Uniformity Is A Good Thing:
the_x5
the Xzianthian Join Date: 2004-03-02 Member: 27041Members, Constellation
the Xzianthian Join Date: 2004-03-02 Member: 27041Members, Constellation
<div class="IPBDescription">err what version was that?</div> <!--QuoteBegin-semi-psychotic+ PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (semi-psychotic @ PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
<!--QuoteBegin-x5+ PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (x5 @ PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
<!--QuoteBegin-semi-psychotic+ PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (semi-psychotic @ PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Regarding the need to re-evolve as an alien upon marine spawn:
Before you complain about it, learn to deal with it. What does this mean?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually I have no idea what it means. Does this mean that if you walk into marine spawn you instantly turn back into a skulk and have to re-evolve? That'd be horrible, esp. if you were a fade or onos
me = confuzled n00bizor
PS: actually I am really confused as to what version people are playing and what the changes are. Like I hear about these things called babblers in place of web and other such major changes from various version and I'm very confused.
eh?:
3.0
4a
4b
5B
BUS
w.t.f?
Why do we have like 6 different incompatable versions?! It sounds like a major mess. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hey agentx5,
Heh, I can't blame you for being confused. There have been at least 10 publicly released versions of NS to this date, I'll list them out in chronological order:
1.0 (released October 31st, 2003, I think)
1.01 (a server-side only update to 1.0)
1.02 (another server-side only update, I started playing around here)
1.03 (and again)
1.04 (and again, this is the last server-side only update to 1.0)
2.0 (this is the first BIG update since the official release, changed a lot of gameplay dynamics, it was called 1.1 until the devs decided that 2.0 was more fitting)
2.01 (a server-side only update to 2.0, the only one)
3.0 has yet to be officially released. Ironically, it was known as 2.1 before the devs changed the name, kinda like the "2.0 saga". However, here's the PUBLIC BETA release history of 3.0:
3.0 Beta 1 (first public release, known as 3.0b1)
3.0 Beta 2 (a patch, 3.0b2 or B2)
3.0 Beta 3 (another patch, 3.0b3 or B3)
3.0 Beta 4 (another patch)
3.0 Beta 4A (came soon after B4 to deal with issues that cropped up, this one was a patch on a patch, 3.0B4A in shorthand).
3.0 Beta 5 (the current public release, B5, this one is actually a full compile, not a patch).
I'm sorry, but I personally am way too lazy to look through the changelogs. Heck, I don't even know some of the balance changes that have taken place since 1.02. You're on you're own there, but read on for the rest of the explanation:
Now, within 3.0 there are a few confusing elements. The first is the addition of combat, a new game mode that goes alongside the NS_ game mode (If you know how this works, skip this paragraph). If you've ever played CS, you'll pick it up quickly: certain maps in CS start with cs_, and those are hostage maps, others start with de_ and they are bomb maps. In Natural-selection, ns_ mode is the mode you know and love, while co_ is based on fast action with no buildings and smaller maps, and with "experience points" to replace resources, but still a lot of teamwork if you play with the right crowd.
Then, there's the BUS. The BUS stands for the Big Unnanounced System. It is the public name for a mysterious, revolutionary system that Flayra is working on with the help of his "coding minions" and noboby in the inner circle is supposed to tell us anything about. All we know is that Nemesis Zero thinks that it's cool.
So, all of the versions from 1.0 to 3.0b4a (3.0 Beta 4A) are the past. Version 3.0b5 is the present, and the BUS is a system to go along with future versions of NS.
As far as the new egg system, it was introduced to the COMBAT game mode in the most recent version, B5. Aliens now become skulks when they die, and they get their lifeform points back. This means that if you were a fade, and you die, you have to re-egg into a fade when you spawn, or otherwise stay as a skulk, gorge, lerk, or do whatever you want with those 3 fade points. This system has caused a big stink in the community, and I was simply addressing this when I posted on that topic.
If you still have questions, feel free to PM me again. I'm almost sure I missed something back there.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Uniformity, the best thing the Windows monopoly did. It keeps things simple. Having many many incompatable versions can result ing issues. Servers and poeple my not have the correct version and have to worry about updates and installations all of the time. There are new bugs and new balance issues with each passing update. And it really begins to bug mappers if there map suddenly has outdated enities and doesn't work correctly.
So I wonder: Why not have one uniform NS version?
remember KISS programmers/devs?
Getting NS working smoothly should be as simple as PnP. And you can still have a diverse number of options availbale to server admins though clever use of cvars. If getting NS up is simple you are more apt to draw newbies than if you make 10 ore more incompatable versions and the user is left to wonder which of them is the right one. Ok maybe it's the latest, but that one has all of the unfixd bugs and errors.
Mappers get shafted if their artwork suddenly becomes out of date. Changes in balance can majorly affect flow design and making quick fixes can cause even more problems: like the rotating door in ns_bast.
So I wonder: Why not have one uniform NS version?
I'm guessing that's what BUS is supposed to be and we are all guinea pigs in this little experiment. But if I were Valve, I would not approve NS as a mainstream official mod until they finally got down and said here is our final version and all of the servers are using it. Of course you can make little changes here and ther and big patchs every once in a long while. But you need to have one NS system loaded, one internet connection system loaded, one operating system loaded. (You wouldn't try to use MacOS files for WindowsXP)
So I wonder: Why not have one uniform NS version?
<i>open to discussion:</i>
<!--QuoteBegin-x5+ PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (x5 @ PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
<!--QuoteBegin-semi-psychotic+ PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (semi-psychotic @ PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Regarding the need to re-evolve as an alien upon marine spawn:
Before you complain about it, learn to deal with it. What does this mean?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually I have no idea what it means. Does this mean that if you walk into marine spawn you instantly turn back into a skulk and have to re-evolve? That'd be horrible, esp. if you were a fade or onos
me = confuzled n00bizor
PS: actually I am really confused as to what version people are playing and what the changes are. Like I hear about these things called babblers in place of web and other such major changes from various version and I'm very confused.
eh?:
3.0
4a
4b
5B
BUS
w.t.f?
Why do we have like 6 different incompatable versions?! It sounds like a major mess. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hey agentx5,
Heh, I can't blame you for being confused. There have been at least 10 publicly released versions of NS to this date, I'll list them out in chronological order:
1.0 (released October 31st, 2003, I think)
1.01 (a server-side only update to 1.0)
1.02 (another server-side only update, I started playing around here)
1.03 (and again)
1.04 (and again, this is the last server-side only update to 1.0)
2.0 (this is the first BIG update since the official release, changed a lot of gameplay dynamics, it was called 1.1 until the devs decided that 2.0 was more fitting)
2.01 (a server-side only update to 2.0, the only one)
3.0 has yet to be officially released. Ironically, it was known as 2.1 before the devs changed the name, kinda like the "2.0 saga". However, here's the PUBLIC BETA release history of 3.0:
3.0 Beta 1 (first public release, known as 3.0b1)
3.0 Beta 2 (a patch, 3.0b2 or B2)
3.0 Beta 3 (another patch, 3.0b3 or B3)
3.0 Beta 4 (another patch)
3.0 Beta 4A (came soon after B4 to deal with issues that cropped up, this one was a patch on a patch, 3.0B4A in shorthand).
3.0 Beta 5 (the current public release, B5, this one is actually a full compile, not a patch).
I'm sorry, but I personally am way too lazy to look through the changelogs. Heck, I don't even know some of the balance changes that have taken place since 1.02. You're on you're own there, but read on for the rest of the explanation:
Now, within 3.0 there are a few confusing elements. The first is the addition of combat, a new game mode that goes alongside the NS_ game mode (If you know how this works, skip this paragraph). If you've ever played CS, you'll pick it up quickly: certain maps in CS start with cs_, and those are hostage maps, others start with de_ and they are bomb maps. In Natural-selection, ns_ mode is the mode you know and love, while co_ is based on fast action with no buildings and smaller maps, and with "experience points" to replace resources, but still a lot of teamwork if you play with the right crowd.
Then, there's the BUS. The BUS stands for the Big Unnanounced System. It is the public name for a mysterious, revolutionary system that Flayra is working on with the help of his "coding minions" and noboby in the inner circle is supposed to tell us anything about. All we know is that Nemesis Zero thinks that it's cool.
So, all of the versions from 1.0 to 3.0b4a (3.0 Beta 4A) are the past. Version 3.0b5 is the present, and the BUS is a system to go along with future versions of NS.
As far as the new egg system, it was introduced to the COMBAT game mode in the most recent version, B5. Aliens now become skulks when they die, and they get their lifeform points back. This means that if you were a fade, and you die, you have to re-egg into a fade when you spawn, or otherwise stay as a skulk, gorge, lerk, or do whatever you want with those 3 fade points. This system has caused a big stink in the community, and I was simply addressing this when I posted on that topic.
If you still have questions, feel free to PM me again. I'm almost sure I missed something back there.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Uniformity, the best thing the Windows monopoly did. It keeps things simple. Having many many incompatable versions can result ing issues. Servers and poeple my not have the correct version and have to worry about updates and installations all of the time. There are new bugs and new balance issues with each passing update. And it really begins to bug mappers if there map suddenly has outdated enities and doesn't work correctly.
So I wonder: Why not have one uniform NS version?
remember KISS programmers/devs?
Getting NS working smoothly should be as simple as PnP. And you can still have a diverse number of options availbale to server admins though clever use of cvars. If getting NS up is simple you are more apt to draw newbies than if you make 10 ore more incompatable versions and the user is left to wonder which of them is the right one. Ok maybe it's the latest, but that one has all of the unfixd bugs and errors.
Mappers get shafted if their artwork suddenly becomes out of date. Changes in balance can majorly affect flow design and making quick fixes can cause even more problems: like the rotating door in ns_bast.
So I wonder: Why not have one uniform NS version?
I'm guessing that's what BUS is supposed to be and we are all guinea pigs in this little experiment. But if I were Valve, I would not approve NS as a mainstream official mod until they finally got down and said here is our final version and all of the servers are using it. Of course you can make little changes here and ther and big patchs every once in a long while. But you need to have one NS system loaded, one internet connection system loaded, one operating system loaded. (You wouldn't try to use MacOS files for WindowsXP)
So I wonder: Why not have one uniform NS version?
<i>open to discussion:</i>
Comments
<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> What's the RC stand for?
And I'm assuming this will become the official mainstream version supported by Steam.
AFAIK the release of version 3.0 Final will be when NS is officially on steam.
As for Windows being simple...
Windows 3.1
Windows 3.11
Windows 98
Windows 98 Second Edition
Windows ME
Windows XP
Windows XP SP1
Windows XP SP2
That, and if they released the offical NS 3.0, non beta, there might still be servers with 3.0b4a or 3.0b5. It's more an issue with people not updating rather than there being more than one version. And one of the ideas behind Steam is to be able to update the game and provide that update to all players easily/quickly without having to wait for large patches. Going official through Steam would eliminate the issue of lots of servers with older versions without forcing a slowdown of the development process.
As for Windows being simple...
Windows 3.1
Windows 3.11
Windows 98
Windows 98 Second Edition
Windows ME
Windows XP
Windows XP SP1
Windows XP SP2
That, and if they released the offical NS 3.0, non beta, there might still be servers with 3.0b4a or 3.0b5. It's more an issue with people not updating rather than there being more than one version. And one of the ideas behind Steam is to be able to update the game and provide that update to all players easily/quickly without having to wait for large patches. Going official through Steam would eliminate the issue of lots of servers with older versions without forcing a slowdown of the development process. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Missed a few:
Windows 2000
Windows 2000 SP1
Windows 2000 SP2
Windows 2000 SP3
Windows 2000 SP4
Windows 95
Windows NT
Windows Server 2003
All the old versions of NS are dead and buried. Nobody ever plays them anymore. They keep changing version numbers to denote the huge- gameplay changing events that have made it a whole new game.
And I agree with Ziggy that uniformity must be the ugliest word in english. (ahhh, My screen is dirty dirty dirty)
What you are basicaly saying is that they should have stoped at 1.0 and never made any updates.....
right, that dosn't work (as 1.0 is the buggiest of them all. No auto balance, marines got 10x the rez flow they should have, no ping of doom, no way to mute people unless you knew the client side command, If the perma gorge died you were basicaly screwed, if more then one person gorged you were screwed, Fade was next to useless unless the server had unstuck running (wih didn't start showing up till 1.03), same for the onos, etc etc etc).
ATM, we are in 3.0 <b><span style='font-family:Impact'>BETA</span></b>, yes the offical version is still 2.01.
ATM however there are a total of THREE files you could posibly download if you wanted to play NS:
NS 1
NS 2
NS 3 Beta 5
1.01-4 were server side
2.01 was server side
and you would have to ask some one whow as in the closed beta to get your hands on the 2.1a-z files (actualy these went even higher, but that is different)
So if you want simple, go play NS 1
Oh, and once NS 3 comes out, it will be on steam, and any one that can't figgure out how to install that, is gone need to be put in a special place <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->