3.0f Changelog

MaianMaian Join Date: 2003-02-27 Member: 14069Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Gold
edited January 2004 in NS General Discussion
v3.0f changelog
--------------------

Map Sadness, Gladness and Madness™
-------------------------------------
O Removed ns_bast due to loss of map source and high entity count (may you R.I.P, we love you)

O Re-added complete remake of ns_nancy! For those that have seen this already, here are the updated changes:
O Clip errors in subspace that could make people get stuck to the pillar if flying around it.
O Air Filtration System room has been completely redone and is now infested. It looks better than I thought it would come out to be.
O Ambient noises added to make even more like the old.
O Now when looking out of the window in port engine you can see the side of the ship like in the old one.

? New co_ulysses
:: Removed ladder in hive and placed a ramp.
:: Vent from hive to low hive entrance.
:: Added detail at the hive.
:: Fixed movement issues at hive.
:: Added atmospheric elements to the map (sounds and FX all over the map, including drips and steam)

O Updated ns_eclipse:
O Fixed weldable health issues
O Replaced Horseshoe electric effect with 1.0 release version

O Updated ns_nothing:
O General point/brush entity optimizations (315 entities down to 268)

O Updated ns_veil
O New corridor new double node
O New location called "North Loop"

? co_rebirth version 4-5
O Added some new textures in co_rebirth.wad
O Added an ambiant_generic ( sound ) in the Ready Room.
O Changed some details everywhere for esthetic or optimisation.
O Increased the size of an important acces (door) and built stairs for a better flow.
O Added a little room in the way to the hive, to get a little bit hidden a few seconds.=>screen2
O Built a new acces to spectate in the Ready Room (bigger) => the two doors drive now to random team (essentialy because of players AFK who blocked the access) =>screen1
O Added some few things like thanks to playtesters in the co_rebirth.txt <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
O Increased size of hive room
O Waiting for updated map with updated sound name
O Waiting for smoke sprite

O ns_metal update-8
* Tweaks
* Two more vents
* Removed one res (Heating room)
* More infestation near hives

O Lerk flight tweaks.
O Turning does not slow you down as much.
O Energy cost of flapping increased slightly.

O Allow fakeclients to use impulses to initiate leap, blink and charge (to help bot writers)

O Fixed getting stunned with primed grenade causes it to be dropped (bug #390).

O Fixed primed grenade not getting holstered when player is webbed.
O Fixed grenade prediction problems.
O Added 3rd person grenade animations.
O Changed hand grenades so they explode on contact

O Added grenade sprite artwork (thanks Hackepeter and Max!)

O Reworked tech tree to allow different Combat upgrades to cost different numbers of levels. Lerk, jetpack and Onos now each cost two levels to purchase.
O Improved pop-up menu to more accurately show you what's available and when (for aliens)
? HUD sound precedence issues (bug #402)

O Important note: alien armor is affected by the number of hives you have. 1 hive means armor is worth 1.6 points of health, 2 hives means it's worth 2 points of health, 3 hives means it's worth 2.4 points of health. It's been this way since the first version of 3.0, but keep this in mind when attacking.
O Increased Onos health from 600 to 700
O Reduced Onos cost from 100 to 75
O Reduced Fade cost from 60 to 50
O Increased build-hive score from 5 to 8
O Increased Combat spawn times a bit more (max wait is 45 seconds, up from 30).
O Reduce Onos gore range from 130 to 90 (he shouldn't be able to pick JPs out of the air)
O Fixed lerk death animations (bug #276)

O Added anti-scripting code (activated when mp_blockscripts is 1). When enabled, it blocks any command with wait, _special, exec, or a ; in it. This is off by default.
O New primal scream sprite with a lerk instead of an onos (Thanks CoolCookieCooks!)

O Fixed problem where players taking melee damage while spawn-invulnerable were still pushed around
O Changed parasite to organic damage (only hurts living targets), so they can't be used against mines. The "parasite-hit" sound only plays when you newly parasite a player or structure, or when you do damage to a target.
? Gameplay test: with Hambone mode enabled, res towers give a resource point every 2 seconds, instead of every 4.

O Tournament mode no longer necessarily includes friendly fire (mp_friendlyfire controls it completely).
O Cleaned up and unified server.cfg and listenserver.cfg.
O Removed some extraneous server variables.
O Removed unpopular server and game options from the UI
O Added dynamic loading of FMOD DLL from the ns mod directory (to eliminate compatibility problems with other mods).
O Fixed bug where players sometimes crash when joining marine team (bug #404, introduced in changelist 1895). Grepdashv, you rule!
O Fixed bug where cloaked aliens are visible to marines who are spectating while waiting to respawn. Dead players now see cloaked entities as the person they are watching does. True spectators see cloaked targets when they are spectating a person in non-first-person mode. (bug #295)
O Fixed bug where hive wouldn't spawn if blocked by player (bug #391)
O Removed mp_version variable. Now the version is reported in the game description.
O Fixed bug where commander logged into non-primary CC wasn't ejected when it was destroyed (bug #422)
O Increased heal spray range from 250 to 300, in order to make it easier to heal hives (bug #414)
O Fixed marines able to +use while stunned (bug #441)
O Fixed bug where weird recycling can cause inability to buy arms lab upgrades (bug #186)
O Fixed bug where aliens sometimes appear as a marine when they die or spawn (bug #193)

-----------==========--------------

just posting the updated one flayra put in the CM forums...
«13456

Comments

  • LazerLazer Join Date: 2003-03-11 Member: 14406Members, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester
    <!--QuoteBegin--Maian+Jan 18 2004, 12:48 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Maian @ Jan 18 2004, 12:48 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> This was posted in the CM forums 28 minutes ago. I can't believe it wasn't posted here already <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    It wasn't because max told us to not post it yet.
  • MaianMaian Join Date: 2003-02-27 Member: 14069Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Gold
    He did? Should I delete it then?
  • AbsolutionaryAbsolutionary Join Date: 2003-11-30 Member: 23797Members
  • MaxMax Technical Director, Unknown Worlds Entertainment Join Date: 2002-03-15 Member: 318Super Administrators, Retired Developer, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, Constellation, Subnautica Developer, Pistachionauts, Future Perfect Developer
    I didn't want it copied until Flayra fixed an error in it about the anti-scripting.

    Max
  • RaVeRaVe Join Date: 2003-06-20 Member: 17538Members
    I don't understand the armor thing....

    Good thing they dropped the cost to Onos though....I'm sure they still drop like flies to concentrated fire <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
    Not to mention increased chance of alien comeback <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->

    Bad thing that bast is now gone <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • MaianMaian Join Date: 2003-02-27 Member: 14069Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Gold
    Ok, I edited that part out. Someone can post that anti-scripting change later when it's fixed.
  • TheGuyTheGuy Join Date: 2003-08-09 Member: 19295Members, Constellation
    edited January 2004
    The idea with the armor is that the same amount of armor would absorb more damage based on how many hives the aliens have.
    Carapace is more armor, this change is how much it absorbs based on hive count. (note you do NOT need the carapace upgrade to get this benefit)
  • MaianMaian Join Date: 2003-02-27 Member: 14069Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Gold
    <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->O Allow fakeclients to use impulses to initiate leap, blink and charge (to help bot writers)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    FYI: bot != aimbot
  • TheGuyTheGuy Join Date: 2003-08-09 Member: 19295Members, Constellation
    Here's the part that Flayra corrected. Feel free to add it to the start maian

    O Added anti-scripting code (activated when mp_blockscripts is 1). When enabled, it blocks any command with wait, _special, exec, or a ; in it. This is off by default.
  • RaVeRaVe Join Date: 2003-06-20 Member: 17538Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--TheGuy+Jan 18 2004, 01:04 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TheGuy @ Jan 18 2004, 01:04 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> The idea with the armor is that the same amount of armor would absorb more damage based on how many hives the aliens have.
    Carapace is more armor, this change is how much it absorbs based on hive count. (note you do NOT need the carapace upgrade to get this benefit) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Ohhhh....

    so that means, if you have 3 hives, you'll have a much more longer time on the field due to more damage absorbed by the armor, right?

    Sounds like a pleasant change....should give an incentive to build hives more too <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • MaianMaian Join Date: 2003-02-27 Member: 14069Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Gold
    <!--QuoteBegin--TheGuy+Jan 18 2004, 01:17 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TheGuy @ Jan 18 2004, 01:17 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Here's the part that Flayra corrected. Feel free to add it to the start maian

    O Added anti-scripting code (activated when mp_blockscripts is 1). When enabled, it blocks any command with wait, _special, exec, or a ; in it. This is off by default. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    That's what I had copied before...but I'll re-add it.
  • RaVeRaVe Join Date: 2003-06-20 Member: 17538Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Maian+Jan 18 2004, 01:24 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Maian @ Jan 18 2004, 01:24 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--TheGuy+Jan 18 2004, 01:17 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TheGuy @ Jan 18 2004, 01:17 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Here's the part that Flayra corrected. Feel free to add it to the start maian

    O Added anti-scripting code (activated when mp_blockscripts is 1). When enabled, it blocks any command with wait, _special, exec, or a ; in it. This is off by default. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    That's what I had copied before...but I'll re-add it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Actually what you copied was the wrong one because you see....

    Original and with errors :

    O Added anti-scripting code (activated when mp_blockscripts is 1). When enabled, it blocks any command with wait, _special, <b>alias</b>, or a ; in it. This is off by default.

    New and fixed one :

    O Added anti-scripting code (activated when mp_blockscripts is 1). When enabled, it blocks any command with wait, _special, <b>exec</b>, or a ; in it. This is off by default.

    LOL for a moment I was scared because most of my scripts (which don't offer any advantage) use alias
  • MrPinkMrPink Join Date: 2002-05-28 Member: 678Members
    I'm gonna say it before anyone whines about it cuz I know they will...
    Bast is gone, we don't care how much you miss it, no matter what you say or do will bring it back. The only way it will ever get back into NS is if you make a remake team a la nancy, then it <b>might.</b>
  • 2of12B0RG2of12B0RG Join Date: 2002-12-21 Member: 11285Members
    O Added anti-scripting code (activated when mp_blockscripts is 1). When enabled, it blocks any command with wait, _special, alias, or a ; in it. This is off by default.


    So I am getting penalized because of a bunch of scripting fools.

    This is the single solitary "script" that is in my config-

    bind "MWHEELDOWN" "invnext; +attack; wait; -attack"
    bind "MWHEELUP" "invprev; +attack; wait; -attack"

    And I use this to be able to roll my mouse to switch weapons without having to roll, then press fire, then press fire again to actually fire.

    That is stupid. GG NS.
  • SpazmaticSpazmatic Join Date: 2003-05-10 Member: 16184Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->LOL for a moment I was scared because most of my scripts (which don't offer any advantage) use alias <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    That would be bizarre.
  • GrillkohleGrillkohle Join Date: 2003-12-23 Member: 24695Members, Constellation
    <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->O Reduced Onos cost from 100 to 75<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    !!!
    That is major, I hope it will stay. Makes a comeback for aliens easier, and the onos was never really worth 100 res.
  • TalesinTalesin Our own little well of hate Join Date: 2002-11-08 Member: 7710NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators
    Even less so when you consider that no matter what part of the Onos you shoot now, you hit. Rather than just that column just behind the forelegs. It's the broad side of a barn... Onos and Fade are the biggest need-to-be-balanced IMO for this build.
  • CommunistWithAGunCommunistWithAGun Local Propaganda Guy Join Date: 2003-04-30 Member: 15953Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--2of12[B0RG]+Jan 18 2004, 01:43 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (2of12[B0RG] @ Jan 18 2004, 01:43 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> O Added anti-scripting code (activated when mp_blockscripts is 1). When enabled, it blocks any command with wait, _special, alias, or a ; in it. This is off by default.


    So I am getting penalized because of a bunch of scripting fools.

    This is the single solitary "script" that is in my config-

    bind "MWHEELDOWN" "invnext; +attack; wait; -attack"
    bind "MWHEELUP" "invprev; +attack; wait; -attack"

    And I use this to be able to roll my mouse to switch weapons without having to roll, then press fire, then press fire again to actually fire.

    That is stupid. GG NS. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I'd rather have to press my fire key once extra than be subjected to some of the more...harsh scripts out there (10 pistol shots in under a second anyone?)
  • im_lostim_lost TWG Rule Guru Join Date: 2003-04-26 Member: 15861Members
    A bast remake project is underway. Check the mapping forum to see the details (it should be on the front page for a while).
  • EnIgEnIg Join Date: 2002-12-22 Member: 11379Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->O Removed ns_bast due to loss of map source and high entity count (may you R.I.P, we love you)

    O Re-added complete remake of ns_nancy! For those that have seen this already, here are the updated changes:
    O Clip errors in subspace that could make people get stuck to the pillar if flying around it.
    O Air Filtration System room has been completely redone and is now infested. It looks better than I thought it would come out to be.
    O Ambient noises added to make even more like the old.
    O Now when looking out of the window in port engine you can see the side of the ship like in the old one.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    It's cool they're remaking bast, but I won't miss it horribly. I can't wait to get back in nancy though, I miss that map so much.
  • BigDBigD [OldF] Join Date: 2002-10-25 Member: 1596Members
    edited January 2004
    MrPink... yer a few days behind! A Bast team has already formed, and the Marine Start is already nearing completion! I think the reason bast is removed for now is because it'll be back and in good form soon. And before anyone whines about it needing to be rebalanced, it is FIRST being rebuilt as close to the original as possible THEN will be tweaked (much much easier). And if anyone don't like Bast, TOO BAD. It's coming back, baby! (As mentioned in that thread... Bast is one of Flayra's personal favorites!) <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->

    Edit: Wow I'm slow... <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->

    Edit again: <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->It's cool they're remaking bast, but I won't miss it horribly. I can't wait to get back in nancy though, I miss that map so much. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    You say that now EnIg... but give it time... and you'd miss Bast too, even if only a little bit. The atmosphere of that map is in a class of its own. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • ForlornForlorn Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2634Banned
    <!--QuoteBegin--2of12[B0RG]+Jan 18 2004, 01:43 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (2of12[B0RG] @ Jan 18 2004, 01:43 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> O Added anti-scripting code (activated when mp_blockscripts is 1). When enabled, it blocks any command with wait, _special, alias, or a ; in it. This is off by default.


    So I am getting penalized because of a bunch of scripting fools.

    This is the single solitary "script" that is in my config-

    bind "MWHEELDOWN" "invnext; +attack; wait; -attack"
    bind "MWHEELUP" "invprev; +attack; wait; -attack"

    And I use this to be able to roll my mouse to switch weapons without having to roll, then press fire, then press fire again to actually fire.

    That is stupid. GG NS. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    hud_fastswitch 1

    Put that in your config, gg
  • bLuIShbLuISh Join Date: 2003-05-21 Member: 16559Members
    edited January 2004
    eh, i hate all the standard maps, im more of a custom-map person, like siege007 or something. what is this suppose to mean? it means this is a a moreover useless changelog for meh, i would be celebrating one less map, but they readded nancy (>.>)

    So much for Bast, i always hated that stupid elevator in rine spawn, nothing but crap problems with onos and that damned elevator. Or that vent that you could weld in rine spawn, but still had a hole big enough for lerks to gas and skulks to parasite, but not big enough for a jper to do much about it....(Que award for most useless vent weld)
    hehehe...so anyway is 3.0 even close to coming out yet...? ugh ive had enough of all this waiting.... Eh why bother asking, im not even going to read this thread again. Forget i said anything.

    At least 3.0 is making goood progress =D

    EDIT: GOOD LUCK BAST TEAM, MAKE SURE YOU GET RID OF THAT DAMNED ELEVATOR IN RINE SPAWN, OR MAKE IT LESS CRAPPY =D. At least consider plugging up that vent in rine spawn completely as wel...but thats just me
  • EidolanEidolan Join Date: 2002-11-15 Member: 8694Members
    Everyone keeps saying "Ns_bast" I thought it was "Ns_blast". Or is this some other map that was made for 3.0 that i have't seen.
  • MadcapMagicianMadcapMagician Join Date: 2003-04-07 Member: 15265Members, Constellation
    I think allowing scripts on a per-server basis is a terrible idea. It should definitely be all or none.
  • AeaAea Join Date: 2003-10-09 Member: 21552Members
    ns_bast was one of the greatest maps ever made, but it was too laggy, that's the part they're fixing <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • UKchaosUKchaos Join Date: 2002-08-10 Member: 1132Members
    If by 'fixing', you mean removing, then your correct <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • AeaAea Join Date: 2003-10-09 Member: 21552Members
    By fixing, redoing with less entities and issues :|
  • Meaning0fLifeMeaning0fLife Join Date: 2003-07-05 Member: 17940Members, Constellation
    <!--QuoteBegin--MadcapMagician+Jan 18 2004, 03:30 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MadcapMagician @ Jan 18 2004, 03:30 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I think allowing scripts on a per-server basis is a terrible idea.  It should definitely be all or none.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I agree with you here Madcap. However, it's left up to the server admins so they can cater to their own server population, on an individual basis (I'm guessing <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> )
  • AlignAlign Remain Calm Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 5216Forum Moderators, Constellation
    <!--QuoteBegin--Forlorn+Jan 18 2004, 09:02 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Forlorn @ Jan 18 2004, 09:02 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
    hud_fastswitch 1

    Put that in your config, gg<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    But fastswitch doesn't affect invnext and invprev...? I'm pretty sure it only affects the 'slot#' commands(bound to your number keys usually).

    <!--QuoteBegin--Eidolan+,--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Eidolan @ ,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Everyone keeps saying "Ns_bast" I thought it was "Ns_blast". Or is this some other map that was made for 3.0 that i have't seen.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Nope, it's ns_bast.


    mmm...nancy...
    That is, if they remove all the *** "shoot hive from a vent" problems. Bleah.
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