The bashing of CS/CZ/fill blank is not really purpose of the Natural Selection forums, so do us all a favor and spare us.
[edit]As for my opinion, we see the typical decline a while after a version. People move on to new things and won't return until the next version is being released. Has always been like that, will always be like that.[/edit]
<!--QuoteBegin-UKchaos+Apr 5 2004, 10:46 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (UKchaos @ Apr 5 2004, 10:46 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Its always amused me the amount of hate and vitriol that people have towards <i>popular</i> mods like Counter-Strike. Its not enough that they dont like the game, they have to convince the rest of the world to agree with them too.
In many ways CS paved the way for Natural-Selection, in that respect, you should be thankful for it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> *applause*
<!--QuoteBegin-Forlorn+Apr 6 2004, 08:51 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Forlorn @ Apr 6 2004, 08:51 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Gee Savant, if playing the game is such a chore and frustration, maybe we should just all quit
Personally I find the struggle to be challenging and therefore fun<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> To each his own. If you enjoy pointless games, that's cool.
You seem to be confusing struggle and challange with labour and chore though. There are PLENTY of games that are challanging and involve a struggle. Half-Life is a perfect example of this. One man against the world. How much more of a struggle can you get?
However, the difference is that it is FUN to play, even though it IS a struggle.
In NS the 'struggle' plays like a chore, the fun has been sucked out of it with various balance changes (which are outside the purview of this topic, so I'll forgo mentioning them) but the point remains that if the game isn't fun to play, something is WRONG. Player numbers in NS are declining, and I'm getting a serious sense of dejavu when I think about NS and FireArms.
What bothers me is that too many people are unwilling to look beyond the status quo in making changes to the game. Sure a person may like a particular aspect of the game, but if that aspect is NOT conductive to a good gameplay experience, then we need to look at changing it.
Comparing NS to CS is like comparing apples to oranges. It can't be done. Other than a similar engine and the fact that both mods have guns as weapons, the similarity ends there.
If you want to delude yourself that NS is all fine and good, that's cool. Just don't try and convince me of it.
Can Savant and Forlorn please not hijack yet another thread to **** at each other kthx.
As Nemesis Zero said, it's just the usual peak after a new release dying down. That's all there is to it <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
It's a good idea to do a public beta if Flayra would have shorter but more frequent updates. That way you're in the news a lot more and a lot more people download NS.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->What bothers me is that too many people are unwilling to look beyond the status quo in making changes to the game.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There's nothing wrong with status quo. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Anyway, if you're talking about the changes, that's up to Flayra alone apparently. I get the feeling he has pretty much shut himself in a room with some people around him (read: betatesters, such as yourself) and work from there. Now, I'm not saying anyone is stupid or narrow-minded or whatnot (although I have no doubt that there is in fact a fair share of stupidity and narrow-mindedness among the playtesters as well, like any other group), but it's a simple fact that you can only get so far if you isolate yourself. A potential cure would be the I&S forum, but let's face it: it's not operational. As it is, I feel it's just a place where people can post ideas so they can be ignored. I can't even remember the last time a suggestion from I&S was implemented (except for hive-independant lifeforms), even though I've seen a lot of suggestions I'd prefer to see implemented over quite a few of the features currently in the game. Not only that, but any discussion regarding non-linear (perhaps stupid, though I prefer "unique") issues, or pretty much anything really, can (and will) be shut down. I'm willing to bet 1/3rd of the threads in there are locked. At least they should be removed so the "use the search function" you hear every so often will actually be valid. And come on, for what purpose could you possibly keep a thread about marines comming out the other end of the Onos in a more, erm, realistic shape, locked?
Want fresh ideas? Ask people you haven't asked yet (and it would of course be a plus to actually care what they think). And for the love of God, don't be afraid to think outside the box, or at least let others do it if they want to. What's the worst thing that can happen? A pointless thread is made? Big deal.
Comments
Totally agree.
[edit]As for my opinion, we see the typical decline a while after a version. People move on to new things and won't return until the next version is being released. Has always been like that, will always be like that.[/edit]
In many ways CS paved the way for Natural-Selection, in that respect, you should be thankful for it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
*applause*
Personally I find the struggle to be challenging and therefore fun<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
To each his own. If you enjoy pointless games, that's cool.
You seem to be confusing struggle and challange with labour and chore though. There are PLENTY of games that are challanging and involve a struggle. Half-Life is a perfect example of this. One man against the world. How much more of a struggle can you get?
However, the difference is that it is FUN to play, even though it IS a struggle.
In NS the 'struggle' plays like a chore, the fun has been sucked out of it with various balance changes (which are outside the purview of this topic, so I'll forgo mentioning them) but the point remains that if the game isn't fun to play, something is WRONG. Player numbers in NS are declining, and I'm getting a serious sense of dejavu when I think about NS and FireArms.
What bothers me is that too many people are unwilling to look beyond the status quo in making changes to the game. Sure a person may like a particular aspect of the game, but if that aspect is NOT conductive to a good gameplay experience, then we need to look at changing it.
Comparing NS to CS is like comparing apples to oranges. It can't be done. Other than a similar engine and the fact that both mods have guns as weapons, the similarity ends there.
If you want to delude yourself that NS is all fine and good, that's cool. Just don't try and convince me of it.
I know better.
Regards,
Savant
As Nemesis Zero said, it's just the usual peak after a new release dying down. That's all there is to it <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<span style='font-size:8pt;line-height:100%'>Edit: SPAG</span>
There's nothing wrong with status quo. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Anyway, if you're talking about the changes, that's up to Flayra alone apparently. I get the feeling he has pretty much shut himself in a room with some people around him (read: betatesters, such as yourself) and work from there. Now, I'm not saying anyone is stupid or narrow-minded or whatnot (although I have no doubt that there is in fact a fair share of stupidity and narrow-mindedness among the playtesters as well, like any other group), but it's a simple fact that you can only get so far if you isolate yourself.
A potential cure would be the I&S forum, but let's face it: it's not operational. As it is, I feel it's just a place where people can post ideas so they can be ignored. I can't even remember the last time a suggestion from I&S was implemented (except for hive-independant lifeforms), even though I've seen a lot of suggestions I'd prefer to see implemented over quite a few of the features currently in the game. Not only that, but any discussion regarding non-linear (perhaps stupid, though I prefer "unique") issues, or pretty much anything really, can (and will) be shut down. I'm willing to bet 1/3rd of the threads in there are locked. At least they should be removed so the "use the search function" you hear every so often will actually be valid. And come on, for what purpose could you possibly keep a thread about marines comming out the other end of the Onos in a more, erm, realistic shape, locked?
Want fresh ideas? Ask people you haven't asked yet (and it would of course be a plus to actually care what they think). And for the love of God, don't be afraid to think outside the box, or at least let others do it if they want to. What's the worst thing that can happen? A pointless thread is made? Big deal.
PS. Sorry for hi-jacking.
Answer? 38,400 people, that's why.