2.1 Requires Steam

EmanonEmanon Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16254Members, Constellation
edited November 2003 in General Server Discussion
<div class="IPBDescription">Windows VS Linux</div> Which is better for the steam version of NS, Trying to get ready ahead of time for when 2.1 is released.

Please include performance compared to 2.01, better or worse.

Include what version of linux or windows you suggest.

Please Dont discuss how much you dont like steam or do.


Thanks

Emanon
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Comments

  • Lightning_BlueLightning_Blue Sunny Domination Join Date: 2002-12-11 Member: 10647Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Silver
    edited November 2003
    So far, my Linux 2.01 (final) server is doing horrible on steam.

    AMD MP 2.0 GHZ. 16 player server on Linux.

    For WON, 3.1.1.0c, NS_NOTHING, 10 players, 5% CPU.

    For STEAM, 3.1.1.1 = 1.1.2.0, NS_nothing, 10 players, 60% CPU.


    Server behaved perfectly well with 3.1.1.0, with steam it's just a nightmare. Fill the server above 14 slots and everyone's pings jumps to 200+ with CPU usuage 80-90% on maps like lost and eclipse. I imagine hera or bast would outright crash it after a short while.

    Valve doesn't seem to care. CS Server ops are having the same problem.

    From what I hear, it works on windows just dandy.
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  • billcatbillcat Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 4903Members, Constellation
    You have to remember that the guys that run valve came from MS. They have to have loads of MS stock and there is no real reason for them to make the linux version go fast, quite the opposite, seeing it slower than windows is in their best interest. If for no other reason that the fact that their stock goes up as MS does well in the server market.

    It seems they are also AMD ****, every other steam server release updates something in the AMD optd files but the intel files are ignored. Why MS wintel types would pimp out AMD crap is beyond me but that seems to be the case. Sometimes on HLDS they even seem to suggest that the answer to all linux server slowdowns is to run an AMD chipeset. This is bs tho because people are running dual 2.4 boxes with 2g of ram and still not able to do well.

    On the HLDS mailing list they claim they are contacting intel to resolve the linux slowdowns. This seems a bit like contacting the ford to correct your alignment or some random car issue. There are pleanty of linux kernel hackers out there who would love to help make this code go faster and would do a better job than intel.

    I can hear the call now:
    "Hello, welcome to intel how can I help? Ok, so you say your ap runs like **** on linux? How does it run on windows with the same processor? Just fine? Ok then it's not a processor issue, its yer OS. Thx for calling intel, have a nice day."

    People bring these issues up almost every week on the HLDS mailing list only to be ignored. I love to play NS but if I have to run a wintel server to get it working they've lost a server.
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  • Lightning_BlueLightning_Blue Sunny Domination Join Date: 2002-12-11 Member: 10647Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Silver
    edited November 2003
    You forget, I do run an AMD processor. It makes no difference.

    And yes, the idea that Valve sold out TO MS is running rampant on the HLDS mailing list. And being ignored just the same.

    If this is indeed the case, it'll kill the HL server scene because most hosts use linux because of the price.
    Making most hosts force switch to windows would simply shut them down because of the cost of having to buy a separate license for each server. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->

    Forgot to meantion, Metamod and Adminmod installed in both cases (STEAM and WON), even tried it vanilla on STEAM and it made no difference!
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  • EmanonEmanon Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16254Members, Constellation
    Great responces it helps alot. Any more would be even better.
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  • CommunistWithAGunCommunistWithAGun Local Propaganda Guy Join Date: 2003-04-30 Member: 15953Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--billcat+Nov 25 2003, 03:28 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (billcat @ Nov 25 2003, 03:28 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> You have to remember that the guys that run valve came from MS. They have to have loads of MS stock and there is no real reason for them to make the linux version go fast, quite the opposite, seeing it slower than windows is in their best interest. If for no other reason that the fact that their stock goes up as MS does well in the server market.

    It seems they are also AMD ****, every other steam server release updates something in the AMD optd files but the intel files are ignored. Why MS wintel types would pimp out AMD crap is beyond me but that seems to be the case. Sometimes on HLDS they even seem to suggest that the answer to all linux server slowdowns is to run an AMD chipeset. This is bs tho because people are running dual 2.4 boxes with 2g of ram and still not able to do well.

    On the HLDS mailing list they claim they are contacting intel to resolve the linux slowdowns. This seems a bit like contacting the ford to correct your alignment or some random car issue. There are pleanty of linux kernel hackers out there who would love to help make this code go faster and would do a better job than intel.

    I can hear the call now:
    "Hello, welcome to intel how can I help? Ok, so you say your ap runs like **** on linux? How does it run on windows with the same processor? Just fine? Ok then it's not a processor issue, its yer OS. Thx for calling intel, have a nice day."

    People bring these issues up almost every week on the HLDS mailing list only to be ignored. I love to play NS but if I have to run a wintel server to get it working they've lost a server. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Heh to say Intel is superior to AMD is a statement of ignorance <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->

    Have a look-see<a href='http://www.peltonweb.com/docs/athlon_p4.htm' target='_blank'>Comparison</a>
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  • BonelessBoneless Join Date: 2002-09-03 Member: 1270Members
    The problem with high CPU usage is not a steam problem but HL engine's itself... The performance under linux was seriously degraded with version 3.1.1.1...

    Alfred Reynolds, the current mantainer of the linux port has been trying to solve this issue without success for months (profiling, specific cpu binaries, etc..)

    For me the "VALVe <3 MS" conspiration theory makes no sense... Can VALVe get any profit from hundreds of raged Linux admins and customers?

    How comes they still fix the VAC issues with an out-of-the-box unssuported platform like Winex? uh...
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  • MaxMax Technical Director, Unknown Worlds Entertainment Join Date: 2002-03-15 Member: 318Super Administrators, Retired Developer, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, Constellation, Subnautica Developer, Pistachionauts, Future Perfect Developer
    <!--QuoteBegin--billcat+Nov 25 2003, 03:28 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (billcat @ Nov 25 2003, 03:28 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->You have to remember that the guys that run valve came from MS. They have to have loads of MS stock and there is no real reason for them to make the linux version go fast, quite the opposite, seeing it slower than windows is in their best interest. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I guarantee you that Gabe Newell has a much stronger interest in making Valve successful than he does in making Microsoft successful.

    Max
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  • Hologram0Hologram0 Join Date: 2002-11-19 Member: 9303Members, Constellation
    IMHO it would never hurt to have a company the size of microsoft owe you a favour. Though it isnt a good thing to have huge crowds of people hating them for doing MS a favour.
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