<!--QuoteBegin-Bo Selecta+Nov 10 2004, 05:28 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Bo Selecta @ Nov 10 2004, 05:28 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> The politicians always seemed to ignore the issue and anyone who even -dared- to speak of an immigration problem was immediately labeled a 'nazi' or 'an extreme rightwing nazi'. So nothing happened and the whole thing escalated. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> And this is the core of the problem right here, when ever anyone does try and address the issue, which is bound to offend someone, they are shouted down by the extreme left...who often have power over media control of said situation, and labeled as racists and Nazis.
America has the same problem with Hispanics, while it is certainly not as bad as what seems to be going on in Holland, America is also a much larger country so its even harder to tell or generalize what effect immigration is having. I think we all know it's an issue, one that we are all painfully aware of, yet politicians on both sides ignore it or come up with unfavorable middle of the rode "solutions".
<a href='http://www.npg.org/factsheets/imm_americans_spoken.html' target='_blank'>It is obvious what the American people want </a>, yet nothing is done because politicians fear, with good reason, that their careers well be destroyed if they try and change things.
A recent TIME article on immigration, and the responses given two issues latter I think sum up the average Americans opinion on the situation. It's a read I recommend to everyone.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I wish it was more clear that this is mostly an immigration issue even though it has been painted with the colors of international politics.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't think very many people would disagree with that. I also never said that Muslim culture was the problem. I don't think Bo Selecta said anything to that extent either. On the contrary, the thrust of my post was that efforts at integration have been poor on both sides of the fence. That's not a problem <i>inherent</i> to either culture, but it is starting to worm itself into them.
All I'm saying is I think you're a little too impressed with France. According to a lot of people, the country doing the best job of dealing with it - likely due to their longer history of dealing with immigration in general - has been the UK. And again, I think you would very probably see some of the same problems in France as you're seeing in the Netherlands if a muslim murdered a well-known and well-liked French celebrity.
GrendelAll that is fear...Join Date: 2002-07-19Member: 970Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, NS2 Playtester
<!--QuoteBegin-(e)kent+Nov 9 2004, 05:13 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> ((e)kent @ Nov 9 2004, 05:13 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> A large Muslim population is not the problem. If you can't see that I won't bother debating it. Look at France for a positive example. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I wouldn't pick France as an example. Not unless I was looking for a country which was seeing a rise in nationalist politics and hate crimes. But perhaps the problems of France are greatly over-emphasised by their media and election results.
Comments
So nothing happened and the whole thing escalated.
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
And this is the core of the problem right here, when ever anyone does try and address the issue, which is bound to offend someone, they are shouted down by the extreme left...who often have power over media control of said situation, and labeled as racists and Nazis.
America has the same problem with Hispanics, while it is certainly not as bad as what seems to be going on in Holland, America is also a much larger country so its even harder to tell or generalize what effect immigration is having.
I think we all know it's an issue, one that we are all painfully aware of, yet politicians on both sides ignore it or come up with unfavorable middle of the rode "solutions".
<a href='http://www.npg.org/factsheets/imm_americans_spoken.html' target='_blank'>It is obvious what the American people want </a>, yet nothing is done because politicians fear, with good reason, that their careers well be destroyed if they try and change things.
A recent TIME article on immigration, and the responses given two issues latter I think sum up the average Americans opinion on the situation. It's a read I recommend to everyone.
I don't think very many people would disagree with that. I also never said that Muslim culture was the problem. I don't think Bo Selecta said anything to that extent either. On the contrary, the thrust of my post was that efforts at integration have been poor on both sides of the fence. That's not a problem <i>inherent</i> to either culture, but it is starting to worm itself into them.
All I'm saying is I think you're a little too impressed with France. According to a lot of people, the country doing the best job of dealing with it - likely due to their longer history of dealing with immigration in general - has been the UK. And again, I think you would very probably see some of the same problems in France as you're seeing in the Netherlands if a muslim murdered a well-known and well-liked French celebrity.
I wouldn't pick France as an example. Not unless I was looking for a country which was seeing a rise in nationalist politics and hate crimes. But perhaps the problems of France are greatly over-emphasised by their media and election results.