Wc3 Strats
fried_rice
Join Date: 2004-09-10 Member: 31582Banned
Join Date: 2004-09-10 Member: 31582Banned
in Off-Topic
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I heard ppl on SC say it but i never knew what it meant. In SC i just massed out 239840928304 hydras and died to probes and cannons <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/sad-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->.
Micro is a leet haxxor art. You need to run all your dragoons back just before they die so that you have the largest number of units attacking for the longest possible time, set up all kinds of giant semi circles, so that the ever so popular starcraft attack stratigy of running in in a giant string seriously gets screwed over by the fact that each unit gets killed as soon as it runs within range. Target all the magic skills perfectly and screw over thier most powerful and threatening units, and generally just control individual units so that it gets the most ammount of attacks in for the least ammount of hitpoints used.
Micro is a leet haxxor art. You need to run all your dragoons back just before they die so that you have the largest number of units attacking for the longest possible time, set up all kinds of giant semi circles, so that the ever so popular starcraft attack stratigy of running in in a giant string seriously gets screwed over by the fact that each unit gets killed as soon as it runs within range. Target all the magic skills perfectly and screw over thier most powerful and threatening units, and generally just control individual units so that it gets the most ammount of attacks in for the least ammount of hitpoints used. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Unfortunatly, that doesn't work in Warcraft 3, as units have hitpoints far above those in Starcraft.
I'm so unhelpful.
Hotkeys are a must.
As well, group your units by type and mass use their abilities. If done with specific spells you won't have spell redundancy. For instance, use of the Polymorph spell of a Sorceress was only enacted by one Sorceress one time, because once the target becomes an animal, it cannot be polymorphed again. This used to be a fun and somewhat vile strat, spamming magic users. But in frozen throne spell breakers decimate that kind of arrogance.
One thing you should start working on first is your build order. What do you build in the first 2 minutes of the game? That can make or break it for you. Never waste your peasants' time. Gold influx has to remain constant yes, but there is no benefit to having a surplus of gold, in fact it can be just as harmful as not having enough gold all the time, but much more insidious in that you don't notice that you are doing yourself a disservice. The Altar should be high on the build order, then the barracks. Depending on what race you are and whether it's worth it to rush with the primary long range ground unit you may or may not want an early lumbermill / lumbermill equivalent. For instance, with humans, dwarven riflemen are all good and well. But Troll Spear throwers? Don't bet on them, as a group of raiders will have 5x the effectiveness. They were monsters back in the days when siege damage applied to regular units and not just buildings.
Also, get that Hero out STAT. The hero's construction takes priority usually. And once he is built, set your barracks to flag the hero, so that newly constructed units will immediately run to where he is. Take care however not to walk him AROUND creeps, because your poor newly produced units will walk right up to the creeps to get to the Hero who is still a few blocks away.
Step 2: Insert Starcraft CD.
Step 3: Let the strategy begin!
1v1 is best.
5 Peons (the other five will be harvesting gold).
When the first peon pops out, get that altar going stat!
When the second pops out, get a barracks going.
Third, Mill.
Fourth, Burrow.
Fifth, harvest lumber near to the mill.
Get out at least four burrows. Array them around your hall so that your gold miners are covered (burrows can allow peons to bunker in and attack).
Once your first burrow is up though, make sure that your hero is picked stat! I usually prefer the far seer due to his chain lightning. It's devastating against creeps and the spirit wolves can come in handy as an aid.
Get three grunts going asap. Once you have your hero and three grunts, go creeping.
Build your other burrows in the meantime
Once your mill is up and your out creeping, invest in upgrades. Upgrades will make your units many times more effective then simply zerging.
Also, dont forget to build a voodoo lounge. This building is essentially a repository for items that can be useful, such as healing salves and mana potions etc. At town hall level three (Fortress) you can purchse an orb of lightning. Very powerful.
Once your second burrow comes up, pump out another two grunts and two spear throwers. Go for more creeping, research Pillage and upgrade your hall.
Once you get hero level 2 or 3, it's time to move on the offensive. Raid your enemy, but dont stick around! Harrass him and wear him down. The scroll of town portal can be your friend if your base is getting hit.
As soon as your hall has come up to a strong hold, get a chieftain. His endurance aura is pwnage and war stomp can be devastating to enemy troops, though shockwave can also be very beneficial depending on what your proficient with.
From here you can go in any number of directions. You can go down the caster route, which includes shamans and bloodlust, Trolls and their healing wards, or you can get the new spellcaster (cant remember name atm) that has chain spirit. Basically any damage on a specific unit is distributed evenly to all others (COMMUNISTS! ZOMG!) which can keep strong and weak units alive for longer.
Alternatively you can go down the bestiary route, which gives you raiders and Kodos as well as Wind Riders (wyverns) and Troll Bat riders.
Kodos will augment the damage your troops dole out, whilst raiders provide mobile sieging platforms. Pillage will give you an enourmous income if your constantly on the offense, whilst spikes will give your buildings a passive defensive trait. The Troll beserker upgrade provides an extra one hundred hitpoints and gives them the beserk ability, whilst Berserker strength will make your grunts tougher and deal an extra three damage.
The weaknesses of the horde lie in that their air forces are not as good as say the humans or the night elves. They make up for this with their raiders ability to ensnare air units but it does not close the margin nearly enough. Dont let your enemy mass air units on you.
I suggest going in a 3 on 3 environment. That way your allies can back you up. If you still have difficulty, try giving your opponents a handicap by setting them from "100%" down to say, "70%" and working your way up gradually.
As others have said, hotkeys are a must.
I warn you though, the above strats dont work very well on Battle.net. Against the AI it works well enough but against a human it just doesnt work out as well.
And if anyone has been on the battle.net forums, all people do is create senseless spam and troll for pages on end.
1v1 is best. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
My brother has this problem. Once you start deluding yourself into thinking you are learning from playing 4v4, you lose sight of what real skill is and you become adverse to playing 1on1's. Don't make the same mistake Rice.
Oh and Cronos' strategy is awesome, but be prepared for a weakness to AIR early on, if someone rushes for air and manages it. As he probably mentioned, (I didn't check through the entire thing because I know the pattern). A good way to counter air is to get raiders but they won't do the job alone. What helps is Shaman spam. However with frozen throne, many other combinations are possible.
If you outnumber the enemy and a melee unit of yours is low on health, pull it out and put it in the back of the pack. Healing a unit is generally better than building a new one.
If you have ranged units, set them to a separate group than your meleers and use them to mass target units like Kodo Beasts or undead Necromancers. Dropping a few key units early on is pretty much always the difference between victory and defeat.
Don't be afraid to use mana. If your Hero isn't regenerating mana at the end of a battle, you probably didn't use it enough. Keep some in reserve just in case, but Hero abilities can turn the tide many a time.
Units like the abovementioned Kodo that have special abilities should be using them as much as possible. Devour in particular can be extremely effective, removing one (small) unit from the battlefield no matter the HP. Many spells are also extremely useful in combat.
Attack move! Never ever tell all your melee units to attack one unit in a pack, as they will swarm around being useless most of the time. Tell meleers to attack move against the enemy so that they are all at least attacking something, and use your ranged troops to pick off specific targets.
Don't be afraid to disengage and run for a bit, either. Especially if you have reinforcements on the way or in training, running away can be used as a tactical move very effectively against the computer. It doesn't watch for ambushes very well, and if you can surround a computer squad (especially on Easy) it will end up attempting to run away and just get pounded back over and over again. It also charges cheerfully into areas heavily defended by towers, although it usually realizes its mistake and retreats... see above.
"BANG! HEADSHOT"
Just try to use your resources in a good way, keep speed, know you're hotkeys"
Expand & conquer, do some creeping with your Hero.
Btw you're not the only one, I suck as well @ WC3, damn foodlimit of 90 and those pathetic hero's destroying my lil army with their superior micro!!!11.
I heard ppl on SC say it but i never knew what it meant. In SC i just massed out 239840928304 hydras and died to probes and cannons . <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sorry to laugh at your misfortune but that quote is GOLD. Primary because WC3 is ALL micro.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->do some creeping with your Hero.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The other piece of advice I would give is look at replays of good players (they are easy to find, ESPECIALLY for SC) and just start copying their movements. I would say that's the best way to learn how to play.
Can you imagine the general of an army going up to each private and saying, "you! shoot him. you! shoot HIM. you! fall back." etc etc. you're commanding the whole war, you're supposed to have better things to do.
it becomes less strategy and more a clickfest, in which case I'd rather play a FPS.
Micro-Management is about as hard as "OMG NEED MORE GUN DRONZ 4 MEH TANKZ0RS!"
The former because of it's complete lack of anything resembling strategy, and the latter because, well, you don't micromanage, you <i>command</i>, the way it should be in my opinion.
Well, I did win one game of StarCraft against two noobish Terran players. They teamed up against me, but by the time they decided to rush me with like 100 Vultures and Goliaths I have covered most of the map in photon cannons and I sent 12 carriers to each of their bases. I believe the last thing I said was "Wow you guys must REALLY suck if I beat you!"
oh... wait... WARCRAFT... okay..
nvm...
You can adapt my above strat to almost any race.
With humans...
5 Peasents, lumber mill, altar, barracks, farm, farm, set peasent to lumber, another farm, set next peasent to lumber, get Paladin (awesome hero) and five footmen, build blacksmith, go creeping with pally and 5 footmen etc etc.
For a second hero for humans, I'd say that the firelord is pretty damn good. Actually I'd say the firelord can pretty much replace certain heroes entirely with that passive damage ability and lava spawn. Soulburn is also quite useful against powerful creeps/monsters.
You have to:
-Get resources (Sure np.)
-Build a base (Np either.)
-Get some troops (Duh I wanna crush someone.)
-Train a Hero (What?! this is a RTS, no wait it's WC3 and it's RTS/RPG -_-.)
-Know all those units their abilities/weaknesses/strengts (Waaay to much to learn.)
-With micro you can really own!!1 (humpf, do I really have to give orders ALL the time to keep my units alive and kill the opposition?)
It's... just way to much to do, I find SC to be easier, more balanced, no friggin CRAPPY 3d graphics that require a good PC to run on, no weird Hero system (keep those hero's in Diablo and WoW, thank you.)
/Me had a lot of fun playing at a m8's house where he has a few 486's/Pentium 1's, so we invite some friends, and go play SC!
</rant>