Love the game, but its a little one sidded
JGGY
Join Date: 2002-11-03 Member: 6450Members
Join Date: 2002-11-03 Member: 6450Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Marines vs. aliens</div>Aight!
I really really really like the game! But I think you will notice that, wherever you go, the Marines always win! Ok well mostly, let me tell you why!
Aliens are great, I love all of em, and I love to play as aliens vs. marines! And I know some like to play just for fun, but Im one of those guys that love to win! And let me tell you why Marines are stronger than aliens!
TURRETS! THE DAMN TURRETS!!!
There is no Class for the Aliens that can take these out, without getting Gang Banged! Seriously, Am I wrong? no! The reason Marines are going to win 90 percent of the time is because they have turrets that are WAYYYYY more powerfull and Effective than alien turrets!
This IS A GAME OVER STRATEGY! All the marines have to do Is take out ONE HIVE! PUT GANGS OF TURRETS AROUND IT, AND CONTINUE TO PLAY! GAME OVER FOR THE ALIENS!
Now I think this is unfair to say the least! IF aliens had a class that could take turrets out from afar, and have that class be in the ONE HIVE stage, then the Game would SIMPLY EVEN THE SCALES! AND THE FIGHT IS STILL ON!
Now notice I said, MAKE AN ALIEN THAT CAN TAKE OUT TURRETS, NOT TAKE THE TURRETS OUT OF THE GAME! So dont flame me for that!
I know what some are saying, But...the Gorg can shoot the turrets out, and hes level 1 hive! YEAH BUT IT TAKES 5 MINUTES TO DO SO! And that is more repetitive than leveling up in EQ, while camping creature spawn sites!
Seriously though, the game would even out a great deal, if youd just make a new class of alien, or give gorgs the ability to do mass damage on machines! Because as of now, there is no way to come back from a game where the Marines have captured a hive! Well...as long as the teams are even!
I really really really like the game! But I think you will notice that, wherever you go, the Marines always win! Ok well mostly, let me tell you why!
Aliens are great, I love all of em, and I love to play as aliens vs. marines! And I know some like to play just for fun, but Im one of those guys that love to win! And let me tell you why Marines are stronger than aliens!
TURRETS! THE DAMN TURRETS!!!
There is no Class for the Aliens that can take these out, without getting Gang Banged! Seriously, Am I wrong? no! The reason Marines are going to win 90 percent of the time is because they have turrets that are WAYYYYY more powerfull and Effective than alien turrets!
This IS A GAME OVER STRATEGY! All the marines have to do Is take out ONE HIVE! PUT GANGS OF TURRETS AROUND IT, AND CONTINUE TO PLAY! GAME OVER FOR THE ALIENS!
Now I think this is unfair to say the least! IF aliens had a class that could take turrets out from afar, and have that class be in the ONE HIVE stage, then the Game would SIMPLY EVEN THE SCALES! AND THE FIGHT IS STILL ON!
Now notice I said, MAKE AN ALIEN THAT CAN TAKE OUT TURRETS, NOT TAKE THE TURRETS OUT OF THE GAME! So dont flame me for that!
I know what some are saying, But...the Gorg can shoot the turrets out, and hes level 1 hive! YEAH BUT IT TAKES 5 MINUTES TO DO SO! And that is more repetitive than leveling up in EQ, while camping creature spawn sites!
Seriously though, the game would even out a great deal, if youd just make a new class of alien, or give gorgs the ability to do mass damage on machines! Because as of now, there is no way to come back from a game where the Marines have captured a hive! Well...as long as the teams are even!
Comments
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<a href="http://www.natural-selection.org/cgi-bin/ikonboard/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=1;t=7748" target="_blank">http://www.natural-selection.org/cgi-bin....;t=7748</a>
Should the marines have only placed few turrets (say two to three), look out for dead angles so only one turret can attack you, and get in with your melee attacks - Bite and Swipe can kill a turret in a few hits, and I won't even start about Onos abilities.
The currently usual turret spamming makes this even easier to some extent: Turrets often block each other way and thus render themselves useless. I have yet to see the room where more than four turrets would really help the marines.
Should you be in the marine base, try to hide behind their buildings - turrets can't shoot through those.
Lerks oftzen can spike turrets from far away.
The two-hive-Lerk ability 'Umbra' could also be called 'Turret killer'. Fly near one, drop an umbracloud, let your fellow aliens get in it, and watch them kill the bugger without of even getting hurt.
Organize attacks of two or ore melee class players (preferably at least one Fade, so you can kill possible Marines), and a Gorge that does nothing but healing.
Build outposts with defense towers so your fellow teammates can hit&run.
Use the Fades Bilebomb as supressive fire while the rest of your team gets in.
Turrets are only invincible if you don't pay attention.
Maybe Your not understanding the Picture!
They attacks you just posted are 3 HIVE ATTACKS! Meaning, you need 3 HIVES to use them! with me so far?
Ok, How are you going to use those attacks when the Marines have taken one of the HIVES? You cant! Read my post and think before replying please!
Oh and Spike Shots take just as long as a Gorg to finish off one turret!
And with all the ITEMs to hide behind! If there is nothing but turrets in the room with the hive, then you can Hide behind them!
Let me guess! Youve never tried that in a room that has 9 Turrets!
That works good vs. one turret! But no effect on many, vs. the ammount of times you die!
hehe, I know the tricks of the trade, specially vs. computer ai! Ive been circle strafeing since DOOM! hehe
Actually, only 2 things he said in his post require 3 hives: Onos and bilebomb.
Every other attack he mentioned is viable at 1 or 2 hives (and believe me, they are all <i>very</i> effective). Maybe you should follow your own advice.
-If there are 10 turrets in a room, a single alien is not going to take them all out, and a single alien will never be designed to be able to take them all out, <i>unless</i> that alien has 3 hives (but even then it's tricky, and generally involves bilebomb).
-If one of your hive rooms is full of turrets, leave it, and destroy the main marine base, because odds are it is not going to be too heavily guarded.
-There's a resource bug. Marines have too many. Once the patch comes, if the marines spend money to fill a room with 10 turrets, you better believe they don't have money for anything else.
-If marines are holed up in your 3rd hive location, destroy their resource nodes. If they have no income, they can't keep placing turrets, and every attack at the hive room will slowly chip away at their defenses.
-Sometimes, you just have to accept that you're in a losing situation. Sorry.
<!--EDIT|Greedo386|Nov. 03 2002,03:49-->
You offered some of your advice, thats nice! That doesnt fix the problem, at hand!
Number 1, you are relying on ODDS!
Have you ever heard that the odds are never in your favor, when you need it!
Your suggestions are nice, IF!!!!
#1 The teams are even. (meaning matched person to person!<!--emo&;)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'><!--endemo-->
#2 The Aliens are actually playing as a team, communicating and all!
#3 The marines arent playing as a team!
Im stating that I do believe ONE ALIEN, MEANING ONE! can take out a room of turrets the smart way! Sniping from afar! If givin the amount of time required, not too long, but long enough for the Marines not to notice, and have the Hive up and running again!
And no!
I dont just lie down and face the Bitter Truths in life! I fight them, with reason!
But a single marine having the firepower to easily take out a pile of 10 alien turrets you must admit seems perhaps a <i>little</i> bit unbalanced?
The Fact is, The Game is Currently Unbalanced! If it werent, then the new patch wouldnt be comeing out! So who are you trying to Fool? Yourself?
Ive been reading alot of the post in these forums and It looks like you and a few others are the only ones who think that the Marines are just as Strong as Aliens! Well, Funny thing is, id say 90 percent of the post, Say something about The Aliens being much weaker than the marines!
Its clear, when the majority say the same thing!
Second, every strategy you'll ever see is based on odds.
If you're a skulk, with no RP left, all hives down, and the rest of your team speculating about the romantic escapades of each others mother instead of playing, no strategy will ever save you.
The suggested strategies include options for every number of hive (although 'dead angle skulking' is of course more difficult than throwing some bilebombs in), and every number of teammates - although, frankly, if you're de facto playing alone against sixteen highly organized marines, I suggest you change the server - the aliens there deserve being defeated.
Also, I'm only a medicore player. Some of the better Playtesters will be able to tell you about some really spaced out stras, such as 'cloak lurking', where you use the minimal movement a cloaked alien can do.
Generally, there is always one solution and be it, as Greedo said, to let the hiveroom be and search for poorly defended spots in the marine mainbase - you can also assault them with two hives, you know?
Also, if the suggestions made appear unfeasable to you, wait a little. The patch should be out very soon and even very much out.
Keep it up!
[edit]A word to alien turrets: They are so damn vulnerable because a) many place them incorrectly (<a href="http://www.natural-selection.org/cgi-bin/ikonboard/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=21;t=7428" target="_blank">see here for some examples on how to do it</a>), and b), because, frankly, they're not supposed to be as effective as marine turrets. They're supposed to be much more of a 'spiked barricade' that keeps the enemy at bay until the real defense - you - can reach the place and attack the attackers.
If you tell me nobody will do that, well, then apparently nobody wants to win.[/edit]
<!--EDIT|Nemesis Zero|Nov. 03 2002,07:38-->
I want to fight the enemy if I wanted to spend all day running/fighting stationary objects i'd play a single player game.
So far this game has loads of potential but its very 1 sided. The marines dont have to try at all, the aliens have it uphill all the way. This is wrong.
I use ! to get a point across! SORRY IF IT BOTHERS YOU!
I will try to use it less, because im considerate of others. Well point being, I dont believe that the game should be over if the marines hold 2 hives. Or even one, but...that is the way it is. There are way to many peeps that believe the same way I do. Now I havent been playing as long as you or G something. I got the game the minute it released on fileplanet and have been playing since then. I never beta tested it, like you and the other guy have, Im sure you all have some great strategies, and what not, I just dont think that those strategies should be nessisary.
I hold myself as an expierience Gamer! Ive been gamming on the comp since Myst and Doom released. Ask yourself this? What multiplayer games out there have survived the trial of time?
Why have they survived?
The answer to the later is BALANCE. Balance is essintial in gamming. The game as of now is UN-Balanced!
I do believe the game has the potential to be another CS, but...It needs some fine tunning first.
Ty for your posts.
NS requires you to learn different strategies to attack your enemy - that's just another skill you have to get, and honestly, I really doubt a game where you wouldn't have to learn anything would be fun for long, because you couldn't improve yourself.
[edit]F*ck, you're invited to come up with a game of asynchron teams, techtrees, and two completely different forms of interface and then balance it out perfectly.
Until then, I'd suggest you realize that none of us got <i>anything</i> but grey hair out of this and shut your piehole. Thanks.[/edit]
<!--EDIT|Nemesis Zero|Nov. 03 2002,07:53-->
I have some skill techniques im working on too for this game. Most of em involve the first two aliens though, seeing that those are usually the only two you end up with. Catch my drift?
I never once said, that the Marines need to be toned down, or decreased in any way, I said that the aliens need an anti turret weapon, in the 1st Hive stage.
Hell man, I have a blast when I play against marines, I just would like to win sometimes, and everyone knows, that has played the game in the last 2 days that the Marines win 90 percent of the time.
Is that Skill? Hell no! that is plain old Unbalance in one form or another!
Damn public servers, maybe one day the cs n00bs will learn proper teamwork!
Though uneven teams and poorly maxed resources don't help either, roll on the patch!
<!--emo&::sentry::--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/turret.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::sentry::'><!--endemo--> > <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/skulk.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::skulk::'><!--endemo--> + <!--emo&::onos::--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tiny.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::onos::'><!--endemo--> + <!--emo&::onos::--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tiny.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::onos::'><!--endemo-->
If the marines can't <i>afford</i> dozens of turrets anymore, they'll be forced to open gaps in their defenses just cause it'd be too costly to close them - which will make it much easier for aliens to kill turrets.
Thinking through it all, I've got to admit that there is no 'real' one-hive anti turret weapon, except the 'heal-bite' combo a builder and two skulks can engage in.
Let's see whether it'll stay an issue - if, we may always discuss ways of changing it.
Yeah, well mostly (if I get on a decent low ping server at all) the commander forgets all about the turrets.
I've had lots of times where me and a squad captured some nozzles and only get the collectors up. No factory, no armory, nothing 'cept the collectors. Then we're ordered (or not, but we got tired of waiting) to move out. Run into a group of three skulks (damn hard to hit any of 'em close up) and get slaughtered. Wonder what happens to the collectors? It's hard to go up against alien sentrys with your lmg.
Oh and dev team... I really love your marine interface marine-commander, it gives every info to the commander! I love to press spacebar and get the troops what they need.
Is there a button to insta-jump to spawn? I always forget to buy new gunz for my trigger happy grunts.
Nothing, nothing at all! No money, no fame, no recognition, just our own pat on the back.
So what servers do you play on, Id like to game with you sometime! Oh and whats your in game name?
mine is [ES]Hisoka and as for servers...any with good ping