of that EA logo you can't pass by (like in MoH.
Time for bed now...English at 8:00.
man did that suck a lot of hours out of my life, great fun
never tired general mainly becuase i bought the orginal C&C and didnt like it at all
maybe ill get the demo or something and try it out one day
But in the end Red Alert 2 was much more fun.....
My main source of angst online (and versus the computer, I suppose) is the age old rush-"strategy" that no game has yet managed to wheedle out successfully. Unit limits wouldn't and won't really help; they just annoy. There's <i>no</i> way to keep a game playable without rushes, mores the pity <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> It just feels so unfair when you flatten a man with more tanks than can fill a screen...
I might try ZH but the first game's AI drove me insane. Why do gattling cannons spatter bullets off heavily armoured tanks instead of the humvees, technicals and infantry nearby? The reverse goes for patriot sites, and the latter are especially frustrating because of their inability to hit distant moving infantry. I'll have to see how much it costs over in the UK.
Micromanage. Tell your gatlings to aim at infantry. Tell your patriots to fire at tanks. The new American defensive structure, the Firebase, is great for killing off infantry, plus you've got flashbangs and pathfinders.
At my best buy TFT is $40. I also was not bashing TFT due to its price tag - but maybe I will now becuase I know it upsets you -- TFT SUCKS BECUASE OF ITS PRICE!!!!!
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Woah woah do NOT use air power against Miss Alexander. Perhaps you forgot that EMP kills any air unit instantly<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Maybe Helix 2's die after one hit, due to their slow speed, but I've seen Migs and Raptors get in and out with little damage - the EMP missle misses and explodes slightly behind Raptors and Migs - so you can use them against her.
man did that suck a lot of hours out of my life, great fun
never tired general mainly becuase i bought the orginal C&C and didnt like it at all
maybe ill get the demo or something and try it out one day <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Heh, was strange the first time I read that:
Man did it suck ............ a lot of hours out of my life
<!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
I hated those in Tiberian Sun.... but I got used to them eventually.
True that they DO suck though. I have "Generals" around here somewhere.
I should probably try it one day...
Heh, a valid point, but it shouldn't really be necessary. It's mind-melting when dealing with a large map and/or enemy force, but, more to the point, I'm on 56k. Says all you need to know about my feelings regarding multiplayer micromanagement <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Cloaked bases? Urgh. I might need to reconsider...
I saved you $30 or $25 dollars, and the GLA Stealth General is not very good. Every army now has a stealth detector unit. Every builing that the GLA Stealth General wants to stealth must be upgraded individually - its very costly and has no great advantage. This General is also unable to build tanks - he relies on Quad Cannons and Infantry ( Rocket Troops and Terrorists, mainly) in order to get the job done. To sorta "counter" not having any tanks - his $600 hijackers are cloaked when moving (other generals' Hijackers are only cloaked when not moving.)
Believe me when I say it is not expensive to throw in a Radar Van in with your tanks - thereby uncloaking his entire base. It is in no way overpowered.